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Author Topic: Spore  (Read 102489 times)

Ivefan

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Re: Spore
« Reply #225 on: September 05, 2008, 12:05:41 pm »

I had almost forgotten about that video... how could they make a game worse by working on it for 3 years? would it not have been better to had released it by maybe 2006 as it were then and then make a "kiddie-edition"?
I mean, they had done all that work already and the game looks near done.

I agree with wallish that EA is probably to blame, and due to their previous conduct it makes me almost certain about it.
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Deon

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Re: Spore
« Reply #226 on: September 05, 2008, 12:32:39 pm »

Quote
Wait, WHAT!?  They removed the terraforming and land-sculpting part of the game!?  That's the part I was most looking forward to!
The terraforming is in. But it's not a terraforming.
What? "Paint earth pink"? "Chocolate wall"? "Tentacle river"? Do they think we're retards or what? Definitely for 5 y.o.
I was expecting for something like "add this gas, remove that gas".

Also I was expecting for some kind of sculpting laser to cut rivers/canyons in planets but instead it's a weird "magic missile" which randomly! creates a river. Grand projects are impossible. What's good in ability to make a river which may break a mountain range you were making for hours to look right? :(

And why do all the creatures breathe the same air? I mean, the atmosphere meaning is not even here. THere's "air" or "no air". Bleh. Don't they know that there're different gases on different planets and creatures may breathe different kind of air? No spacesuits for colonists?....


Too kiddy. A candy-land game.
However you can enjoy it, but only if you try hard. Only the sandbox editor helps it a bit.

And I don't want to tell about diplomacy.
Even MOO3 had better system IMO :). No espionage? No sabotage? No treaties? :( :( :(
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 12:37:54 pm by Deon »
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Deon

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Re: Spore
« Reply #227 on: September 05, 2008, 12:45:02 pm »

However I tried hard to be serious.

My zerg-like killing machines and their world:


Modern combat armor.


"Guardian" spaceship (MOO2 inspired).


Everything terraformed/created from scratch with love...
I think you still can enjoy this game, however it's not the thing they promised to make.

P.S. If you're interested to add my creatures to your endless galaxy:


P.P.S. I've just checked and there's a "plants" folder in "my creations" which is empty!
I think they just acted EA-way again and plan to release an expansion with the plant editor to buy... ->-

Are there people around who still play the game because they've bought it/found something interesting in and they have unique "not-kiddie-ugly-limby" creatures for my zergs to eat? I'm tired of eating fat parrots and space carebears...
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 12:52:47 pm by Deon »
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Ivefan

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Re: Spore
« Reply #228 on: September 05, 2008, 01:09:39 pm »

Do like i did and exterminate everything but a few critters, enough for T3, that you modify to look less stupid.
But then, wasn't the creature varity the only purpose left in this game after the candyfication by EA.
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Tilla

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Re: Spore
« Reply #229 on: September 05, 2008, 01:16:21 pm »

What a huge let down, Will Wright owes me for two years of hype and anticipation now. I still enjoy wandering around doing random junk, but of the 5 phases 2 of them (Tribal and Civ) are complete boring garbage and the others don't live up to anyone's expectations. Boooo.
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Soulwynd

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Re: Spore
« Reply #230 on: September 05, 2008, 01:26:50 pm »

WTB 2005's Spore
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Zemat

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Re: Spore
« Reply #231 on: September 05, 2008, 02:08:17 pm »

Get a grip people, whatever you saw on the 2006 demo it was just that, a demo. If you analyze it and compare it with the other videos from that year you'll realize that whenever they demoed the almost always performed the same actions. Why? because the game was incomplete and broken. They needed to follow a script in order to avoid all the game breaking bugs that would appear if they deviated from the plan. All the companies that release preview demos do the same shit. That's also one of the reasons you saw many things in the demo that are no longer there. They just didn't manage to make them work as they intended and they decided to scrap them (3d swimming, walking algorithms, etc). Although I recognize some stuff must have been removed by EA hands (mating, blood). Other stuff that you see now wasn't even there. The procedural texturing of creatures wasn't done yet, all the creatures used outside the creature editor back then where "hand painted".

If the game was complete back in 2006 why EA would hold it for another 2 and a half years instead of making money with it right there? Remember we are talking about EA. They would rush a game rather than wait for it to be complete and bug free. And I assure that if Will Wright had his way and EA wasn't there to pressure him we wouldn't see Spore in the shelves until 2010 with all the stuff he promised.

I'm not defending the final product. I'm as disappointed as you are from what I read. I just want to clarify that what you saw and you'll see on any preview ever for any product are nothing but lies. And they'll stay as lies until you see the same working as shown on the streets.

