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[Neonivek]

One thing that may need to be implimented... well not need... but should...

Is that your goal for Guilds is to in the end Corrupt the guild by placing Dwarves that work to your favor in possitions of power... Or by corrupting those already in power. Though you may not want a Corrupt Guild.

Non-Corrupt Guilds give their members breaks with pay, claim larger wages, train their members.

Corrupt Guilds ask for things for the Guild Master, other members, or treasure for the guild hall of some sort. They could perhaps harass non-members by flogging and other illegal activities. However they would be more likely to try to overturn Noble's punishments.

One thing is that Military Orders and Guilds should be able to help eachother almost as if they were the same guild. For example the Knights Templar originally protected Merchants and other peasants.

[Dae]

I think this should really depend on the GM personality and mental state. It just sounds more DF-like than having corrupt Vs uncorrupt.

[Granite26]

That's the point though.  It depends on the Guildmaster's temperment, so you rig the deck to get the Guildmaster you want.

[Dame de la Licorne]

Edit: Since the topic of this thread has changed, this idea can now be found in the "return of the guilds - guild masters" thread: http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=23965.0

[Dae]

It doesn't really sound like a problem. I mean, every DF player already kills nobles who "like adamantine" or platinum and such. I personally don't, because I think it's funnier and that eventually he'll get killed when the fortress tantrum spiral begins.

I'm honestly not sure about what was said in the last posts. Seems like I've misunderstood something.

I thought a little about milicias, military groups that would be hired to protect important dwarves. Nobles have the Royal guard, Fortress guard would be for elected/named nobles and fortress global order.
Perhaps some guild members, along the more useful in fight, could have a special status as Bodyguard for the GM. As the guild becomes more powerful, it could hire more bodyguard and end up in a strong milicia.

Also, just came to think about another thing : other fortresses are quite similar to yours. With the Caravan Arc, they'd have a production, and due to this the game could track what profession would be dominant there and so how powerful every guild is.
Eventually, the Lolum (wood) Guild in your fortress would only be a part of the whole Lolum Order/Organisation/... This means the Guild in your fortress could use the amounts of wealth of other fortress guilds. And ask for help.

Imagine a guild trying to establish in your fortress, asking for some highly-skilled dwarves in order to boost its productivity.

I'd like to say the last part is only logical deduction. I'm not for or against it.

[Othob Rithol]

I renamed this thread to better fit its topic and am abandoning it. I restarted the original discussion here and incorporated what I was able to dig out this thread that was on topic.

[Dame de la Licorne]

So, in keeping with the structure and politics bent of this thread, why not add the following:
A priesthood.  Established in a similar way to the GMs, but dependent on the number of dwarves who worship a particular deity, and therefore no color association.  The requirements would be the same as a GM, but instead of a guildhall, they would require a temple dedicated to their particular deity.
The priesthood would be another political entity, answering the religious needs of dwarvs.  Perhaps they could encourage dwarves who are "dubious worshippers" (and similarly non-devout) to worship their deity more.  The priests could also attempt to convert other dwarves to their religion (missionaries anyone?) which would lead to conflict between different religions, in addition to what is currently present in-game.  Also, some sects could have more pushy missionaries while others wouldn't care, and all of the in-between levels.

[RedWick]

This idea seems a better fit for the stated intent of this thread than the other one (apologies if this is too off-topic): 

When the economy starts, have the guilds be the ones who are in charge of a shop appropriate to their trade (gem shops, clothing shops, etc.).  Non-economic guilds wouldn't have shops (mining, etc.).  If a guild isn't present in a given fortress, initial shop ownership would default back to the broker. 

Revenue generated from those shops would filter back into the guild coffers.  Any profits from the shop might be distributed amongst guild-members as a way of ensuring that during periods of low activity, they're not evicted from their living quarters.

[Granite26]

This idea seems a better fit for the stated intent of this thread than the other one (apologies if this is too off-topic): 

When the economy starts, have the guilds be the ones who are in charge of a shop appropriate to their trade (gem shops, clothing shops, etc.).  Non-economic guilds wouldn't have shops (mining, etc.).  If a guild isn't present in a given fortress, initial shop ownership would default back to the broker. 

Revenue generated from those shops would filter back into the guild coffers.  Any profits from the shop might be distributed amongst guild-members as a way of ensuring that during periods of low activity, they're not evicted from their living quarters.

Making the GMs run the shops could be an interesting way to keep them from working while still keeping them busy..

[Dae]

From Granite26 in the other thread :

Did anyone ever play Sid Meier's Colonization?  In it, most of the people your colonies attracted were unskilled laborers and indentured servants.  However, you had the option of paying a large sum of money to essentially 'hire' skilled people like schoolteachers and blacksmiths.<P>It is really, really annoying when your fortress only has a few highly-skilled dwarves in some essential skill, and they die.  So...  why not have a noble who lets you make requests for highly-skilled dwarves, by paying some massive signing bonus or providing some specific items they request?  This could actually be done through the trade guild dwarves...  I don't think it should be easy or available early on, but it would help reduce frustration a lot in the late game.<P>It could work a bit like this:  Once you have a dwarf from a noble representative from a particular trade guild, he provides a screen where you can see a list of 'available' highly-skilled dwarves in the skills that that guild covers.  Each of those dwarves would have a set of demands they want satisfied before they'll come to your fortress...  for example, one might want X green glass items, a gold crown, and X amount of cash.  Think of them a bit like nobles, but you have to satisfy their demands just to get them to come; you offer them the necessary objects on the guild-noble screen, and they claim them when they arrive.  (If something has happened to the objects between when you make the offer and when they arrive, of course, they're going to go ballistic.)<P>What do you think?  It would give the player another set of demands, but optional ones, with a reward of a skilled dwarf if they satisfy them.  It would also provide the player with a way to recover quickly if a skilled dwarf dies.<p>[ September 24, 2007: Message edited by: Aquillion ]

It makes sense that if a guild loses an important, higly-skilled member, they could ask another dwarf, as skilled as the lost one was, from another fortress, in another equivalent guild. this would be treated as internal, and the replacing dwarf would come as a migrant (would he deny coming if the fortress attracts no migrants? Or would he consider this as his duty?)

Yet, if your lost highly-skilled useful dwarf was killed and didn't belong to a guild (another argument towards having a guild), your fortress could rent the services of a dwarf who would act exactly the way you described, with at times demands like "coffer in bedroom" and such. If he doesn't have what he wants, he could leave and return to his homefortress. What do you think of it?

[Granite26]

I've never had problems training up my dwarves to do anything, because XP gain is so fast.  Getting a new dwarf from another city would likely take as long as it would for Urist McPeasant to get to passable skill.  That's my two cents.  With the exception of armor makers and weapon makers.  Ordering those sounds nice.