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[McDoomhammer]

Let me break it down.  There is no 'Fallout' lore.  There is no 'real' Fallout game that Bethesda 'should' be making.  They bought the rights to a small, if notable, franchise that peetered out a decade ago, and are now making a title they decided would work best for them to make.  Like Fallout 3 or don't, and remember that you haven't seen anything but some screenshots and a couple very short videos, but quit saying there's some other game Bethesda was 'supposed' to make and that this is somehow raping your nostalgia.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page

Please don't act like your opinions are fact.  Otherwise this is just going to turn into a flame war between two sides completely convinced that they're correct and constantly betting their own genitals after every witty retort.  If you have an arguement to make, just state it and support it.  Don't just start spouting rhetoric and insults.  Otherwise you're no better than Bill O'Reilly.

Once again, kind of the pot calling the kettle black.  I mean, you act all outraged but your argument is a fan wiki?  How does that make Aquizzar's post mere opinion?  Fallout 2 did change things up and people did complain that it was too much.  None of which would invalidate the main point- that no ideal, platonic form of a Fallout game exists that they /should/ be producing.  I understand the argument just fine- if you can't see past a little invective that's your own problem.

You have every right not to like what they've done, but don't complain about what a horrible travesty it is omg unless you've made a so-called worthy sequel yourself, you just look like a brat.  Yes, it'll suck if it isn't as good.  Oh well, shit happens, no one's forcing you to play.  There's no need to act all entitled to your imaginary ideal game.

Good on you for retracting the ridiculously insulting personal remark, however.

[smeej]

It's Bethesda. We can at least say it will suck without the fan made mods and addons.

And it isn't even launching with mod tools. Weak.

[umiman]

I watched the videos. Originally, I wanted to give them the benefit of the doubt. But now... sigh.

I believe they can only win over the public that hasn't actually played Fallout and doesn't know anything about it.

So many things I hate about the videos:

1. Lack of colour. Yay for the brown revolution. I'm so happy I can barely tell the difference between a character and the wall. Which brings me to the next point.

2. Oblivion-esque, puppet NPCs. Gee, more lifeless, simulated animatronics for us to play with. I'm sure everyone won't happen to notice the characters being completely dull.

3. Stupidly dated graphics. I don't understand why everyone is lavishing praise on the graphics. The only difference between this and any other Bethesada RPG title in terms of graphics is the number of pixels for the "HD" feel. That's it! I can still see jagged edges, boring, straight lines in places where there should be texturing, etc. LAZY.

4. Shortcuts taken everywhere in terms of development. It's retarded and LAZY. Second video. He places the bomb with the extremely complex bomb placing scene where nothing happens but a menu confirming that a bomb has been placed in the town of muddy shit paint colour. Then there's that government agent fellow who mysteriously trusts a complete stranger to detonate a nuclear bomb, gives him the bomb without actually having any animation frames to give a bomb (apparently teleporting the bomb into your inventory with his mind), and acts out the same 9 FRAMES OF ANIMATION repeatedly, forever.

5. Voicework is terrible. It's like... Keanu Reeves.

6. Ridiculous, illogical decisions pandering to an idiot-seeded crowd. There is NO reason for a broken down scrap of heap car to EXPLODE when it obviously doesn't work, has no engine, or FUEL. A CAR DOES NOT EXPLODE AFTER 5 BULLET SHOTS!

7. What the hell is with the "you can change everything about your character... again, when you leave the vault."? So, all your nice, slow growth based stats before then was just a gimmick which can be safely ignored for the simplistic, accepted, D&D style stat sheet at the door? You can even get plastic surgery right at the exit. Amazing.

I'm an open minded person. But this game is like what the O.C. does for the brain. I'm not even talking about Fallout history or anything related to the franchise. This is basic gameplay. It'll probably do as well as Oblivion, which is good for Bethseda, bad for gamers, and monotony for the idiot-seeded public who absorbs this stuff and mistakes that knowledge for enjoyment.

FINAL NOTE: I'm not calling it out because it is "Fallout". I mentioned in the other Fallout thread that I don't consider this a sequel, just another game. So I'm calling out its flaws as a game, not its flaws at being Fallout.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

Top EDIT: Umiman, your evil robotic mind has listed a good number of things I dislike about Fallout 3 much more concisely than I ever could. Though I don't really mind being able to edit the character at the end.  I'd rather they'd have done that in the first place than made you go through a drawn out mandatory tutorial.

