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[Neonivek]

Alright since I hear this a lot... I might as well make this suggestion it is short and simple

The Broker counts everything that is in your fortress right? So he knows what you have and what you don't have

He also should know how much of certain objects that you need namely Clothes, Armor, and other items.

So lets say you have 10 dwarves who you assigned Full Plate Armor and Swords... and you say... have none of these.

Well no fear, just send the order to "Make *Material* Objects According to Dwarf Request" (Or whatever) and they will automatically create the objects you need until they are all armored and equipped with weapons.

Clothes getting worn? just "Make Clothing according to Dwarven Request" and the tailor will make as many clothes as your fort needs to clothe everyone. This of course already knows how much usable clothes you have in your fortress so it won't make tons of clothes until you run out.

The Broker would be required to do all this as he would need to make a tally... No need for additional Nobles especially since the Broker pretty much does this anyhow. Heck forget the Broker!

Anyhow I guess the Broker could also be asked what you "Need" and thus you get a tally of all the kind of objects are needed.
-You need 20 Swords
-You need 100000 pairs of socks
-You need a life
*Broker Interupted: Slain by universe imploding*

I just dislike this guessing game... with clothes and armor that is only fulfilled by an annoying level of micromanagement.

[Draco18s]

It's the Bookkeeper's job, not the broker (he trades things).

Good idea though.

[Dame de la Licorne]

Or you could have it as an automatic interaction between the bookkeeper and manager.  The bookkeeper counts everything, realizes the fort is short in a, b, and c, (according to supply and demand) and tells the manager.  The manager then cues the necessary jobs to make up the deficit.

[Core Xii]

Eh.

So, the dwarfs embark. The bookkeper counts and detects that there are more items lying around in the wagon than there are indoor stockpiles to store them, and goes to the expedition leader to create construction jobs.

...See where I'm going with this? What's next, a game that plays itself?

[Dame de la Licorne]

It would only work for jobs that can be queued via the manager, anything that gets built in some other way is exempt.  Or, another option would be for the manager to acquire another screen where s/he recommends a list of needed items and the necessary quantities.

[Teldin]

Eh.

So, the dwarfs embark. The bookkeper counts and detects that there are more items lying around in the wagon than there are indoor stockpiles to store them, and goes to the expedition leader to create construction jobs.

...See where I'm going with this? What's next, a game that plays itself?

Some of us want to get to the fun stuff rather than have to micromanage a million things the entire game.

[Yourself]

Eh.

So, the dwarfs embark. The bookkeper counts and detects that there are more items lying around in the wagon than there are indoor stockpiles to store them, and goes to the expedition leader to create construction jobs.

...See where I'm going with this? What's next, a game that plays itself?

Also, dwarves path find for themselves.  Dwarves fight for themselves.  If you like micromanaging, fine, I'm sure there'd be an option to shut it off.  I'd rather concentrate on designing my fortress than trawling through the massive stocks screen and making sure I actually have all the high boots I want among the mess of narrow GCS silk socks.  If my fortress is short on metal, it's better to have just the right amount than too many.

[Neoskel]

It would be better if you could just do a 'census' of what clothes are needed, then you can decide yourself what you're going to make those clothes out of.

[Othob Rithol]

I'm really against automatic production of most items.

I would like some sort of report on how well equipped the military is. If we need 17 more quivers or 5 more helmets, my CotG should be able to tell me.

And some jobs (like milling all the cave wheat or smelting all the gold), since they kind of make sense. Butchering and Looming have realistic automation, and I'm all for applying that logic to dyeing and the fishery.

Even a system to make sure we have a specific quantity of an item in storage is feasible to me. Telling the clerk to let the manager know when we have less than 20 bags of sand waiting for the glass workers is at least realistic.

But the notion of a noble magically knowing who exactly who needs socks is beyond me. I'd much rather see the dwarves go bitch at the mayor, and the mayor make a mandate to produce X thongs.

Too much micro is bad. Not enough micro is worse. I want to see this game get harder, not easier.

If you don't want to keep track of clothing: then don't...run a nudist colony. Don't want to deal with cooking/brewing/barrel making? Mod your dwarves with NO_EAT and NO_DRINK tokens.

