Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Hawkfrost]

The main character SPECIFICALLY told that their technique can cripple them and render them incapable of moving for the rest of their lives? I have YET to see an anime actually follow through with this.

Spoiler: FMA:B? (click to show/hide)

Human transmutation permanently cripples people in some way or another, despite many of them managing to restore some form of functionality through workarounds. Everyone who does it loses something permanently unless they sacrifice something even larger (like the lives of other humans) to get it back (Roy is probably the most excellent example of this, since without use of the stone to give him his eyes back there would have been no way for him to restore any form of functionality in that sense). It also comes into play when Pride forces human transmutation; permanently destroying his own container shortly afterwards, rendering him powerless.

That said the fact that this happens prior to the actual story as opposed to much during the story itself could semi-disqualify it from your opinion.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Well, they still don't follow through on it; the main cast all conveniently are able to solve their disabilities and move on with no permanent consequences through the power of magic just to end on a happy note.

Stories rarely end with the hero losing a leg or an arm or a family member and having it stay that way at the end, which would probably be a better message. Yes, it might be depressing, but ultimately it's better to tell the audience that even in victory there will be sacrifices you have to make and loss instead of convincing people that somehow there will be a magical way to make everything better. Doing so seriously cheapens any emotions you tried to draw out of your viewers, and illegitimatizes your drama and your conflict.

[Frumple]

Can illegitimatize. Not necessarily. It's not exactly difficult to have the conflict and the drama hinge on other things.

Certainly I wouldn't call what you're talking about to be a significant point vis a vis the anime in question -- near as I can recall those were only disabilities and sacrifices occasionally, and were mostly just somewhat edgy excuses for superpowers :V

Which should be okay. You can still have a nice story with all the bells and whistles with barely acknowledged edgy superpowers. Sometimes it's fine if parts of the backstory et al are just kinda' there.

... doing it the other way is also be about the quickest way to get me to stop watching something, though, heh. For me, hammering the nail that the world is terrible and success only comes through suffering for the Nth hundredth time cheapens any emotion they were trying to draw out, just as well. When I want shitty messages of that sort alongside the rest of the narrative I go watch the news or read the classics.* It's nice to see folks shucking those influences, to whatever degree, y'know? Doesn't cheapen the emotions involved, it just emphasizes other ones. Which is often quite nice. I like those emotions better, and human brains being what they are we really do need more of them in our lives to offset the inclination towards negative one, imo.

*I rarely watch the news and you would probably have to shoot me to get me to go back to reading classical literature, and probably shortly thereafter have to stop me from shooting myself.

[Zangi]

The main character SPECIFICALLY told that their technique can cripple them and render them incapable of moving for the rest of their lives? I have YET to see an anime actually follow through with this.

Spoiler: FMA:B? (click to show/hide)

Human transmutation permanently cripples people in some way or another, despite many of them managing to restore some form of functionality through workarounds. Everyone who does it loses something permanently unless they sacrifice something even larger (like the lives of other humans) to get it back (Roy is probably the most excellent example of this, since without use of the stone to give him his eyes back there would have been no way for him to restore any form of functionality in that sense). It also comes into play when Pride forces human transmutation; permanently destroying his own container shortly afterwards, rendering him powerless.

That said the fact that this happens prior to the actual story as opposed to much during the story itself could semi-disqualify it from your opinion.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Well, they still don't follow through on it; the main cast all conveniently are able to solve their disabilities and move on with no permanent consequences through the power of magic just to end on a happy note.

Stories rarely end with the hero losing a leg or an arm or a family member and having it stay that way at the end, which would probably be a better message. Yes, it might be depressing, but ultimately it's better to tell the audience that even in victory there will be sacrifices you have to make and loss instead of convincing people that somehow there will be a magical way to make everything better. Doing so seriously cheapens any emotions you tried to draw out of your viewers, and illegitimatizes your drama and your conflict.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The series kinda revolved around those 2 brother's journey to find that magical fix.  And dealing with the horrifying implications behind that.  I don't think it cheapened it, at least in this series.  Its the journey that counts here.

[Jopax]

Hell, saying FMA doesn't do that stuff properly is basically ignoring pretty much all of the side characters who're dealing with the same stuff. I mean, it's the freaking point of the show to shove the equivalent exchange rule in your face as the one and only explanation for when shit goes south. Because people didn't respect that one rule and got stupid/greedy/whatever and tried to break it.

Anyways, seeing as M:Delta was not my cup of tea I went searching for a MSG series I could watch and figured I might as well watch SEED since that seemed ok. About a third of the way trough the frist season, it's pretty ok considering it's age. It has its issues and quirks but nothing too terrible really. Also I love the attention to detail and the little things, tho that's kind of a thing I've noticed with all MGS series I've seen so far. But I guess that's what you get for doing what is essentially a rather realistic series with just a dash of rule-of-cool

[Flying Dice]

Oh, this descent is going to be fun to watch. Make sure to follow up by watching SEED Destiny.

[Frumple]

C'mon FD, it's going to be bad enough as is. No need to be cruel.

[Furtuka]

Oh dear

[Andres]

Note that the samurai and steam gun randos don't flip around, it's just Mumei who's a superhumanly strong professional zombie killer. It's justified flipping.