Edit: I must say that whatever Will Wright and his pals say about emergence in Spore is complete bullshit. Spore has zero emergence. Game developers hate emergence and they kill it whenever they see it "emerging" in their games. Reason: Loads of "undesirable" consequences like the penis monsters that appeared with the creature creator.
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 02:12:33 pm by Zemat »
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Cthulhu

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Re: Spore
« Reply #232 on: September 05, 2008, 02:34:54 pm »

Hey, maybe EA will lay Will off and he'll make an independent studio. 

Maybe.
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wallish

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Re: Spore
« Reply #233 on: September 05, 2008, 02:38:11 pm »

Get a grip people, whatever you saw on the 2006 demo it was just that, a demo. If you analyze it and compare it with the other videos from that year you'll realize that whenever they demoed the almost always performed the same actions. Why? because the game was incomplete and broken. They needed to follow a script in order to avoid all the game breaking bugs that would appear if they deviated from the plan. All the companies that release preview demos do the same shit. That's also one of the reasons you saw many things in the demo that are no longer there. They just didn't manage to make them work as they intended and they decided to scrap them (3d swimming, walking algorithms, etc). Although I recognize some stuff must have been removed by EA hands (mating, blood). Other stuff that you see now wasn't even there. The procedural texturing of creatures wasn't done yet, all the creatures used outside the creature editor back then where "hand painted".

If the game was complete back in 2006 why EA would hold it for another 2 and a half years instead of making money with it right there? Remember we are talking about EA. They would rush a game rather than wait for it to be complete and bug free. And I assure that if Will Wright had his way and EA wasn't there to pressure him we wouldn't see Spore in the shelves until 2010 with all the stuff he promised.

I'm not defending the final product. I'm as disappointed as you are from what I read. I just want to clarify that what you saw and you'll see on any preview ever for any product are nothing but lies. And they'll stay as lies until you see the same working as shown on the streets.

Edit: I must say that whatever Will Wright and his pals say about emergence in Spore is complete bullshit. Spore has zero emergence. Game developers hate emergence and they kill it whenever they see it "emerging" in their games. Reason: Loads of "undesirable" consequences like the penis monsters that appeared with the creature creator.

I know it was a demo, but my biggest problem is the fact that they used the demo to show off things that the game could do.  I mentioned Peter Molyneux because he is probably most famous for this sort of thing.  He talks about how great the game is and how many amazing things you'll be able to do; then he releases a game that is less than a fifth of what he talked about.

When developers spend the few years before a game's release talking about features 1, 2, 3, and 4, you expect at least 1, 2, 3, and 4.  Now, if the game is released with just 1, 2, and 4 you'd be a little upset but understand.  What Maxis did here was tell us all about 1, 2, 3, 4....18, 19, and 20, repeatedly tease us and tell us about features 1-20.  Then they said "Well, we just have 1-15". And we said okay, that's understandable.  Then they said "We couldn't do 11-15, so you'll just have 1-10", which was fine because 1-10 was what we cared about. Then they released a game that had 1, 2, and 3.

What I'm trying (and probably failing) to say is that they promised us Spore and released a game that I would expect to have seen for the Wii version or something.  They took a majority of the special things that made Spore unique and cut them out.  Then they took the few things they left in and chopped them up into Gerber sized jars so they could be consumed by infants.  Then they painted the jars with bright pretty colors.

It's like if Toady fixed a few more bugs and then at the next devlog announced that DF is now version 1.0 and he's not going to add anything more (because the rest of the stuff was too hard to do).  I honestly would've been pissed had they delayed the game till 2010, but at least I'd end up getting that kick ass game they revealed in 2005.  Instead I get colorful baby food that manages to taste terrible anyways.

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Tormy

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Re: Spore
« Reply #234 on: September 05, 2008, 03:26:09 pm »


"Guardian" spaceship (MOO2 inspired).



wow heh! galciv2 is far better looking!  ;D
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Brendan

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Re: Spore
« Reply #235 on: September 05, 2008, 04:05:36 pm »

I've played the 'full demo' and here are my opinions:

Cell Phase : Actually kind of fun, because I liked fl0w. A cute minigame that occupies you for about ten minutes. I played as a carnivore, while my friend who played as a herbivore said it was mind-numbingly boring. YMMV.

Creature Phase: This is my favorite part of the game, and honestly, the only thing which I think was done right. It's challenging and fun, although the stats from body parts work oddly, as has been said elsewhere in the thread. (perhaps to mitigate the benefits of powergaming?) There are epic creatures here which really are epic-sized but you haven't got a snowball's chance in hell of killing them, at least without powerful allies (another epic? I don't know if you can convert them, but you can definitely convert rogues)

On the other hand it's all over far too quickly and there aren't enough body parts (this is probably EA's animalistic lust for expansion packs talking). There are essentially four different 'styles' : weird alien things (eyestalks, spindly hands, pincers, suckers) bears (claws, sharp teeth, paws) and...two other styles that I can't remember, but there are basically four levels of each style for each limb...

