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[Kogan Loloklam]

They all need to burn... Know what I blame? The inability of a third party canadate to be considered anything except "spoiler".

I have voted third party in every election I was allowed to. The paticular canadate changed based on a simple core thought, but it has never been democrat or republican. STILL THOUGH, I was insulted for voting for Nader. HOW DARE I VOTE FOR THE SPOILER CANADATE!! Who cares that I disliked Liberman to such an extent that I'd have taken a mentally challenged elitest oil baron over someone with Liberman as a running mate? Certainly not those who think I shouldn't "Throw my vote away" by voting for something that actually matters!

Seriously though, until we can have a canadate that runs for an actual policy rather than making a party look good, we can't get a balanced budget. This fact will spell the doom of capitalism, not because the system is flawed, but because the concepts on how it is executed is flawed.

This is the same reason communism failed. Not because the system is flawed, but because of the concepts on how it was executed was flawed.

Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Spam, Wonderful spam! Look at the spam!


So, I reiterate...

LET THEM ALL BURN...
When a forest has burned off all the nasty, old, wizened fat trees, new grass grows, and new bushes, and new trees. It allows a forest that was relativly dull and dead to sprout to life. Let the american economy burn. Let 1000000 terrorists fly 1000000 planes into 1000000 buildings, when the rubble is cleared, new growth will sprout. Hopfully not a cleptocratic society like Russia... Things like the rescue of AIG is just another hot coal dropped by the government into the smoldering pile of leaves that we like to think of as a economy. When it bursts to flames and kills all the old growth, I am certain new growth will follow, after the forest which is our quality of life is turned to ash...

[Duke 2.0]

 I somewhat agree with Kogan. Except for the death and burning. I would want a mini-revolution to take place with as little bloodshed as possible. With as few lives ruined as possible. Else what is the point of a better system?

[PTTG??]

Kogan may have gone off the deep end, but it's on the right side of the pool.

Now, I don't REALLY work at AIG. I might not have actually SEEN or had any real EVIDENCE of the west coast CEO resigning or anything. But I was right about it in broad strokes.

Now then, who has Washington Mutual?
I FOR REALS have my account there. But not for very long- tonight I take all my cash out. I'll see what the market's like in 2 or 3 months, then I'll go back. For now, by bank account will be my mattress, and I'm keeping some cans of spam and (non-plastic) bottles of water in that account too.

[Torak]

Once America descends into infighting and general insanity, I'm cutting a bloody path to Toady, or what's left, just to save Dwarf Fortress.


Yeah, I'm a Zealot.

[Makrond]

What's worse about this whole thing is that America seems to want to take the rest of the world down with them. They propped up AIG, an insurance group, when Lehman, a large accredited bank, was also flagging. Lehman had huge amounts of foreign investment. I'm sure you don't need to be an economics major to figure it out.

Even here in Australia we're feeling the crunch of the American collapse. Unfortuntely, our completely fucking stupid previous government refused to completely withdraw their economic investments from the American market and move them wholesale to the Asian market. If we had, we'd be somewhere up with Canada right about now. Unfortunately, America's about to crash and it looks like we might only just make it by clinging to the Asian market with two fingers.

[KaelGotDwarves]

If the US market goes, most of Asian markets will go down too. Hell, even China will be hard hit because all the production they do for us.

India should weather it nicely though.

The thing is, that last graph I posted shows the issue.

If you're a person with $10000, how much can you spend?
$10000, plus whatever credit you've accrued.

If you're a bank with $10000, how much can you loan out?
Easily $100k and more.

The problem is that loans and mortgages were WAY more than people can pay back now, so the whole economy is teetering on the brink with vast negatives everywhere and no real money. The government is propping up the banks by giving them a loan? I'm sure that will work this time around... 

Bush's policy was to give $600 back to the populace while taxes went up on the middle class and down on the rich. And where did that money go? Mainly to all the products we buy that are made in China. Maybe the economy was helped a little bit, but get this... Marx is still relevant today. The rich have gotten richer and the poor poorer.

The sad thing is Americans are a tiny percentage of the world's population yet we consume about 25% of it's resources. We spend ridiculous amounts of money per day while much of the world lives on a few bucks a day.

Something has got to give.

[Torak]

The sad thing is Americans are a tiny percentage of the world's population yet we consume almost 25$ of it's resources. We spend ridiculous amounts of money per day while much of the world lives on a few bucks a day.

Whew, we americans dodged a bullet.

[Royal Surveyor]

<sarcasm>
Wait wait, Kael...

What you're saying is that we borrowed money through the treasury... which was backed by China... to give to the taxpayers... so they could go and buy stuff from China?
</sarcasm>

AIG was probably bailed out due to secondary effect.  Who is going to insure all those junk AAA bonds with sketchy mortgages nestled inside?  The US taxpayer and yet more debt on the books.  But then again, a bank run like the Great Depression would certainly be a Very Bad Thing.

The thing that gets me is that the executives who are responsible will walk.  If I robbed a bank of $500k (a good figure for a middle-rank executive over two years), and I were caught, I'd be sent to federal prison with little chance of anything else.  When a gang of executives does it, suddenly it's "Nobody's fault!"  The more I read about the situation, the angrier I get about it.  Yes, this is a long overdue correction and it was bound to happen, but someone was criminally negligent and asleep at the switch.

I'm gonna go play DF and wipe out some nobles, and any dwarf who doesn't get to the switch in time.

[IndonesiaWarMinister]

Hooray, Hooray!
At last! The Capitalism will down, down, and down to the sea!
Go fight with your arch-enemy communism on MARS, you secularist scums!

[Moon Label]

I know this will start a bit of ruckus, but; thank god.
I do not, however, praise the bailing-out of failed businesses.  They failed because those businesses could not even function properly, and thus should die.
I'm thankful on account that maybe a little creative destruction can occur.

I'm still angry that sizable portions of this recession (depression?) were cooked-up by the attempt to secure things like this from occurring; when people thought they were secure, they dumped money where they should not have -- unless they were looking for a thrill-ride instead of profit.

edit: grammar

[chris_acheson]

our anarchists merely want a small government, not a total disband.

Speak for yourself.  I and all the other anarchists that I know want to abolish all governments.  You may find this unreasonable, but please don't misrepresent us.

[Cthulhu]

The sad thing is Americans are a tiny percentage of the world's population yet we consume almost 25$ of it's resources. We spend ridiculous amounts of money per day while much of the world lives on a few bucks a day.

Whew, we americans dodged a bullet.

Amen to that.  As long as I have my computer and my interwebz, I can survive on 300 calories every two days.  Let the apocalypse come!

[Asheron]

The capitalists are in chaos, comrades! Rise up, it's global revolution time!

[Nilocy]

The capitalists are in chaos, comrades! Rise up, it's global revolution time!

You may be my god, but this is an outrage! Capitalism works, its the evolution of the mind. And evolution is good.

[Cthulhu]

I was under the impression that the goal of evolution was improvement.