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[Cthulhu]

What really makes it interesting, is it seems they lack any danger-avoidance mechanism other than running from enemies when they aren't in the military, but they experience a lot of grief when someone else dies.

[Qmarx]

Virtues - The purpose of a knife is to cut, thus the virtue of it is sharpness. The virtues of people are honesty, compassion, hardworking, etc. What are the virtues of the dwarves in DF?

Not sure about the dwarves, but the virtue of a carp is to kill.

[mainiac]

Dwarf fortress is all about virtue ethics IMHO, in fact it's virtue ethics which make dwarf fortress dwarf fortress in the first place as opposed to human mine or gnomish village.  Dwarves as seen in popular fantasy are creatures with an incredibly strong sense of virtue ethics.  Like Catholic guilt on steroids, dwarven virtue fundementally guides their thought and development process.  The steadfast, down to earth image of dwarves we have reflects on our perspective of what a race of creatures with such a powerful sense of virtue ethics would be like.

What's interesting is how dwarf fortress pushes beyond the traditional virtue ethics of dwarves in fantasy.  Players are compelled by the pursuit of dwarfiness to go beyond mere existence or prosperity.  The notion emerges that one should constantly seek virtue, even in challenges merely set to demonstrate said virtue.  Life is nothing but the seeking of virtue and life is seen through the lens of virtue.  The previously mentioned suicidal attack would be a failure in any other game, but in the virtue ethics guided Dwarf Fortress, it is awesome.

[LumenPlacidum]

The virtues espoused by dwarf fortress, by my eye, are the following: production and ambition.

A dwarf that doesn't produce is not held to be valuable.  Excluding the rare examples of the ones we reward simply because they challenge the idea of needing to be valuable (like the Philosopher), useless dwarfs are redirected towards tasks that produce something for the fortress.  That task might be the "production" of safety through weapons training.  Consider the crimes in dwarf fortress.  A dwarf can be punished for one of several reasons.  These are the destruction of some element of the fortress, attacking someone of the fortress, or by failing to produce.  Destroying some element of the fortress is negative production and is unacceptable by dwarf standards.  Attacking someone is punishable because it both destroys potential productive capacity and it takes time away from productive capacity to do this (to differentiate this concept from simply sending people to their deaths).  Finally, failing to produce causes a generic punishment for the fortress.  Blame for a failure of this kind is laid upon the fortress as a whole, lending a strong communal sense to the fortress.

The second virtue of a dwarf is ambition.  Dwarfs always produce the best quality items they can.  When a dwarf is seized by a vision of a glorious production, they will break their minds trying to accomplish that vision.  Many dwarfs that do manage to fulfill their visions are rewarded with legendary status, which is frequently accorded additional benefits (which removal from the economy is supposed to allow).  Ambition is the drive that makes the dwarfs build needlessly complicated structures regardless of danger.  Having ambition rewarded by success and then having it taken away is enough to snap a dwarf, as indicated by the masterwork destruction tantrums.  Nobles, the flawless paragons of dwarf society, impart their productive ambitions on the fortress and are recognized for the wisdom therein.

I do not consider obedience to be a virtue of a dwarf because it is absolutely an ingrained characteristic of dwarfs.  There's no such thing as a disobedient dwarf.  Mad dwarfs are no longer really dwarfs and fail to be part of the fortress as a whole.  This is why the other dwarfs attack to destroy mad dwarfs.  The sense of community is, likewise, a simple property of dwarfs.  All dwarfs work for the common good, as dictated by the playerdwarf and nobles (in their infinite wisdom).  Even the dwarfs that sacrifice other dwarfs (fell moods) do so for the sake of production and ambition, which are held of greater importance.  Dwarfs will gladly give their lives for the chance of impressing the playerdwarf with their errant, unarmed, unskilled heroics against the pit of giant cave spiders.

[Dareon Clearwater]

Nobles, the flawless paragons of dwarf society, impart their productive ambitions on the fortress and are recognized for the wisdom therein.

I laughed, but from a certain standpoint, that is an accurate statement.  If one happens to go by the theory of the divine right of kings, then what we have is a literal deus ex machina in the form of the random number generator, granting the lowly peasants a vision of wisdom and mental health the likes of which they could never begin to comprehend.  If such a being demands trifle pewter socks, it must be part of a divine plan that will become apparent in time, leading towards a more perfect fortress.