[Neonivek]

"But the notion of a noble magically knowing who exactly who needs socks is beyond me"

So the book keeper who does absolutely nothing but walk around the fortress and counts every single monetary item often to the point where he could quote you how many fishbones you have in your fortress... Including those that others are wearing, holding, or just about to eat... Wouldn't know when twenty dwarves don't have socks?

[Mephansteras]

Too much micro is bad. Not enough micro is worse. I want to see this game get harder, not easier.

I think the ideal solution is to have a few things in place:

1) The ability to toggle automatic ordering of items on at least a categorical basis. For example, I may be ok with not having to track the brewing as long as there is enough booze to keep the dwarves happy, but I need to micromanage my metal industry because we have a limited amount of materials to work with. I know we don't have helms for everyone, but I'm saving that steel for plate, dammit! What areas should be micromanaged are going to change from fortress to fortress and year to year. If I'm dealing with a giant wall project and fending off attack after attack, I don't WANT to worry about socks. But that doesn't mean the game shouldn't take care of the dwarves.

2) To balance this, anything that is micromanaged should probably be better off/more efficient then anything auto-managed. If you have 1000+ barrels of booze, you can ignore your brewing section and worry about other things. If you're down to your last 10, you really ought to pay attention to what's going on so your dwarves don't go drinking in the carp-infested river. Same with, say, beds. Yeah, it might be convenient to have 20 more beds made because a bunch of dwarves are sleeping in the dirt, but if I'm planning an expansion for the next migrant wave I'm going to have to queue up those orders myself if I want things done before they show up.

3) As far as easier vs harder, that's going to depend a lot on the player. New players will probably LOVE to have stuff automanaged, just so they have time and brain-power to focus on learning the game. Later on, people will want more control, more challenges, etc. Then they can turn them off. Some players may never turn them off. Once, say, the County arc is in, someone may be more of a military/civ minded player who doesn't care if Urist is wearing socks or not, but doesn't want to worry about tantruming dwarves while they're planning out the conquest of that nicely situated human town.

I agree the game is too easy right now, but as things get more and more complex, I think allowing people to choose WHAT complexities to deal with is going to be necessary for everyone to find something fun in the game. I don't think Toady wants to limit himself to just OCD minded players. 

[i2amroy]

It would only work for jobs that can be queued via the manager, anything that gets built in some other way is exempt.  Or, another option would be for the manager to acquire another screen where s/he recommends a list of needed items and the necessary quantities.

I really like this idea. But I think that the automatic thing should be implemented and should be toggleable like Mephansteras said. It absolutely must be something that is toggleable with no need to gen a new world though.

[Shades]

Or you could have it as an automatic interaction between the bookkeeper and manager.  The bookkeeper counts everything, realizes the fort is short in a, b, and c, (according to supply and demand) and tells the manager.  The manager then cues the necessary jobs to make up the deficit.

Couldn't this be handled really neatly with the book keeper generating mandates based on whatever item is the most 'needed' within the fort.

It's still up to the player to build it but you'd know and it would make the mandate relevant.

[Neonivek]

Or you could have it as an automatic interaction between the bookkeeper and manager.  The bookkeeper counts everything, realizes the fort is short in a, b, and c, (according to supply and demand) and tells the manager.  The manager then cues the necessary jobs to make up the deficit.

Couldn't this be handled really neatly with the book keeper generating mandates based on whatever item is the most 'needed' within the fort.

It's still up to the player to build it but you'd know and it would make the mandate relevant.

No because that spaces too much time between player actions a lot of the time and even then he would only post one relevant item.

Lets say all the clothes of a 20 Migrant wave were starting to become ratty (So xx) he would mandate you make 40 gloves or 40 socks because that is what is most needed.

If you want to build additional clothing for stockpiling or selling... Then that should have to be done manually... Perhaps the Broker could steer you in the right dirrection by saying what the trade agreements were.

If you have 100 dwarves with various clothes that need to be replaced... Id like a "Make according to need" option controlled by the Book Keeper and Manager.

I am personally surprised however that people applied my concept beyond what I originally intended it for, which was clothes and armor.

[Dakej]

I'd at least like to know what my dwarves are missing that they need. The armor thing is the primary example. If I could at least see a list of what's missing, that would be great. I don't know about the whole auto-production thing. Mandates could be interesting as long as they don't become a pain in the ass.