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[Mohreb el Yasim]

ok the situation is the next i am thinking about a fortress idee: montain home want to make a mùilitary outpost so they send 7 dwarfes to etablish it. (they were be the cook/breawer/grower/manufacturer) part of the base in a separate part of the fortress (so no acces betwen the 2 part just food/tool transmission. and then all other dwarfes will be the militairs. (ok with training programmes where they hunt, pump, and try many wepons.(i want to make mostly melee becouse i find it more interesting ...)
The question is if you were the montain home wath type of materialm would you provide free for a base like this? (i will mod them in becouse 7 dwarf can't construct enougth for a constantly growing military)
A) just building materiels for site and leather armor/copper wapons
B) middle class wariors provided with iron and the commanders with steel.
C) new ones iron proven ones steel and "the best" for the comanders.

and what you think should i
1) heavey decorate to personalize
2) decorate just the leaders stuff

[R1ck]

To be an truly awesome military base, all the military has to be legendary; aka recruit anyone with legendary skills.

[Deathworks]

Hi!

I have been thinking about your idea for a while now and I believe that your civilian limitation is a bit too strict. You usually don't have only soldier military outposts, you will always have a lot of other personnel who are not soldiers but rather providing the infrastructure needed. So, the outpost you are describing would be a rather awkward experiment from any point of view (including realism).

However, the divided fortress is a nice idea, so I would personally suggest you loosened the civilian restriction a little bit, allowing yourself to increase the civilian population slowly (maybe saying that after the first 7 immigrants, you always have to have at least as many soldiers as civilians or more soldiers than civilians. It would still be heavily militarized, but it would be flexible enough to actually live on its own (another feature for a realistic military outpost - if it can't survive a period of isolation, it is not worth the investment).

The really interesting aspect would be how you would actually enforce the local division between the two sections, especially concerning meeting areas and such.

Anyhow, these are just my thoughts. I am quite curious about what that would look like, so I am looking forward to see more information on your progress.

Deathworks

[Ametsala]

Maybe have the ones with life expectancy of a carrot in a rabbit hole recruits and low level warriors wear leather armor/buckler (so you can easily make them change to shields made of real a material if they survive long enough), the ones with some skill (and who might even survive a battle) wear iron chain mail, ones who are likely to survive a battle wear a steelplate/shield and the legendary ones should wear ☼Steelplate☼/☼Steel Shield☼.

I Think the armors should also have a rising trend of decorations with iron having little and ☼steel☼ having very very much. (No-one wearing a leather armor wants to wear it long it enough to decorate it.)

And maybe start with 2 non-military dwarves: Grover/Cook/Brewer and novice miner/mason/appraiser/judge of intent with competent weapon-/armorsmith.

But as mountainhomes I say B) and 2).

Maybe start in a location with hidden fun stuff so when they're trained enough they can have a real challenge... 


That's my quick thoughts about this.... (It's 2 am here so don't wonder if this post is total gibberish)

[Mohreb el Yasim]

Hi!

I have been thinking about your idea for a while now and I believe that your civilian limitation is a bit too strict. You usually don't have only soldier military outposts, you will always have a lot of other personnel who are not soldiers but rather providing the infrastructure needed. So, the outpost you are describing would be a rather awkward experiment from any point of view (including realism).

However, the divided fortress is a nice idea, so I would personally suggest you loosened the civilian restriction a little bit, allowing yourself to increase the civilian population slowly (maybe saying that after the first 7 immigrants, you always have to have at least as many soldiers as civilians or more soldiers than civilians. It would still be heavily militarized, but it would be flexible enough to actually live on its own (another feature for a realistic military outpost - if it can't survive a period of isolation, it is not worth the investment).

The really interesting aspect would be how you would actually enforce the local division between the two sections, especially concerning meeting areas and such.

Anyhow, these are just my thoughts. I am quite curious about what that would look like, so I am looking forward to see more information on your progress.

