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[Othob Rithol]

When I initially didn't put up your embark modification, Wahnsinger, I was adamantly trying to avoid breaking the "game mechanic" wall. Now that the primary list has been filled very well in 13 pages of discussion I will add it in, with an apology. I still want to avoid this thread getting sidetracked however, but your suggestion applies strictly to what is here, so it fits.

You'll be happy to know, Inq. Saturn, that all your points are in the list already (although some under other names). I'll be renaming a few to make them more eye-catching, as well as integrating some of your wiki links.

Most of the (I)nit options I listed were actually for FPS killers. I think that is one more category where one is appropriate (ie Weather). Since this whole thread is actually an advisement to Toady, I thought it best to include them. I'll review all of them. If you see one you really object to, PM me. I'd prefer the thread not turn into debate about an ancillary issue. (Part of it being a managed thread is I have to read and reread every post, line, and comment)

edit:Removed 5 (I) tags. All those that remain are ones likely to add additional processing (thus hit FPS), radically change the mountain (Dig Deeper - which Toady isn't likely to try -see his quote) or involved cave-in mechanics (A WIP concept that is currently already an init option - I'd suggest bundling all of these ideas under the existing init option)

[Sunday]

There has been some talk of biome specific features - I like this idea.

One I had was 'crevasses' which are very similar to chasms, but they exist only in glaciers, and are populated by evil snow creatures.  For more fun, make the crevasses invisible until stepped on by a creature, who then falls to their death.

There could be a certain kind of sand that is somehow deadly - I'm thinking the tidal dust basins of Dune.  Or even the drum sands (perhaps they attract a certain type of monster/semimegabeast).  I think this would qualify as underground diversity, but if it doesn't I'm sorry in advance.

[Othob Rithol]

Ill add both to the entry for chasms etc in non-mountainous biomes.

edit: actually just added crevasses.

Patches of deadly sand really is a surface feature, and sand worms et al are already covered under burrowing creatures.

Sorry if your ideas didn't get the attention you hoped, but the list is starting to get so well developed that a new entry is getting rare. However modifications to the existing entries are always good (we have 20 iron bars, let's make steel) like your excellent crevasse addition.

[Granite26]

Maybe, but sand as magma-esque flows dropping into underground chambers (sinkholes) is possible.  Especially if the sinkhole is your fort

or worse, you build your fort in sand, breach the underground cave, and the sand starts flowing into the cave.   That would be a GREAT way to have fun

Something like a high enough viscosity that allows pyramid shaped piles to be possible... (Think Boulder Dash)

[Chthonic]

This thread . . . is beautiful.

May Toady smile upon these suggestions.

[Othob Rithol]

I came across an old thread here that I will try to integrate portions of into the main list.

[Tormy]

I came across an old thread here that I will try to integrate portions of into the main list.

Bah! I remembered that there was a a sorta similar topic in the past, but I was unable to find it...

[Sprout]

Speaking of Dune, we need giant burrowing sand worms that randomly burst out of deserts and eat the caravan/immigrants. Or possibly drag them to their underground lair where they are forced to participate in a ridiculous reality TV show based on a giant sand worm and his 349 kids. Hungry kids.

[DKGafgar]

Caverns need to be multiple Z-levels high - I've been wanting to build underground human-style cities and towers since forever, but digging out a suitable cavern takes forever.

[Othob Rithol]

modified the caverns entry to explicitly say "multple z-levels". It was implied, but is now clear.

[Cheshire Cat]

skimming through the latest replies on this thread, i still havent seen anyone point out the similarities of some of toadyone's creatures and some of the beasts that show up in the grande olde hollywood flicks of the middle 20th century. creatures like the bronze colossus and the hydra from jason and the argonauts.

ray harryhousen, the special effects guy who brought these fantastic beasties to life on screen also did antmen living beneath the moons surface in "first men in the moon." i think it provides an excellent reference for what people are saying they want to find when they go digging in non mountain areas.


http://bp3.blogger.com/_xQwP8MNj0EA/RpxwCMMFVkI/AAAAAAAACVY/rw9VZmEouX8/s1600-h/1stmn020.jpg

above you can see there some antmen in the corners using a stick that shoots lightening to take down a giant caterpillar that is wandering around a cavern filled with huge quartz crystals. wouldn't it be great to come across this sort of thing out there under those grassy hills? how abouts if the only way through that aquifer was a rather nice cavern inhabited by said creatures. incentive to save up for those steel and iron weapons on the caravan....

