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[MMad]

Dwarven women care for their babies

Heh. Mine sure don't.

[LegacyCWAL]

"Now isn't this great, widdle Coggy?"
"Goo-goo?"
"See all the Goblins shooting at us?  Isn't that sooooo cute?"
"Gaa-g...cth...." *hit by arrow*
"Awww, that's so adorable!  I have to tell my friends about just how cute you are!"
"..." *bleeds to death*

[Zwergner]

When I imagine Dwarfs in DF, I always imagine that it's impossible to tell males and females apart (from a human perspective at least, I sure dwarfs can tell).  Like baby alligators and chickens, you have to have them sexed (i.e. stick your finger in their ass) to be sure what gender they are.

The only idea I really like is maybe more gendered names, so that if someone WANTS gender roles, it's easier to implement them.  As far as different stats and behavior, I think that it's a bad idea for vanilla, but go nuts you crazy modders.

[Mikademus]

some versions give female dwarves beards, and having dwarf genders have essentially the same strength isn't really a problem compared to that), randomness to that extent can be a bad thing.

So give female dwarves the [beard] tag, s'no big deal...  Nobody has said that the differences have to/should be the same as humans. 

Sure, but why are you beating in the open door and telling me this? You're quoting the wrong person.

[MMad]

The only idea I really like is maybe more gendered names, so that if someone WANTS gender roles, it's easier to implement them.

Yeah, this seems to be the one point pretty much everyone agrees on.

[Granite26]

some versions give female dwarves beards, and having dwarf genders have essentially the same strength isn't really a problem compared to that), randomness to that extent can be a bad thing.

So give female dwarves the [beard] tag, s'no big deal...  Nobody has said that the differences have to/should be the same as humans. 

Sure, but why are you beating in the open door and telling me this? You're quoting the wrong person.

Sorry, bad quote, I guess it was something Aquillon said.  It was a messy quote structure...

Anyway, I care less about dwarves than I do about the missing raw tags.

[Neonivek]

When I imagine Dwarfs in DF, I always imagine that it's impossible to tell males and females apart (from a human perspective at least, I sure dwarfs can tell).  Like baby alligators and chickens, you have to have them sexed (i.e. stick your finger in their ass) to be sure what gender they are.

The only idea I really like is maybe more gendered names, so that if someone WANTS gender roles, it's easier to implement them.  As far as different stats and behavior, I think that it's a bad idea for vanilla, but go nuts you crazy modders.

Ugh, Why do I have an image in my head of you actually doing that for a living... CURSE YOU IMAGINATION!!!

Anyhow as for MAle and Female versions of names as well as Male and Female only names including Gender Neutral names... I wonder if it will make THAT much of a difference?

Male: Ugbista
Female: Agdistra

Ohh well it is flavor... Go AGDISTRA!!! USE BABY BOOM ATTACK!!!

[IndonesiaWarMinister]

When I imagine Dwarfs in DF, I always imagine that it's impossible to tell males and females apart (from a human perspective at least, I sure dwarfs can tell).  Like baby alligators and chickens, you have to have them sexed (i.e. stick your finger in their ass) to be sure what gender they are.

The only idea I really like is maybe more gendered names, so that if someone WANTS gender roles, it's easier to implement them.  As far as different stats and behavior, I think that it's a bad idea for vanilla, but go nuts you crazy modders.

Ugh, Why do I have an image in my head of you actually doing that for a living... CURSE YOU IMAGINATION!!!

Anyhow as for MAle and Female versions of names as well as Male and Female only names including Gender Neutral names... I wonder if it will make THAT much of a difference?

Male: Ugbista
Female: Agdistra

Ohh well it is flavor... Go AGDISTRA!!! USE BABY BOOM ATTACK!!!

Use Arabic styles.

Or general semitic.

It will relieve Toady from many hours of stress.

[Granite26]

When I imagine Dwarfs in DF, I always imagine that it's impossible to tell males and females apart (from a human perspective at least, I sure dwarfs can tell).  Like baby alligators and chickens, you have to have them sexed (i.e. stick your finger in their ass) to be sure what gender they are.