Deathworks

and how many civilians would you suggest? (i want to make 100 dwarf fortress, feeded by the only civilians, the other workers(haulers, building maisons, pump operators) would be pre-soliders with hunting and lether armors, some cheap wepon but probably for the honorable positions it will be more some well-trained solider (before legendary to work, and still hunting for have their good shilds and wepons) to be the metalsmith, the glass maker of the hole army, jeweler, lether worker...)

edit:
i just can't find the god spot ... it is hard to find a god pocket - small world with good spot(magma pipe next to a brook with sand) i just have a slow computer so anything bigger will be buggy for later use when sieges will come ...

[Deathworks]

Hi!

It is difficult to name a number. I suggest that you simply default as you seem fit and carefully check your food stock and construction/production side. If things slow down or a shortage seems imminent, have soldiers retire (maybe temporarily). Especially mothers with babies seem to be good candidates for that.

If you have idle non-military dwarves, you can then recruit them to find the right balance.

I know, not very helpful, but that is the best I can say (I never had a real military in my fortresses, so I don't know about its effective drain).

Deathworks

[Mohreb el Yasim]

yes maybe i will do soo, first i wanted to really separate hermeticaly the feeding part of the fortress so it can be well defended(not reachable ...) but maybe i will just have some soldiers doing the food part (by solders i mean trained a bit in arms/wrestling)
the only thing is that it is too hard to find good small spot (like 2*1 brook next to a magma pipe/pool, with sand or pool/pipe + aquifire) with a small world wich have still a nice historie with wars and megabeasts. Is it still more fast to play (a pocket vs a standard map)?

[Deathworks]

Hi!

Both map size and world size seem to influence game speed.

As for history, note that dwarves seem to engrave only history taking place in the subregion they are in. I had fortresses in version 39 where no historic events got recorded even though there were a lot of wars and so on, but once I created fortresses in a forest where humans and elves had been fighting for centuries, I got lots of engravings about that.

If you want interesting history for your fortress, make the variation numbers low (around 100) for all important variations (basically all except volcanism and savagery, which do not seem to change subregion).

For magma, I suggest making volcanism variance 1600 (max) and have 200 volcanoes (max; may be impossible for pocket worlds, never checked).

For a project of that size, you will probably wish to have at least one dimension of your local map be 3. 2x2, for instance, is extremely small, so the division between your two sections would probably be difficult to discern.

Deathworks

[Mohreb el Yasim]

i tougth about smaller like :2x1 or 1x1 fort size (with some design around even separation can work on them) but for military i need water (a wounded dwarf is still a dwarf so don't let 'em die) and for easy construction i need magma+sand (even if i tougth about i just don't feel like put free reactions in my raws it is more challenge withouth) and i was wondering about mega beastes ... isn't there a way to pump them up a bit, so they survive more then 40 years ?

[Deathworks]

Hi!

Well, people have been modding megabeasts to make them more resilient.

Other than that, the main cause of death for megabeasts are civs.

So, you putting restraints on civs can help them survive longer. Restraints include:

Number of civ: Fewer civs - contact less likely.

Population cap: Fewer people - fewer dangerous adventurers - fewer dead megabeasts.

High savagery: It is reported that civs will not build settlements in savagery of 65 or above. So high savagery zones would be more or less off-limits for civ development (although I saw a world gen where someone slew a dragon on a one tile volcano in the middle of the ocean ...). If you don't have any low/middle savagery zones, though, generation will always fail as no civs can be placed.

Cave number: More caves mean more semi-megabeasts who attack and weaken the civs. You have to be careful with the number, though, as it is a reject reason if you don't have enough appropriate terrain for the caves.

Cave size: Not sure about that, but I think bigger caves help. I usually have cave maximum size at 500 (max) and also have minimum at a few hundred.

Evil and good: These are good at stopping humans who are among the most expansive races. In general, evil and good are not settled, except for good forests (elves) and evil mountains (goblins).

Forests vs grassland: Humans are extremely expansive (followed by dwarves), so you may wish to hinder them. Removing the minimum for grassland and hills helps get fewer human settlements, especially if you raise other minima. Elves are not that bad and they usually get wiped out by giants during the first 50 years if you have lots of non-mountain caves. So, having a high forest minimum is also interesting. Deserts and swamps are completely off-limit for settlements, so they are alternatives as well.

However, measures to increase survival rate for megabeasts tend to also result in fewer historical events, so it is very difficult to get all these things together.