Forgot to respond to this, but it's not justified. That she can't fight if she gets tired is a well established fact, so doing all these superhuman stunts and jumps is just unnecessarily lowering the amount of time she can stay in the fight. Later on in the same episode, Main Character criticises a Kabane for its too-large movements. Yes, Mumei is physically capable of doing the flipping, but all logic and common sense dictates she shouldn't.

[Culise]

Oh, this descent is going to be fun to watch. Make sure to follow up by watching SEED Destiny.

C'mon FD, it's going to be bad enough as is. No need to be cruel.

Oh dear

[Hawkfrost]

The main character SPECIFICALLY told that their technique can cripple them and render them incapable of moving for the rest of their lives? I have YET to see an anime actually follow through with this.

Spoiler: FMA:B? (click to show/hide)

Human transmutation permanently cripples people in some way or another, despite many of them managing to restore some form of functionality through workarounds. Everyone who does it loses something permanently unless they sacrifice something even larger (like the lives of other humans) to get it back (Roy is probably the most excellent example of this, since without use of the stone to give him his eyes back there would have been no way for him to restore any form of functionality in that sense). It also comes into play when Pride forces human transmutation; permanently destroying his own container shortly afterwards, rendering him powerless.

That said the fact that this happens prior to the actual story as opposed to much during the story itself could semi-disqualify it from your opinion.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Well, they still don't follow through on it; the main cast all conveniently are able to solve their disabilities and move on with no permanent consequences through the power of magic just to end on a happy note.

Stories rarely end with the hero losing a leg or an arm or a family member and having it stay that way at the end, which would probably be a better message. Yes, it might be depressing, but ultimately it's better to tell the audience that even in victory there will be sacrifices you have to make and loss instead of convincing people that somehow there will be a magical way to make everything better. Doing so seriously cheapens any emotions you tried to draw out of your viewers, and illegitimatizes your drama and your conflict.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The series kinda revolved around those 2 brother's journey to find that magical fix.  And dealing with the horrifying implications behind that.  I don't think it cheapened it, at least in this series.  Its the journey that counts here.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I mean it in the sense of during the ending when Roy gets blinded I said "Well, that's not going to matter because they have philosopher's stones." And then when Al transmutes himself I said "That's also not going to matter, because he's not going to stay 'dead'." That kind of thing.
It kills any sense of tension, at least for me personally, when I know there isn't going to be permanent consequences.

Hell, saying FMA doesn't do that stuff properly is basically ignoring pretty much all of the side characters who're dealing with the same stuff. I mean, it's the freaking point of the show to shove the equivalent exchange rule in your face as the one and only explanation for when shit goes south. Because people didn't respect that one rule and got stupid/greedy/whatever and tried to break it.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

And then at the end they have a workaround anyway that lets them break the equivalent exchange rule, making it essentially meaningless as a lesson.
"Pursuing unlimited power is foolish and dangerous, and only leads to sorrow" is left a bit hollow when they eventually solve all their problems by finding a tool of unlimited power and using it precisely in the way that people told them was wrong.

It's still a show I really enjoyed watching in any case.

[Orange Wizard]

A comparison of anime streaming sites

[Cruxador]

I just saw Project Itoh: Harmony this evening. I had a good time, but not because the movie was good. It had some really beautiful scenes, and some that weren't so good; it wasn't consistent. The neuroscience was complete and utter bullshit, which killed my suspension of disbelief since it was central to the whole latter half of the movie. And part of the backstory was that

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

the main villain/love interest was born without a soul but later got one due to being raped a whole bunch.

Also, it was adapted from a book and like 90% of the dialogue was narration or soliloquy.

Still, it was fun to go with my brother to an old theater in town, and see something that we knew very little about going into, and which few other people will see in that way.

[Jopax]

Ok that's fucking worrying now, does it devolve into shitty teenage drama? Because right now that's the only thing I see as being likely to happen. Well that or they just keep introducing cool new people for Kira to fight even though you don't really want them to fight since they're cool people. Or does it go the nonsense bullshit route of Evangelion because that space whale thing could be important in some way later on.

@Hawkfrost

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

But they don't (unless I'm remembering wrongly, been a while since I've seen it), the stones themselves while allowing for the apparent breaking of the rule still follow it because they are made of souls. So it's not you who's paying the price, it's some poor sod who you turned into alchemy fuel. If anything, that makes it even more horrible and drives the point of equivalent exchange even further. That the only way to get around the rule is to use other people to pay the price in your stead.

[Frumple]

It devolves alright, heeheehee. Don't recall it just being shitty teenage drama, though.

Still, lay back, watch the show, and think of England. Approach it without the preconceptions of people that's already watched (some of) it.

Though for what it's worth, I'm pretty sure everyone here will at least agree it's better than Destiny! It's got that going for it. And it's got a fair amount of interesting bits! Just... well, you'll see, if you keep watching.

[Jopax]

Fair enough, think you guys saying it goes bad will probably colour my perception more than a bit tho :V

Hell, I had no idea 00 was apparently terrible until I read what other people thought of it :s