The only idea I really like is maybe more gendered names, so that if someone WANTS gender roles, it's easier to implement them.  As far as different stats and behavior, I think that it's a bad idea for vanilla, but go nuts you crazy modders.

Ugh, Why do I have an image in my head of you actually doing that for a living... CURSE YOU IMAGINATION!!!

Anyhow as for MAle and Female versions of names as well as Male and Female only names including Gender Neutral names... I wonder if it will make THAT much of a difference?

Male: Ugbista
Female: Agdistra

Ohh well it is flavor... Go AGDISTRA!!! USE BABY BOOM ATTACK!!!

Use Arabic styles.

Or general semitic.

It will relieve Toady from many hours of stress.

What?

The truly generic way would be to have a [gender:1:Male:Names] list and a [gender:2:Female:Names] list.  Would easily support more than two genders (especially if you treated hive animals as trinary and wanted the queens to have special names), could be expanded to support child vs. adult names. 

As for the work of splitting them, just divide the list in half.

[Mephansteras]

I'm all in favor of gender differentiation. Especially in the raws. And, regardless of what rules we want to put in place for dwarves, the humans of this world should follow the same rules as us. I don't want to imagine human women with beards. Ugg. And, anyway, the stats stuff for humans should also make sense (women should have better social stats, if those get put in). As should gender roles. I shouldn't see too many female human caravan guards, for example.

Actually, I'd love to see some randomization with how the different human civs treat women. In some, they should be nearly slaves, in others, we could have a matriarchy. The fun thing about humans in games like this is we can make them REALLY random, because of all the differences in real life and various fantasy stories. Imagine a band of human women and their children fleeing form an oppressive culture to your fortress because they hear that dwarven women are treated as equals?

[Dwaref]

Imagine a band of human women and their children fleeing form an oppressive culture to your fortress because they hear that dwarven women are treated as equals?

Who the hell would want to live as an equal to a dwarf?

[Granite26]

gnomes

[Soadreqm]

Okay, I couldn't be bothered to read most of this thread. And I still want to voice my own opinions. Whatever.

Anyways, this could be cool if properly extended in the proper dwarf fortress fashion of unnecessary complexity. Rather than just apply current western gender roles into dwarves, give each culture their own. Matriarchal amazon civs. Ancient Greece-style with women as property and pederasty. Polygamy, monogamy, agamy, everything. And it could affect diplomacy in diverse ways, in the same way gods do.

I expect race would have something to do what kind of system the civ would be prone to adopt. It's easier to preach gender equality if the genders actually are mostly equal.

Which brings me neatly to my next point, physical differences. I think dwarves should probably be exempt. In most fantasy portrayals (most of which are at least partially ripped off from Tolkien) dwarf females are mostly identical to males. Short with long beards.

As for the other fantastic races, I'm not quite as sure. Elves are usually inherently superior to everyone else in every way (They are! just ask them!), but how that would affect gender roles is beyond me. And I have no idea how goblins and kobolds would work.

And I don't think we should go crazy limiting humans either. I guess men are statistically a bit stronger than women, but only statistically. That doesn't meant that all men would be stronger than all women, or that a randomly chosen man would be stronger than a randomly chosen woman. Especially since the current stat system (and most proposals for future stat systems I have seen) is a bit limited for that. And then there's the whole sexism=bad thingy.

Maybe let culture pick applicaple professions for each sex, and let professions give modifiers to default stats. Farmers and blacksmiths generally have to be strong, whereas prostitutes and nobles don't.

Also, culture specific names, with possible further segregation between genders and social classes.

Also, also, culture specific clothing. And architecture. And everything.

(edit)
And the animal people would follow their own messed-up rules. Hermaphodite snailmen (visualize THAT!). And as for antmen, I think I'll just link the relevant section of the wikipedia article and leave it at that.

[Mikademus]

BOLDFACE

You know, when you bold your entire post except for the first sentence, it sort of loses its attention-grabbing poignancy.

Okay, I couldn't be bothered to read most of this thread. And I still want to voice my own opinions. Whatever.

That's ok, I didn't bother reading your post either.

[Mephansteras]

BOLDFACE

You know, when you bold your entire post except for the first sentence, it sort of loses its attention-grabbing poignancy.

Oops. Ok, fixed. I was missing a close tag somehow.