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[BurnedToast]

The thing everyone is missing in this wonderful argument is that FPS matters alot less because there is not a hell of a lot of movement in DF (at least relative to most games/movies) and that the movement is in large chunks (one square at a time). Can you tell the difference between 30 fps and 60 fps in a FPS? yes, certainly. in DF? I rather doubt it.

That said, I've never gotten much of an improvement in FPS from changing the gfps cap. When the option was first started I tested it and got less then a 10% improvement in FPS from gfps 5 to gfps 500 so I leave it at default. If it works better for you, great! but it's not some magic bullet to double everyone's FPS.

Also: subliminal messaging has largely been debunked, so the answer is it does not work in the first place.

[Draco18s]

When the option was first started I tested it and got less then a 10% improvement in FPS from gfps 5 to gfps 500 so I leave it at default.

I drop mine to 30 just to leave it at a number that's generally high enough that won't use my graphics card that much (I'm using a onboard radeon card in my laptop, so more updates means more heat, though DF nukes my CPU anyway).

[Tamren]

Also: Read the bloody link i gave just above your post.

I use an LCD monitor. LCDs don't flicker because the pixels don't change until the computer asks them to.

This issue is argued about a lot and really depends on who is watching. I could care less about 30 over 60. I never notice slight drops under 30 unless the video feed actually gets interrupted, skips frames and plays choppy images. Maybe if I sat and stared while trying to pick out the difference I might see it but meh.

The only fact set in stone is that its pointless to have an FPS faster than about 85. Anything higher is pointless because even your monitor can not display images that fast.

[TheSpaceMan]

There is also a big diffrerence about logical fps and updates per seconds. One react to input, the other doesn't. On of the reason that some people (specialy people playing Quake3) say they notice the difference between 60<->300 fps is that Q3 hade a logical error that made "interesting" things happen due to the logic not being made to run in that speed (aka the gameplay changed slightly due to minor changes in the logic) People might still see and feel different changes i bet over 60 fps. But like i said, it's important to see the different between a logic update and a render. For example, setting a framelimiter to 60 might allow the code to update 10-40k times per frame. Giving a smoothe recived input but actual lag when comparing the rendering. (thats 10k-40k times to react to diffrent input and make logical decisions made upon it)

[Mithaldu]

I never notice slight drops under 30 unless the video feed actually gets interrupted, skips frames and plays choppy images. Maybe if I sat and stared while trying to pick out the difference I might see it but meh.

Missing the point. Still equating interactive and non-interactive.


I agree though that more than 30 is not strictly needed for normal df gameplay, however it is noticable when for example, moving through a list by tapping quickly. I'm mainly posting here because i do not want this myth of "24 fps is good enough for movies, so it's good enough for games too!" to spread.

[Mohreb el Yasim]

so DF should put add if more then 30 GFPS so it could make samo more cash for it's developement
i'm just saying that it is not important if it is not conscius infact you in lower GFPS you make your brain work instead of your processor ... i need brainwork don't you?

[RavingManiac]

Here, think about this: If you couldn't see it at all, how could subliminal messages work in the first place?

They kinda don't.

[Deathworks]

Hi!

On a whim, I changed graphical frame rate while changing the init for 40a.
Now, I started a fortress in 3x3 and I get a frame rate of 90-100! I don't remember having such a frame rate for such a size, not even close to it. So, I can confirm that the change can be quite drastic.

As for the debate what is useful, I simply go by the rule that German DVDs have a little less than 30 frames per second, and they looked fluent enough for me. So, I can live quite happily with 30 frames graphical frame rate, thank you.

The only reason I can see for endorsing a higher frame rate was if you had important things happening each logical frame - then you would miss out information as only about each third logical frame is actually displayed as far as I can tell.

Anyhow, I do not see why people are bashing each other over this. I mean, modifying the init is easy enough. If you want higher speed, lower the graphic frame rate. Play the game. If you don't like what it looks like, increase the graphic frame rate. Find your own personal preferred settings at which you enjoy the game the most!

Deathworks

[erendor]

so if human eye can notice up to, " let just say 100 FPS", why the hell can you hide images alredy in a 30 FPS film? they used this methode (if they don't use it now too) to make hided adds in some film. The brain will notice it but you just will want to drnink a coca but you won't realize the image you've seen.
i am not sure but i think you don't notice more if you are a big gamer neither becouse the best FPS game i know is the life so wachin' that should make the best see...

Like Raving said, subliminal messages are kind of a myth.  It's not really that hard to spot 'subliminal' things in a 30FPS film, especially if not much is going on and the image is significantly different.

Also, the most famous study, where they allegedly put images of burgers and things into a movie and then reported increased sales of burgers/coke were faked.  Completely untrue.

Still, there is the idea that some forms of subliminal messaging work better than others, but there still hasn't been any method found to have very good results.

[Mohreb el Yasim]

Also, the most famous study, where they allegedly put images of burgers and things into a movie and then reported increased sales of burgers/coke were faked.  Completely untrue.

how do you know it is untrue or not?(ok i don't know either i haven't tested, but somany times we say untrue just because it don't please some interests, i hardly belive all these untrue things ...)

[alphafalcon]

about the alledged efficiency of subliminal advertising:
http://www.snopes.com/business/hidden/popcorn.asp

[Mohreb el Yasim]

i beliv it more:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subliminal_message#Visual
but no offense

[Duke 2.0]

 My original post: Spoken by somebody who studied animation. That and knowing DF is nothing like other games when it comes to graphics. In this situation, 24-30 GFPS is fine enough for anybody, as you don't really control these guys. Heck, the only situation where you would have high-speeds and player interactions is where you said, scrolling long lists. Although personally thats a rather trivial thing, as using page up, down, / and * are better for such lists.

 Don't I dare? Static medium? Come now, I never said you should run DF at 12 GFPS. I merely said thats when things start to become fluid. Start is the key word here. 24-30 GFPS really is good for DF(Likely not for other games, where the screen can change greatly every frame.), because most of the time the screen is updating you are not interacting with it. Every interaction happens when the game is paused, so our "gamers eye" doesn't come into play.

 Note that this post would have been a lot shorter if not for the haughty "Don't you dare!" Please, lets keep assumptions that people are talking of things they don't understand off the internet.

[Creamcorn]

Good god! I have 100FPS, with thirty dwarfs!

Usually by now it would have chugged towards between thirty to forty.

I'm keeping these changes, and stopping crapware from running on my PC.

[Draco18s]

so if human eye can notice up to, " let just say 100 FPS", why the hell can you hide images alredy in a 30 FPS film? they used this methode (if they don't use it now too) to make hided adds in some film. The brain will notice it but you just will want to drnink a coca but you won't realize the image you've seen.
i am not sure but i think you don't notice more if you are a big gamer neither becouse the best FPS game i know is the life so wachin' that should make the best see...

Like Raving said, subliminal messages are kind of a myth.  It's not really that hard to spot 'subliminal' things in a 30FPS film, especially if not much is going on and the image is significantly different.

I would make a simple flash movie illustrating this fact, but I'm hungry and lazy right now.