Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

Author Topic: Not so bottomless  (Read 1058 times)

Noble Digger

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Not so bottomless
« on: September 03, 2008, 07:17:58 pm »

In my current world, I had a west-running chasm entrance at the far left center of my 3x3 embark map (i embarked at a goblin tower). I was able to dig 1 z-level below the 'Chasm' bottomless pit #-tiles at the bottom of the chasm and pass underneath them. Let me know if you need the save, it's heavily modded so I'd have to send the entire folder.

This was in 40c, btw.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 04:18:10 pm by Noble Digger »
Logged
quib·ble
1. To evade the truth or importance of an issue by raising trivial distinctions and objections.
2. To find fault or criticize for petty reasons; cavil.

Toady One

  • The Great
    • View Profile
    • http://www.bay12games.com
Re: Not so bottomless
« Reply #1 on: September 06, 2008, 05:59:02 pm »

Had you ever been around that tower before as an adventurer or was this the first time that area of the map had been loaded?
Logged
The Toad, a Natural Resource:  Preserve yours today!

Noble Digger

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Not so bottomless
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2008, 11:07:15 pm »

I had gone there as an adventurer and slain 65% of the goblins, then got my eyes gouged out and face ripped off by Smunstu the Lie of Jackals, the demon who owned the fort. I returned with another adventurer and finished off the rest of the goblins, save a handful. Smunstu was still at large when a sailing goblin arrow killed my adamantine-clad adventurer in one shot.

He was present when I embarked there in dwarf mode immediately afterward, using dwarves of the same civilization as the adventurer had been, and he and the remaining 6 goblins were 'friendly' just like dwarves left over during reclaim forts. He proceeded to stand next to my trade depot and kill any dwarven caravans that arrived, but he allowed goblins to arrive and trade. A kobold siege murdered him--2-3 kobolds with bows shot him and he died without having time to fight back.

Demons have damblock 5 in my raws from now on. I have the save\build for this fort if you need it.
Logged
quib·ble
1. To evade the truth or importance of an issue by raising trivial distinctions and objections.
2. To find fault or criticize for petty reasons; cavil.

Toady One

  • The Great
    • View Profile
    • http://www.bay12games.com
Re: Not so bottomless
« Reply #3 on: September 12, 2008, 07:30:16 pm »

How large was your embark area?  There's an issue I've been aware of but never fixed that involves going to a site in adv mode, saving it (so it exists in a certain 3D rectangular solid shape with a defined bottom with the chasm tiles), but when you load up the area in dwarf mode, especially if your embark area is larger than the site's 3x3, it sometimes needs to expand the play area into lower Z areas, leaving the previous chasm tile undercut.  The fix is reasonably straightforward, but I haven't gotten around to doing it -- there are some annoyances that come from having to expand features like chasms downward (does it generate additional side caverns? etc.)  Not hard, but irritating.
Logged
The Toad, a Natural Resource:  Preserve yours today!

Noble Digger

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Not so bottomless
« Reply #4 on: September 12, 2008, 07:48:49 pm »

I embarked to the same 3x3 as the goblin towers occupied, but your explanation makes good sense for why a z-level would get added otherwise. It just doesn't necessarily work in this case... I still have the save and all altered raws if you need them to figure this out. The area was visited by TWO adventurers, which may have facilitated the same occurrence since one of them only visited the main tower before his...end.

Personally, irritating though it may be, it hurts that technical limitations preclude us from digging below a certain z-level. Especially when I mis-plan my fortress and realize I started a 3-level-deep construction on the 2nd level from the bottom. In those cases I'd love to be able to force the game to generate another level of depth. I don't understand the world gen attributes very well and I rarely do anything with them except infinite reject until I have to go with a 'standard' world.

On a 1x1 embark map (possible with a utility called nanofortress) having many many more z levels would be fun times. I'd love to try makin Dante's deptiction of Hell in DF, but i'd want 3-5 levels for each level of hell, and many more for certain specific ones e.g. cocytus.

Some additional raw tokens for stone matglosses specifying native depths ([DEPTH:0:4] for soil, 18:25 for HFS, etc) for layer stones and mineral types (in addition to existing stone biome tokens) would allow a lot more incentivization for digging deep, and more of a sense of game progression. I'd love if there was a certain, unknowable depth at which your miner breaks through the shell of the inner earth and plummets into the fiery abyssal caverns filled with untold horrors. Bonus points if you then pause your fortress and control him in adventurer mode. :D

I'd love a more natural means of preventing players from digging so deep that their fortress becomes unplayable. Say, at a certain depth, the rock strata start becoming hotter and eventually your miners are unable to dig because the rock is too plasticine and conditions too harsh to sustain them. But I supposed functionally, that would be no different from the current system, except that it explains itself to you. Always nice in games.

I'm most excited about the expansion of the underground, of all the inclement changes. I'm one of those guys who often turns off invaders, imprisons and butchers traders, and locks the doors to the fortress permanently.
Logged
quib·ble
1. To evade the truth or importance of an issue by raising trivial distinctions and objections.
2. To find fault or criticize for petty reasons; cavil.