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[RPB]

Just how high are rental costs supposed to be? Thanks to my dedicated and experienced carpenter and mason, the cheapest rooms I have available rent at 200+. Is this monthly? Seasonal? Yearly? If it's yearly, then maybe some of my better off workers could actually hope to afford it eventually, but in the meantime everyone who didn't already own a room when the bookkeeper arrived is sleeping in the barracks. And if it's monthly or seasonal, then the barracks beds are going to be pretty crowded from now on. It seems kind of stupid that the rental cost should be so high--I understand that they're full of nice furniture, but so are the other hundred empty rooms. The bookkeeper needs to have some supply and demand smacked into his head.

[pauli]

my rooms are (er, were) all around 560 a piece; but i don't think they cost rent if you assign them. you can also simply turn off renting that room, and i think people can just move in for free.

[RPB]

The problem is, now that I have a bookkeeper I can't assign rooms to anyone except nobles and legends (who don't need to pay rent anyhow). And I have plenty of rooms that aren't set to rent, but no one's moving in; they just sleep in the barracks instead.

[GauHelldragon]

If you spent all that time and resourses building all those nice rooms, then surely all the dwarves who did all the work were payed decent wages, and should have enough cash to rent em i would think?

[Virtz]

I make 2x2 rooms with a bed and coffer and they're worth about 40-60.

Also, I avoid giving commoners masterpiece furniture so that the nobles don't get upset and that the rent isn't too high.

[RPB]

The dwarves who did all the work already have rooms. The problem is penniless immigrants who I desperately need to handle my hauling load but can't make any money doing so and so can't afford the arbitrarily high rent my broker assigns to the hundred or so rooms that just sit there empty.

I think I figured out how the economy is supposed to work, though. As noted in "Wages", hauling jobs are horribly underpriced--commoners can't afford to take on too many haul jobs or else they'll barely be able to afford food, let alone housing, clothing etc. And high-quality furniture is horribly overvalued--once you get a legendary mason/carpenter/etc., 97% of their production will be useless because no one except nobles and other legends can ever afford to use even their "lesser" quality things (things that are merely exceptional quality instead of masterpieces). Clearly, the solution is to demote your legendary craftsdwarves into being porters and have them do all the hauling, since they're the only ones who can afford to spend time doing it, and have your apprentice carpenters and masons churn out cheap furnishings, because they're the only ones who can make them crappy enough to be useable.

[Baro]

wow sounds like the economy is pretty broken.

When do book keepers show up?

[RPB]

When you mint more than 500 coins (they're produced in stacks of 100). Fortunately this means it's pretty easy to keep them away, although you'll miss out on some later nobles (which I know most people would find oh so disappointing).

[Baro]

What do nobles do, other than turn your communist utopia into a unrealistic fixed-price hell hole?

[Zereth]

The manager and broker are actually quite useful, as they let you know how much the stuff you're trading is worth and give global orders to produce, say, 30 beds without you having to go around and add 30 individual bed orders or put them on repeat and watch them. Given the horror stories of cost of living issues, though, I'm holding off on a bookkeeper for now.

[RPB]

Nobles other than the bookkeeper aren't that bad. They demand fancy living quarters (pretty easy to provide) and some of them will occasionally mandate the production of a certain type of item (annoying but generally tolerable). They sit around and do nothing most of the time, but they will harvest plants, which is nice because then your useful dwarves don't have to waste time doing it. And some of the lower-ranking ones have useful special functions, like the manager lets you queue up production orders using a broader system than going to an individual workshop, and the sheriff and mayor let you assemble a police force that will lock up a tantruming dwarf if they pick a fight or destroy property (this is useful because it'll keep them restrained for several weeks, then when they come out they'll be really happy).

[ August 20, 2006: Message edited by: RPB ]

[Toady One]

I think if you set a room to "no rent", that means instead that you are reserving it as you build up a place for a noble to live.  The economy is a bit strange, and it's hard to get people to find a place to live if you just have good furniture.  There were some req type things up on dev to alleviate this, allowing the market to set the prices by having the rentals work on some kind of invisible "bidding" system every so often or something.  So if you have a bunch of high quality furniture rooms, the rent will still be cheap provided you can't fill them.  If you have only a few low quality rental rooms, only the richest dwarves will take them, at least at prices they are willing to pay.  It probably wouldn't be so hard to set up something simple like this.  Internal prices are somewhat handled like this already when the bookkeepers sets them.  I think the bookkeeper at least checks availability and dwarf prefs.

[Baro]

It would be nice if we could tweek wages and stuff to help promote certain jobs, like hauling.  Or just be nice and spread the wealth around to our much loved citizens.

[Aristharus]

I haven't had any problems with the economy.. yet, at least.

My average rent is pretty high, somewhere around 400-500, but I don't have any dwarves as plain haulers. Everyone has some job assigned to them that gives them money and only time I've seen completely broke dwarves were when I forgot to give some trapper immigrants other jobs than hunting. It's a calm area, so there's not much to hunt. As soon as I gave them farming and alchemy or something they soon got enough money to start living and stop tantruming.

Of course I have people sleeping at the barracks too, but so I did before the economy started. I still don't have any empty rooms even though some of them rent for over 600.

[Darkfall]

1) If the bookkeeper accidentally dies in a horrible, tragic accident, say by being caught in a locked room which floods, does the whole rental/wage structure go away?

2) Do the later nobles that require a bookkeeper check to see if you currently have a bookkeeper, or just check to see if you ever had a bookkeeper?

3) Once those later nobles show up, what happens if your bookkeeper dies in the aforementioned horrible, tragic accident?

I guess I just like my socialist non-economy