Deathworks

[Mohreb el Yasim]

yep i found that too it is always a megabeast OR history situation on smaller maps ... and on biggers, i don't know i wont find out after 10 years old fortress that it become too laggy.
maybe i will add more type of civs(this make more sieges rigth?) for more action (i have some nice idee) and let the megabeast be history ...

[Deathworks]

Hi!

Well, I can't comment on sieges in fortress mode, but if you don't need currently alive megabeasts, I strongly recommend having as many civs as your world size allows.

However, there are a few things that can help keep things interesting:

You need a good number of mountain squares for goblins to survive. Goblins will not settle in anything but dark fortresses, so they need room to expand on their own. Dwarves and humans, however, will settle in conquered dark fortresses, so you can have chain reactions where one fortress after the other is conquered until an entire civ is gone.

If you have real trouble with goblin survival rates, reduce mountain caves - they are also a health risk for goblins, obviously.

In addition, boost evil areas as goblins are the only ones settling in evil mountains.

Dwarves are robust. I regularly see them conquer and inhabit goblin fortresses and I also saw them settling in forest retreats (actually, I saw a world where there were dwarven forest retreats far away from any mountains because they kept pushing forward).

Elves are extremely weak. If they settle near a cave, most of the time, the elves tend to get destroyed before the year 40. So, the number of non-mountain caves is something very difficult when dealing with elves.

To further elves, increase the minimum for forests, drastically.

Also add a bit of good for those good forests they like.

Humans are a pest that will spread quite easily. Reducing the minimum of hills and grassland squares is something you can and should do, although if they are completely nil, humans may actually get whiped out.

As for world gen conflicts, the most fruitful ones are definitely humans vs. elves. If you are able to get a large forest next to a medium-sized hill/grassland mix, you might see centuries of settlements destroyed, rebuilt, conquered, reconquered. It is really great.

However, that situation can always flip over with one side annihilating the other.

Goblins usually cause smaller skirmishes and not that many destroyed settlements, so they are not that exciting.

Deathworks

EDIT: I better get offline now so that I can continue playing that fortress I mentioned. I really hope to get something ready for your dungeon challenge (it's a pity there has been so little resonance thus far).

[Mohreb el Yasim]

the only thing is that your techniks may work on bigger worlds but in the real small ones it is hard to make something where nothing is whiped out in 4 years but there is still some wars/events ...
i think i will go for small worlds so i migth get more interesting results. For the megabeasts i tougth that let them be able to breed migth help them out of being killed all out, do you think will they repopulet their losses, or will they even destroy other civilisations this way?

[Deathworks]

Hi!

Well, I have spent some time experimenting with SMALL maps in 40c and I came up with some that ran quite nicely. One of them, I uploaded at the file depot, together with its gendata in the description.

You can look at the map here and download it from here if it looks promising to you.

However, it had to stop genning at 580 because of imminent human extinction. So yes, keeping races alive is difficult.

About megabeasts, I don't think they will breed. People said that semimegabeasts had all tags needed for breeding, but there are no reports of semimegabeast breading. So, I think a lot of (semi)megabeast stuff is hardcoded.

Cave creatures can and will destroy surrounding settlements (this is why elves last only 20 to 40 years in maps with too many caves).

Deathworks

[Mohreb el Yasim]

maybe i will use thanks ... however i will still try tonigth a bit of map generating (i never tryed this big so i migth find some interesting too and the world generating phase is almost so interessent then the play ) and also becouse i have some mod options i would let enabled (maybe i will even modify them a bit) like all kind of animal-man, and new type of toys (ok i know it is not a big thing but i would that the kids of my solders can play with dwarf crossbowman figurin and toy castels, just for the feeling) stone selection is a nice thing too ...

i found an awsome world so i migth begin it soon ... i just need to prospect his history, to see at wath point it will be go0d to begin (ok megabeast wont be in becouse the last died in around 250 and i wont begin so soon) i think i will search for the first elf-human wars or when goblins established their 3st fortress or something wich can make dwarfs think about the urgent need of strongering military ...) then i will need to find some location and design some designs and propose it to be disguissed by the dwarven concil ... however it can take time in Real life becouse i have not much game time till monday and i will try to make my madmen post too so be patiantes (if you are interested