Let me break it down.  There is no 'Fallout' lore.  There is no 'real' Fallout game that Bethesda 'should' be making.  They bought the rights to a small, if notable, franchise that peetered out a decade ago, and are now making a title they decided would work best for them to make.  Like Fallout 3 or don't, and remember that you haven't seen anything but some screenshots and a couple very short videos, but quit saying there's some other game Bethesda was 'supposed' to make and that this is somehow raping your nostalgia.

http://fallout.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page

Please don't act like your opinions are fact.  Otherwise this is just going to turn into a flame war between two sides completely convinced that they're correct and constantly betting their own genitals after every witty retort.  If you have an arguement to make, just state it and support it.  Don't just start spouting rhetoric and insults.  Otherwise you're no better than Bill O'Reilly.

Once again, kind of the pot calling the kettle black.  I mean, you act all outraged but your argument is a fan wiki?  How does that make Aquizzar's post mere opinion?  Fallout 2 did change things up and people did complain that it was too much.  None of which would invalidate the main point- that no ideal, platonic form of a Fallout game exists that they /should/ be producing.  I understand the argument just fine- if you can't see past a little invective that's your own problem.

You have every right not to like what they've done, but don't complain about what a horrible travesty it is omg unless you've made a so-called worthy sequel yourself, you just look like a brat.  Yes, it'll suck if it isn't as good.  Oh well, shit happens, no one's forcing you to play.  There's no need to act all entitled to your imaginary ideal game.

Good on you for retracting the ridiculously insulting personal remark, however.

Fallout fans have much more right to complain about the game than anyone else.  They were the ones that made it popular.  They were the ones that still liked it ten years after the fact even though it had released one mediocre and one terrible game, and was no longer popular.  Bethesda buying the license and making what they now call Fallout 3 with it is like some kind of intentional personal insult to them.

Saying that there is no ideal is simply false.  There are many things that made Fallout 1 and 2 Fallout games besides the perspective and the combat style, a few of which I've mentioned.  Fallout 3 has by all appearances butchered these.  Fallout had a unique style and attitude, it did not involve tiny nuclear explosions happening every ten feet. Despite all the things they satirized, actual nuclear explosions were not a joke.  Bethesda's writers seem to have though, "Fallout... Well with a name like that this game must have tons of nuclear explosions in it.  It has humor too?  Well then, humor about nuclear explosions must fit perfectly."  A major unique part about Fallout 1 and 2 was the choices you could make that weren't just black and white good and evil, and didn't necessarily involve killing something.  That's right, many of the quests could be solved without killing anyone.  I mean come on, you could talk the BBEG into killing himself.  The only meaningful choice we've seen so far in Oblivion is to either destroy an entire town of innocent people for no apparent reason (Evil), refuse (neutral), Disable the bomb that's used to destroy it (Good).

There is a reason that Fallout fans are hating F3 much more than F2, and it's not because the perspective changed as Oblivion fans just love to repeat ad nauseum.  It's because it's a completely different style of game.  Even the art style is different.  Generic crap with Uruk Hai / RE3 Nemesis Super-Mutants and Zombies instead of ghouls.  They even actually call them zombies.

And come on, these are the people that made Oblivion.  It sold literally millions by dumbing everything down and ignoring the lore.  Why would they mess with a 'good' thing?  Their idea of innovation is adding half assed elements of other genres to RPGs.

EDIT:  Thank all that is good and holy for YouTube... I mean, I meant to criticize someone's syle of arguement but instead I was unintentionally calling someone a habitual lier who will blindly promote and defend whatever happens to be popular in right wing politics at the time  without regard for of truth, justice, or morality.  Someone who couldn't be sued for defamation because his lies are so blatant, constant, and vehement that it is nearly impossible to prove that he actually knows he is lying at the time, which is apparently required.  Someone who accidentally accused American POWs in WW2 of committing a war crime of which they were in fact the victims, while speaking to a US general... on two separate occasions...  Then brushed it off, saying that he had actually meant some other American soldiers in the same place who killed some other German soldiers who were surrendering.  If he wasn't such an intolerable asshole I might almost feel sorry for him because he appears to also be a complete Sociopath.  God damn Bill O'Reilly.

[motorbitch]

its a shame black isle is done, and it was obvious that the original feeling of fallout 1&2 can not brought back by another company.
however, i like what ive seen in the videos.
that there can not be another 256 colour - isometric version was more than clear.
the question is, how did them manage to put the fallout combat and caracter system into 3d?
what ive seen, at last they TRYED....

the perks are there , the stats. to me it looks promising, at last. we can not say anything about the storry now. hopefully it will contain as many wired dark humor as f1 & f2, but that we cant know now. but i read that the storry shuld be realy, realy long.
so, im in a good hope to see a good mixture of fps and roolplay with a epic storry. something i havent seen since deus ex 1.

ps:
have you seen that? it stuttered when he looked around. that game must need a bitch of a grafik card. guess its time to start saving money for a new one...

