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[Shades]

Instead, let's concentrate on, for example, what variables should matter, how they are influenced, what farming tasks can be influenced by the player and what tasks the dwarves ought to to automatically, etc.

For the most part I think everything should be automatically done other than setting the farmland and marking what crops/fertilisation/etc should be done. Player does setup and lets it run is a good way.

[Soralin]

That leaves you with approximately 4400 tiles worth of farms, or about 2 embark tiles (48x48 dwarf tiles ea.) on 1 z level.

Which is still too much IMO.

That's not that much really, it sounds like a lot, but when you look at that area carved out, it doesn't seem like too much to sustain a 200 dwarf fortress.  For an idea of how much space it would be, I built a tree farm in my first fortress, that was irrigated, and had almost 10000 tiles over 4 levels (a bit more if you include the overflow areas).  Look at http://mkv25.net/dfma/poi-8015-treefarms It doesn't seem that big for the number of tiles that it is, and you'd only need less then half that space for a farm capable of supporting 200 dwarves using that number.  I mean, look at the size of my actual farms on that map, if you can find them.  They're tiny compared to everything else, and they generate an absurd surplus of food.

[Draco18s]

That's not that much really, it sounds like a lot, but when you look at that area carved out, it doesn't seem like too much to sustain a 200 dwarf fortress.  For an idea of how much space it would be, I built a tree farm in my first fortress, that was irrigated, and had almost 10000 tiles over 4 levels (a bit more if you include the overflow areas).  Look at http://mkv25.net/dfma/poi-8015-treefarms It doesn't seem that big for the number of tiles that it is, and you'd only need less then half that space for a farm capable of supporting 200 dwarves using that number.  I mean, look at the size of my actual farms on that map, if you can find them.  They're tiny compared to everything else, and they generate an absurd surplus of food.

OK, I'll concede that 4400 tiles for 200 dwarves isn't too extravagant.  I only go up to 100 dwarves, so I think I could stand 2200 tiles.
(That works out to 22 tiles per dwarf per year).

[SlipshodDorf]

My only issue with the large number of tiles, is the time it will take for the dwarfs to actually traverse the tiles, granted Z levels nullify this greatly if you build in a cube, but from my own perspective it feels like a logistical nightmare, where haulers would have quite long treks to make, unless you use stockpile chains. At least until stacking for food items and the like works well anyways.

I would however like to see farming tiles have a bit more restriction though, maybe even take up multiple Z levels in some instances (trees for example), since soft ground + tunnel, would make me think it would be dangerous.

I also agree with kohaku on the "orchard" farming prospect as well, where you could plant fruit/nut trees and they would only produce during a certain point of the year, and require less maintenance by dwarfs (mostly only if we are still talking the whole 4400 tiles POV).

[Soralin]

Yeah, some improved hauling behavior would definitely help out here.  So that someone harvesting a field could just go down a row and toss each harvested plant into a backpack, until it gets full or too heavy, and then dropping off the entire stack.  The same goes for picking up one seed at a time, and planting it, and going back for another, rather than just picking up a whole bag of seeds.

[Andeerz]

Soralin, yer treefarm fort gives me hope and happiness.  :3

[Shades]

OK, I'll concede that 4400 tiles for 200 dwarves isn't too extravagant.  I only go up to 100 dwarves, so I think I could stand 2200 tiles.
(That works out to 22 tiles per dwarf per year).

A 20 by 20 by 20 block is 8000 tiles, that seems quiet small really and is twice as much as you'd need. Although I still think increasing the time to plant but not necessarily the yield (and so size of farms) is the way to go.

[Draco18s]

A 20 by 20 by 20 block is 8000 tiles, that seems quiet small really and is twice as much as you'd need. Although I still think increasing the time to plant but not necessarily the yield (and so size of farms) is the way to go.

Twenty floors of farms is "small"?

[Andeerz]

Dood, it's not that small, but it's manageable at least for me.  My fort right now is 10 floors of larger areas than that.  Considering five competent miners can clear that amount of area probably within a season of mining, that's not unfeasible.  But I see your point...

[Pilsu]

The smallest possible embark area is 2x2. How many X and Y tiles is that?

[Andeerz]

96 by 96 I think?

[Shades]

A 20 by 20 by 20 block is 8000 tiles, that seems quiet small really and is twice as much as you'd need. Although I still think increasing the time to plant but not necessarily the yield (and so size of farms) is the way to go.

Twenty floors of farms is "small"?

Would 20 by 20 by 10 make you happier? or even just 200 by 20 if only number of floors is a concern to you I think it's small, you may (and clearly do) think it's not. Either way I think more work-time and not more farm land is preferable.

Edit: my brain is clearly broken.

[Draco18s]

Would 20 by 20 by 10 make you happier? or even just 200 by 200 if only number of floors is a concern to you I think it's small, you may (and clearly do) think it's not. Either way I think more work-time and not more farm land is preferable.

FYI 200*200 = 40,000.

[Shades]

Would 20 by 20 by 10 make you happier? or even just 200 by 200 if only number of floors is a concern to you I think it's small, you may (and clearly do) think it's not. Either way I think more work-time and not more farm land is preferable.

FYI 200*200 = 40,000.

Brain fail :/ how can I do cubic numbers but not square ones?

[Draco18s]

Brain fail :/ how can I do cubic numbers but not square ones?

Beats me.  Of course, I'm trying to figure out why some machines (eg. Mac OS 10.0.6) don't like the javascript function postMessage.

(Work's project is Fun, alright.  You try intercommunication between Flex/Flash, HTML, and PDFs, using giant javascript chains).