Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Putnam]

It is like saying Goku doesn't work as a protagonist because he is invincible. Your status as "Invincible" only goes as far as the plot allows it.

I dunno, I don't like Goku as a protagonist because of the ridiculous power escalation. I mean, there's only so many universes you can annihilate by sneezing before it becomes passé.

Although admittedly that's more of a gripe with the story's structure overall.

the first time goku actually destroyed anything was in one of the recent (last few months) episodes of super, and i honestly doubt you've watched that

the power escalation was vague as hell in-story up until super, toriyama never really did anything to show off the power, just sorta made them more powerful than each other incrementally

dragon ball GT and dragon ball super actually both did that sorta weirdly, GT by showing off how powerful the final villain was by blowing up a city (which nappa did at the start of dbz, but lol gt) and super by having beerus and goku punch each other hard enough to nearly destroy the universe

[Neonivek]

IDK if "dumb" was true of traditional hero literature. Perhaps only of 20th century literature, e.g. Conan. But he's clearly an anti-hero. And another example might be Don Quixote, but he's also clearly seen as an anti-hero. In superhero comics I can only think of heroes such as Hulk and The Thing, but those are clearly not meant to be traditional-type heroes either.

Samson... is a traditional hero... and he is as dumb as a post.

Achilles also traditional hero... also dumb as a post.

The idea that a hero must be super smart is more of a modern invention. Wise (aka intelligent as there was no real difference) was a heroic trait... but being dumb wasn't a anti-heroic trait.

It is like saying Goku doesn't work as a protagonist because he is invincible. Your status as "Invincible" only goes as far as the plot allows it.

I dunno, I don't like Goku as a protagonist because of the ridiculous power escalation. I mean, there's only so many universes you can annihilate by sneezing before it becomes passé.

Although admittedly that's more of a gripe with the story's structure overall.

super by having beerus and goku punch each other hard enough to nearly destroy the universe

In some fairness... it isn't so much that the attack is so powerful that it will physically destroy the universe.

So much that the universe seems to have a physical law that states that if Beerus gets met on with equal physical power, without it being contained, it will destroy the universe.

Since Goku in Dragon Ball Super is visably weaker then Goku at... actually the end of the Freiza Saga.

[Putnam]

iirc odysseus was pretty smart, or at the very least clever, even if he did, uh, intentionally deal with greek gods a lot

[Execute/Dumbo.exe]

It is like saying Goku doesn't work as a protagonist because he is invincible. Your status as "Invincible" only goes as far as the plot allows it.

I dunno, I don't like Goku as a protagonist because of the ridiculous power escalation. I mean, there's only so many universes you can annihilate by sneezing before it becomes passé.

Although admittedly that's more of a gripe with the story's structure overall.

the first time goku actually destroyed anything was in one of the recent (last few months) episodes of super, and i honestly doubt you've watched that

the power escalation was vague as hell in-story up until super, toriyama never really did anything to show off the power, just sorta made them more powerful than each other incrementally

dragon ball GT and dragon ball super actually both did that sorta weirdly, GT by showing off how powerful the final villain was by blowing up a city (which nappa did at the start of dbz, but lol gt) and super by having beerus and goku punch each other hard enough to nearly destroy the universe

I specifically remember Cell going "Hahaha Goku would never fire that Kamehameha that would blow up the planet!" and Frieza also proved totally capable of doing the same thing if he actually went all out, but by that mark Goku should have destroyed at least of good chunk of earth when he fought Frieza for the second time.

[Neonivek]

iirc odysseus was pretty smart, or at the very least clever, even if he did, uh, intentionally deal with greek gods a lot

Yeah he is under "Wise hero"

But what I mean is that Dumb is just as much a traditional hero trait as smart.

Though really "heroic traits" should sort of advance with the time. I don't really accept "Traditional hero traits" under hero or anti-hero to an extent (since the idea of a pure and good hero is still... an idea even if they are rare).

Though dumb is part of Japan's Heroic character trait... As it is part of their idea of being pure.

I know the term! Heroic Flaw! yes... Even flaws can be heroic xD

[Flying Dice]

iirc odysseus was pretty smart, or at the very least clever, even if he did, uh, intentionally deal with greek gods a lot

Cunning but unwise, yeah?

[Culise]

iirc odysseus was pretty smart, or at the very least clever, even if he did, uh, intentionally deal with greek gods a lot

Cunning but unwise, yeah?

Yep.  Intelligent and guileful but quite hubristic, though to be fair more than a few of his more problematic encounters with the gods ended up blamed on his sailors (opening the bag of the winds from Aeolus; eating Helios' cattle).  He did better when it was under circumstances where the gods favored him, such as Athena and to a lesser degree Hermes.

Also, while I haven't read as much of Howard's works as I probably should at some point, I was also under the impression that Conan was also intelligent as well, especially in the fields of strategy, tactics, and linguistics.  His problem is that he not only looked the part of the opposite, consistently fought magicians who carried the stereotypical appearance of the intelligent villain which gave the movies a veneer of "brawn versus brute," and also that he inspired a whole genre of idiot brutes that are what he superficially resembled. 

[JoshuaFH]

I picked up Oruchuban Ebichu. Jesus Christ is it a raunchy, funny show. Every episode knows exactly how to end to leave me in stitches and wanting more.

[Flying Dice]

iirc odysseus was pretty smart, or at the very least clever, even if he did, uh, intentionally deal with greek gods a lot

Cunning but unwise, yeah?

Yep.  Intelligent and guileful but quite hubristic, though to be fair more than a few of his more problematic encounters with the gods ended up blamed on his sailors (opening the bag of the winds from Aeolus; eating Helios' cattle).  He did better when it was under circumstances where the gods favored him, such as Athena and to a lesser degree Hermes.

Also, while I haven't read as much of Howard's works as I probably should at some point, I was also under the impression that Conan was also intelligent as well, especially in the fields of strategy, tactics, and linguistics.  His problem is that he not only looked the part of the opposite, consistently fought magicians who carried the stereotypical appearance of the intelligent villain which gave the movies a veneer of "brawn versus brute," and also that he inspired a whole genre of idiot brutes that are what he superficially resembled.

Oh, yeah. Source Conan was very much a guile hero, and he didn't spend all his time half-naked either.

[Frumple]

Was about to mention that myself, ha. Conan was, indeed, basically pretty damn smart -- one of the canniest characters in the stories he was involved in. For all he carried the title of barbarian, dude obviously took a few levels of rogue somewhere in there :V

[miauw62]

Yup, the joke is that he's in a serious series but everything about Saitama is half-assed, even the artwork for him is lazily done and doesn't match the rest of the art.

Another show which I'm enjoying is Teekyu. (2 minutes per episode), it has a similar sloppy-art gag in which the OP animation was made much more sloppily than the show itself (but still cramming in all the dancing and action you get in a normal OP). It's clearly a joke about the normal priorities in production values.

What does OP animation mean? A quick Google search isn't turning up anything.

[Orange Wizard]

OP is short for opening in context of anime. So he means the animation in the opening sequence.

[apiks]

Am I the only one that isn't particularly impressed by One Punch Man's OP? On the other hand I'm loving Noragami Aragoto's.

[Sirus]

Am I the only one that isn't particularly impressed by One Punch Man's OP?

...are you talking about the opening theme, or the one-punches?

[apiks]

Am I the only one that isn't particularly impressed by One Punch Man's OP?

...are you talking about the opening theme, or the one-punches?

Heh, sorry for not being clear. I was referring to the opening song, as that was the flow of the conversation.