Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: 1 2 [3]

Author Topic: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress  (Read 3886 times)

Marlowe

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #30 on: October 14, 2008, 12:40:48 am »


Alternatively, bear in mind that 80% (at a generous estimate) of medieval rulers were vicious, ruthless, professional killers who'd butcher their own relatives to get a longer run at the top. 

fixed it for you. I don't know who you're thinking of, if you have a precise target at all; but most medieval dynasties I'm familiar with would have loved to stay near the top long enough for in-breeding to be an issue.

Logged

RavingManiac

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #31 on: October 14, 2008, 03:54:03 am »

If I were you, Muz, I'd try to write about the value of DF as a simulator, and what one could learn from it to relate to actual leaders:


-Many players will happily kill nobles, cripples and unskilled dwarves for the sake of increased productivity.

-You learn that if many dwarves with no friends die, there is not much unhappiness, but if one person close to a dwarf perishes, the impact is dramatic.

-The creation of simple items such as, say, clear glass mugs is a complicated process involving woodcutting, wood burning, sand gathering(which requires bags) and more, all of which require skilled labour.

-A dwarf that does something notable (e.g. kills a crocodile with his bare hands, saves a fellow dwarf by hauling him back into the fortress whilst dodging a hail of arrows, tantrums and kills your legendary metalsmith) will receive special attention from the player.

-A legendary stonecrafter is more valuable than a wave of unskilled immigrants

-The player is the de-facto ruler. Nobody can overthrow the player. The player is thus a complete and utter asshole.


Remember that dwarven mentality is based completely around happiness. No such thing as love or hate. They are like those learning robots in that sense - 'good' and 'bad' are the only possible emotions.
Logged
Thief:"Quiet kitty, Qui-"
Cat:"THIEF! Protect the hoard from the skulking filth!"
The resulting party killed 20 dwarves, crippled 2 more and the remaining 9 managed to get along and have a nice party.

Muz

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #32 on: October 14, 2008, 01:54:40 pm »

Lol, I am writing it as a simulator. Heck, I'm writing it assuming that it's a real thing, subject to real cultural, ethical, and engineering leadership theories. I'm going to have to write a short risk management report on the building of whatever engineering projects (the reservoir being the most significant, I guess). I'm not so much focusing on the player's interaction style, though. No extra points for that; anyway writing a fat essay on DF is much more fun than inspecting the IEEE Code of Ethics or another dull review on the leadership skills of heroes in literature. It's a lot more work than it'd otherwise be, but meh, it makes learning the boring stuff much easier :D

Oh.. and thank you guys, because there was a test earlier yesterday which touched on duty, virtues, rights, and utilitarianism (the "greater good"). Because I spent so much time trying to explain it in short words here, it was pretty darn easy to do in a test.

Quote
Muz, do you intend to explore how much of this is the creator's intent, versus to what extent ethics emerge from the gameplay?
I'm going to somehow consider it like a real world, that spawns its own ethical rules. I mean, in a sense, there are things like ethics like children not being killed and stuff.. but players decide to play the game unethically and the creator decides to let it happen. Nothing wrong with that; it's just a game after all :p

Anyway, everyone did give good points of bravery. It's hard to say, but yeah, it seems a lot more useful for real people who understand the concept of bravery, even though cowardice is a term not in the dwarven dictionary :p In a similar way, I guess dwarves wouldn't get the concept of abstaining from alcohol.
Logged
Disclaimer: Any sarcasm in my posts will not be mentioned as that would ruin the purpose. It is assumed that the reader is intelligent enough to tell the difference between what is sarcasm and what is not.

Qmarx

  • Bay Watcher
  • "?"
    • View Profile
Re: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #33 on: October 14, 2008, 04:33:10 pm »


Anyway, everyone did give good points of bravery. It's hard to say, but yeah, it seems a lot more useful for real people who understand the concept of bravery, even though cowardice is a term not in the dwarven dictionary :p In a similar way, I guess dwarves wouldn't get the concept of abstaining from alcohol.

I assume that dwarves would view abstaining from alcohol the same way humans view getting nutrients from an IV - it's possible, but it isn't something you'd do unless you were extremely ill.
Logged

Dr. Melon

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Ethics of Dwarf Fortress
« Reply #34 on: October 15, 2008, 05:59:25 am »

Dwarves live in constant mental instability. Their emotions are triggered to full capacity by simple objects: a dwarf in deep bereavement over the loss of his wife to a giant tiger are fused out by the beauty of his dining room. However, if he can't find a damn seat he gets REALLY DAMN ANGRY AND HE'S GUNNA RIP YER HEAD OFF AND SPIT DOWN THE HOLE ARHAGRHARGRASGHR!
Logged
Pages: 1 2 [3]