Having played as a predatory carnivore, YMMV.

Tribal Phase: This plays basically like a bad RTS, complete with the bad pathfinding. You have three types of units: axemen (good against infantry, bad against buildings) firestarters (bad against infantry, good against buildings) and spearmen (bad against both, but ranged). Firestarters are completely pointless as there are no creatures who fight back, and spearmen aren't smart enough to 'skirmish' and so get killed pretty quickly, so you pretty much have to mass axeman and just rush at enemy camps. And you will win. It takes forever, but it's not difficult.

There's an option to 'impress' other tribes into your own but I've not used that.

Civilization Phase: See above, but with cities. If your planet is all on one continent I guess you could just mass tanks and conquer the planet. You can design your own units and the AI tends to have 'balanced' units which are equally bad at everything, so you can pretty much steamroll over everyone with high-attack units.

This takes forever and is really boring. There are some special abilities including ICBMs which, when I used, pretty much won the game for me as there were only three rival cities left which were immediately destroyed.

Space Phase: I had high hopes for this one. I expected that every other phase would be a footnote compared to the space phase. How wrong I was.

This is essentially a really bad RPG...in spaaaace! You go from planet to planet, doing fetch quests or 'killing wildlife' quests for 'Sporebucks'. There are also pirates, who seem to be there PURELY because someone in EA thought 'It's not sci-fi without space pirates!' Seriously, there is no explanation for why they are there, no reason for them trying to kill you (it's not like you ever lose anything by dying, so what could they gain?) and they don't even have a representative species; they're just 'space pirates'.

The terraforming/sculpting aspect of the space phase is there, but it has been hung, drawn, quartered and gutted and then its foul corpse has been brought back to life by some kind of evil necromancy. The tools on offer are various environmental changers (temperature and 'atmosphere', which seems to be always breathable by anything and changing it basically means adding or taking it away) which, annoyingly, can only be bought one at a time, and you need something like 2-3 environmental changers to turn an inhabitable planet uninhabitable and vice versa. You can also 'paint' the skies or the ground in different solid colours (no shades here, but coming soon, Spore: Terraforming Paint Stuff! Only $19.99.) and change the ground into different patterns, like...chocolate, and tentacles, and 'cute canyons' and 'crystal chasms' (none of the crystal things I unlocked worked for me :-\)

The interactions with species are either really annoying or really simple. With pre-warp species in the tribal phase you can abduct them, kill them all or leave crop circles (the purpose of which I have yet to figure out). With civilization species you can do the same, except you can also scan their buildings and learn about their designs, and it takes far, far, FAR longer to kill them. (It took me about 30 minutes to wipe out a map of sentient civs with the medium-strength weapons) Also, alliances and trade routes require CONSTANT attention. If you aren't continually supplicating each of your allied races they will throw a fit and stop cooperating with you until you give them more cash.

I guess the point of this is eventual galactic conquest/hegemony like in the other phases, but you also get 'badges' for doing things, like you will get 'Missionista' badges for doing lots of quests and you will get 'Gopher' badges for doing lots of fetch quests, etcetera. It's basically all grinding and none of the fun world-smashing where you are almost omnipotent, as the previews seemed to imply...

All in all I think Spore is a decent enough collection of minigames but as a game that took more than three years to make and also required EA to remove any limitations on budgetting for Maxis, I have to wonder what the hell they were messing about with unless they were busy making the sixteen expansion packs in advance. (If you think I'm exaggerating, I'm not; Sims 2 had about sixteen)
« Last Edit: September 05, 2008, 04:08:26 pm by Brendan »
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Rilder

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Re: Spore
« Reply #236 on: September 05, 2008, 04:19:35 pm »


"Guardian" spaceship (MOO2 inspired).



wow heh! galciv2 is far better looking!  ;D

You do know that he saved as .jpg and probably in paint, saving as jpg without using photoshop or gimp or whatever has a tendency to tally screw the quality of an image.


Also, I want spore soo much.. hurry up sunday!
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Cthulhu

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Re: Spore
« Reply #237 on: September 05, 2008, 05:55:18 pm »

I'll probably still get it, I tend to find the best in everything, I can't name a single game that I absolutely hate.

Question: Are the stage-ends something that inevitably comes, or could I spend all the time I want in any one stage?
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Torak

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Re: Spore
« Reply #238 on: September 05, 2008, 06:02:38 pm »

I'll probably still get it, I tend to find the best in everything, I can't name a single game that I absolutely hate.

Question: Are the stage-ends something that inevitably comes, or could I spend all the time I want in any one stage?


You can stay as long as you want in any stage without advancing, but it's only really useful in creature Stage, the rest don't allow any more growth (once you reach the end of the stage) so it's rather useless to dawdle.
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Cthulhu

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Re: Spore
« Reply #239 on: September 05, 2008, 06:07:05 pm »

Good, good.
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