caterpillars or centipedes that have a "head" and "body" segments that follow along behind like in the old game snake would be great.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

 finding your way down the caverns to eventually breach an antman fortress complete with traps and siege defenses on the lowest z levels would be a fantastic alternative way of getting ahold of adamantium.

you can check out lots more ray harryhousen creations, including great sketches and pictures of the hydra and colossus at the same site - http://monsterbrains.blogspot.com/2007_07_15_archive.html

heres more antmen


http://bp0.blogger.com/_xQwP8MNj0EA/RpxwQcMFVmI/AAAAAAAACVo/KZvs2I9LS_8/s1600-h/firstmenconcept2.jpg

and the caterpillar, also known to the production team as a "moon cow". imagine the meat of that...


http://bp0.blogger.com/_xQwP8MNj0EA/RpxwKcMFVlI/AAAAAAAACVg/8aKCDVlGJDo/s1600-h/firstmenconcept5.jpg

also, i totally cant figure out how to make the images actually appear in the post... if someone can post them properly or unstupify me in this regard i would be pleased.

[Cheshire Cat]

Caverns need to be multiple Z-levels high - I've been wanting to build underground human-style cities and towers since forever, but digging out a suitable cavern takes forever.

do you try digging out an identical area on multiple z levels and then collapsing the roof on the top one using supports/levers? the collapse crashes through every mined z level below it, leaving a lot of stone at the bottom for building. infinitely faster then channeling, and requires far less micro.

i use this technique all the time when i want a really deep pit to throw goblin prisoners to their death in, or to dispose of excess kittens that are slowing up my fortress. somehow their limbs and heads and things always end up on random z levels in the middle of the shaft. i haven't figured out if this is from them catching as they fall or the pieces bouncing back up again.....

giant huge pits like this also makes for impressively big waterfalls.

p.s, deliberately collapsing the roof onto and/or the floor out from under an invading force using grates as supporting bridges is fun!

[isitanos]

also, i totally cant figure out how to make the images actually appear in the post... if someone can post them properly or unstupify me in this regard i would be pleased.

To post images, you use the "Insert image" button and paste the URL in the dialog box that opens. Or, if you want to do it manually, you put your URL between img tags.

Edit: but, when I try it with one of your images, it doesn't seem to work: the "moon cow" should be displayed below. Maybe some restriction Toady put in the forum to avoid huge images, or something like that?

[Entity]

Highly interesting suggestions here. Some things I'd like :

Oil creatures - very strange fish; oilsquid; oilweed; "tar babies" that sneak about and trap dwarves like webs; on "Evil" maps, undead fossils crawling out of what's become of the ancient sea they died in. If ventilation is introduced as a mechanic, oil creatures could either die or grow faster, or be able to run faster, if the area is oxygenated - some may be anaerobic, but with such an energy-rich foodstuff as oil, lifeforms that could handle oxygen would have a turbocharged metabolism.

Fossil dinosaurs/mummies/strangely preserved bodies entombed in rock: I want a message saying I've found a strange petrified body. Being sensible, I leave it alone... until some noble mandates it being dug up (as a statue), then placed in their bedroom. Where it sits quietly, looking pretty, for a while.

What would also be awesome is if you free some terrible and dread creature and the first thing it does is kill the miner, grab his pick, and go off to dig out its friends.

Certain types of underground bad mojo could have a connection with things like fell moods or dwarves' mental states. HFS could lead to a dwarf having strange dreams and engraving more pictures of demons than you'd expect from the statistical average. Or the dwarf wearing that artifact dwarfskin cloak (that used to be your best mason) could sleepwalk down to the adamantine vein with a pick in hand...

[MetBoy]

Caverns need to be multiple Z-levels high - I've been wanting to build underground human-style cities and towers since forever, but digging out a suitable cavern takes forever.

do you try digging out an identical area on multiple z levels and then collapsing the roof on the top one using supports/levers? the collapse crashes through every mined z level below it, leaving a lot of stone at the bottom for building. infinitely faster then channeling, and requires far less micro.

This technique is one I'm going to have to try... but to actually contribute to things:

Deep Dwarves: AKA, Sunlight is for Pussies. It would require extremely long natural tunnels, possibly connecting caves like roads connect cities. The 'Embark to Tunnels' would start your dwarves out in one of these long tunnels, wagon and everything. It would be a 'challenge embark' option most likely; not something recommended for novices.