Alternatively, bear in mind that 80% (at a generous estimate) of medieval rulers were inbred morons.  It really makes the mandates easier to take if you picture your Baron drooling into his -plump helmet spawn stew-, mumbling something about shiny things, and contentedly soiling himself.

[McDoomhammer]

Augh!  Don't!  I like my mayor.  Even if she does want windows.

[Muz]

The virtues espoused by dwarf fortress, by my eye, are the following: production and ambition.

That is just brilliant! I'm not completely sure about ambition, but production is just perfect. It explains where 'useless' dwarves are drafted into the military. It explains why mandates can be so important. It explains why a dwarf kills himself or flies into an insane rage if he fails to create an artifact. I suppose it's comparable to 20th century Japan culture.

I think compassion also works, because they do help their friends and they feel very sad for when a pet or friend dies. And they're happy to throw parties and stuff.

Obedience seems to be a bit ethical, because, as you say, "This is why the other dwarfs attack to destroy mad dwarfs." I think dwarves are bound to have full confidence in their leaders, which is why so many dwarven leaders are so corrupt. They believe that whatever their leader tells them to do has to be the best decision. After all, 7 unarmed dorfs wrestling with cave spiders are more successful than having 4 who do and 3 who disobey the crazy order.

Bravery is somewhat forced upon them, because they're not capable of feeling scared. Bravery is not the lack of fear, it is doing the right thing when scared.

[Skyrage]

Bravery is somewhat forced upon them, because they're not <I>capable</I> of feeling scared yet. Bravery is not the lack of fear, it is doing the right thing when scared.

Fixed your sentence a bit.

Also, why do you have to be scared in order to be brave?

[Muz]

Heh, yeah

Well, it's not a positive value unless there's a reason to be otherwise. Like, you don't say that some robots better for being hardworking and obedient because they just do what they're told, but you do say that employees and pets are good for being obedient. Likewise, you can't say that dwarves are brave, because they don't have the capability of turning around and running. Not being scared at all doesn't mean bravery, it's stupidity :p Like when a lone, naked dwarf charges into an army of goblins and dies very quickly.

[Skyrage]

But if that lone, naked dwarf charged in and that act happened to save the rest of his comrades, then what?

Compare it to a war-scenario in movies which is rather cliché, some tough guy stays behind and sacrifices his life in order to save his men. That's pretty stupid as well isn't it? But brave at the same time regardless of being afraid or not.

Whether a dwarf has a choice or not, we will still usually perceive suicide rushes as acts of "bravery". Well, assuming that dwarf actually gets a few kills

[Micr0]

As I've written about a month or two ago, I'm doing my ethics assignment on DF. But looking at it from ethical frameworks, there are some things I'm not so sure about.

Duty - this is what a dwarf is ethically inclined by duty to do. It's also what the player has the duty to do for the dwarves. Couldn't find this one.

Virtues - The purpose of a knife is to cut, thus the virtue of it is sharpness. The virtues of people are honesty, compassion, hardworking, etc. What are the virtues of the dwarves in DF?

Rights - This is what every dwarf (player, animal, goblin, etc) has the right to. I put it as every dwarf having the right to live, and the right to happiness, regardless of how they are becoming happy.

Not in my book.

[puke]

are dwarf virtues not emblazened on the title screen?

Histories of Greed and Toil?  Averice and Cupidity?  Jealousy and Dynamism? Gluttony and Industry?  Exertion and Dilligence?

[Mephansteras]

I think those are supposed to be descriptors for the tales that come from the game, not virtues for the dwarves themselves.

[McDoomhammer]

I think those are supposed to be descriptors for the tales that come from the game, not virtues for the dwarves themselves.

True enough, but it's still an intriguing point.

Muz, do you intend to explore how much of this is the creator's intent, versus to what extent ethics emerge from the gameplay?

Also, the reason you have to be scared in order to be brave is that bravery means overcoming your own fear, mastering yourself.  Just not fearing a genuine threat is stupidity or insanity, not courage.

[LumenPlacidum]

But if that lone, naked dwarf charged in and that act happened to save the rest of his comrades, then what?

I think almost any player here would reward a dwarf that manages to, against all odds, tackle the toughest challenges and come out alive.  So, they'd be well-rewarded for the ambition that paid off.