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

its a shame black isle is done, and it was obvious that the original feeling of fallout 1&2 can not brought back by another company.
however, i like what ive seen in the videos.
that there can not be another 256 colour - isometric version was more than clear.
the question is, how did them manage to put the fallout combat and caracter system into 3d?
what ive seen, at last they TRYED....

the perks are there , the stats. to me it looks promising, at last. we can not say anything about the storry now. hopefully it will contain as many wired dark humor as f1 & f2, but that we cant know now. but i read that the storry shuld be realy, realy long.
so, im in a good hope to see a good mixture of fps and roolplay with a epic storry. something i havent seen since deus ex 1.

ps:
have you seen that? it stuttered when he looked around. that game must need a bitch of a grafik card. guess its time to start saving money for a new one...

EDIT: the post I wrote here was really jumping the gun and I shouldn't have made it.

[kcwong]

its a shame black isle is done, and it was obvious that the original feeling of fallout 1&2 can not brought back by another company.

I would have more faith if it is the former Bioware... but they are under the evil claws of EA now.  

Obsidian can't do it, from what I've seen in NWN2. I won't forgive them for messing up KotOR2.

however, i like what ive seen in the videos.
that there can not be another 256 colour - isometric version was more than clear.
the question is, how did them manage to put the fallout combat and caracter system into 3d?
what ive seen, at last they TRYED....
the perks are there , the stats. to me it looks promising, at last.

I would bet that they put everything they can salvage from Oblivion in Fallout 3. It's going to be twitch-based with some stat modifier.

we can not say anything about the storry now. hopefully it will contain as many wired dark humor as f1 & f2, but that we cant know now. but i read that the storry shuld be realy, realy long.
so, im in a good hope to see a good mixture of fps and roolplay with a epic storry. something i havent seen since deus ex 1.

That's the one thing I worry most about. What Bethesda has made is completely opposite of what Fallout is.

I've watched a few Fallout3 interview/preview video, and all they demonstrate is how to blow things up. Todd would mention peaceful ways of solving problems, but then immediately switch to demonstrate how to build a lunchbox launcher. And use the called-shot interface a lot.

ps:
have you seen that? it stuttered when he looked around. that game must need a bitch of a grafik card. guess its time to start saving money for a new one...

Bethesda makes games for the future generations of computer. It's a fact.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

Bethesda makes games for the future generations of computer. It's a fact.

I just have to comment on this.  Bethesda does not in fact make games for the future generations of computer.  They make games for Xbox 360.  The reason it runs badly is because the port is poorly optimized.  At least that's the case with Oblivion.

[Cthulhu]

I was going to post something, but I see Ioric and Soulwynd waiting behind the door to tear anyone limb from limb who walks in , so I'll just head out now.

[Ioric Kittencuddler]

I was going to post something, but I see Ioric and Soulwynd waiting behind the door to tear anyone limb from limb who walks in , so I'll just head out now.

You did post something.  A passive aggressive personal attack on me and Soulwynd.

[Cthulhu]

I tell it like it is, although you did redact the "You must be a troll" thing.

[yamo]

Sound like business decisions...they are adapting the game to the "middle" to maximize sales.  Bethesda by Brooks Bros.  Once you let the corporate weasels in the door...

[Soulwynd]

I was going to post something, but I see Ioric and Soulwynd waiting behind the door to tear anyone limb from limb who walks in , so I'll just head out now.

*bare fangs*

Just kidding. All I said before, with sarcasm, was that throwing a fit about people's opinion was hypocritical. I just thought it was funny and should be pointed out. He was teaching us that right and wrong do not exist, specially in online arguments, while trying to say you're all wrong bitches, shut up now plz.

I think I'd give him more credit if he has said, literally, "You're all wrong bitches, shut up now and only talk about it after you play the gaem, ktx plz." Cause I couldn't agree with that more than I already. And please note that everything I say about the game, I make sure to add 'seem' to it, cause I really don't know, it all seems that way and if it is, I will not like it. Just my opinion. I never said I couldn't be wrong, I hope I am, I liked fallout 1 and 2 a bit too much.


But I apologize if I looked like a troll.

[Omath Erius]

 "...[Fallout Fans] were the ones that made it popular.  They were the ones that still liked it ten years after the fact even though it had released one mediocre and one terrible game, and was no longer popular."

I laughed.

So shouldn't said Fallout fans like Fallout 3, since according to you, this is a terrible/mediocre game?

Also, Battlefield: Bad Company butchered the lore of previous Battlefield games.

and Madden 09 butchered the lore of previous Madden games.

See where i'm going with this?

[yamo]

the best madden game was the first one for Apple II...it had cross hair passing...soooo much more fun.