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[Mikademus]

Personally would enjoy seeing a dwarf trying to bite off his own body parts and break bones in his body.

Nonononono, emotards are enough an annoyance in real life, I don't want them in DF too!

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This thread is brimming with excellent ideas! Most threads now are just rehashes of what has been said a million times already, but virtually any post in this thread by itself (except the one where you don't know if a dwarf is in a mood, which is a horrible one) would life DF and the body taken together would be an immense improvement!

My favourite ones are

* Moods turning into other moods (fey-->murderously morbid or possessed)
* Possession-->actual daemonic possession
* Desperate dwarves stealing (recycling) what they need

Another mood idea is that dwarves could go questing for missing components (naturally a dangerous undertaking).

[Qmarx]

possible effects could include invasions of megabeasts or demons, the creation of a new pit going down to the centre of the earth, the dead rising from their graves, or the fortresses own civilization turning against them and attacking them because of the evil they have created.

Wait... I thought there were supposed to be *negative* consequences for failure.  This seems more of a win-win.

[erendor]

I think the emotional extremes should be turned down a bit, and quality standards for items raised a bit. Anyone can get a legendary dining room fairly easily, and that alone is enough to make dwarfs tha eat in it completely ecstatic. That, and bad moods are retardedly deadly. One dwarf's death should not be enough to chain-react the whole fort into chaos, and it currently can if that person knows enough people.

Morale should be more fluid instead of black and white, maybe happy dwarves work a little faster, and ones in bad moods are less efficient or even slack off from doing their jobs. Some kind of benefits/disadvantages to actually taking care of your dwarves. And on that same note, When is there ever going to be some kind of benefit to having nobles? Or penalties for killing them?

Maybe I need to start my own thread...

Nobles come with penalties!  Toady said so in the Migrusut thread, I think.  If your fortress gets a reputation as a 'death trap', via lots of deaths (and particularly noble ones), immigrants stop coming for a while, until the deaths die down.

[Moron]

possible effects could include invasions of megabeasts or demons, the creation of a new pit going down to the centre of the earth, the dead rising from their graves, or the fortresses own civilization turning against them and attacking them because of the evil they have created.

Wait... I thought there were supposed to be *negative* consequences for failure.  This seems more of a win-win.

Well, the idea was for them to be 'negative' from the point of view of the dwarves but still interesting for the player. You could end up with the cursed Backpack of Micromanagement that made all dwarves keep forgetting their work preferences so you had to constantly re-designate them, but I doubt it would please many players.

[Techhead]

Sorry, the problem was with the first guy's formula, your formula fixed it.

Dining Room 2: 14x36 hall, the long walls lined completely with masterwork stone statues of 72 dwarven kings overlooking three 2x30 dining *tables* flanked by *chairs* - value: 129.87 dwarfbucks { 108000 / (504+420) / .9 }

[Draco18s]

Sorry, the problem was with the first guy's formula, your formula fixed it.

Dining Room 2: 14x36 hall, the long walls lined completely with masterwork stone statues of 72 dwarven kings overlooking three 2x30 dining *tables* flanked by *chairs* - value: 129.87 dwarfbucks { 108000 / (504+420) / .9 }

I worked long and hard on my formula, had to make it so that +furniture+ in a 4x1 hole still came up as meager, yet still get everything else to line up.
The forumla is this (the size bonus is weird, I don't remember how I came up with it):

F = Average furniture value
R = Average room tile value (walls and floors)
V = Raw value (the one currently used)
S = Size bonus

(F*R+V)/25+S

S is calculated as follows:

F = #floors
W = #walls
f = average floor tile value
w = average wall tile value

S = (F-1)*(W*w+F*f)/(W+(F*0.75))

Reasoning spoilered.

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The size bonus came from wanting to distinguish a large room from a small room with otherwise the same raw value, but not be so different that a HUGE room with one piece of furniture made it legendary (although a 87x87 or larger room with a grey stone table still qualifies, but I don't think DF has rooms go that big--I suppose you could put in some kind of limiter though).

Formula's construction started as a average value of the room tiles (W*w+F*f)/(W+F) with weighting given to walls because of floors relative abundance (as a room gets larger it gains 2 wall tiles and N floor tiles) then multiplied by the number of walkable spaces in the room (F-1).  I forget why the -1 was there, oh, the tile the door occupies.

I did all my forumlas assuming that one wall had been mined out and replaced by a door (though the door itself may not have been installed), so that part was accounting for the inside of the room, not the full number of tiles.

The 0.75 in F*0.75 was chosen because at all room sizes the average tile value never rises too far above the wall value (a 100 by 100 room sees a value of 5.3 for smoothed walls (5) and floors (4)).  Oh, just noticed, in the first forumla, this same weighting is used there as well--though it matter very very little, a dwarfbuck or less.

Link to original post about it

[Qmarx]

possible effects could include invasions of megabeasts or demons, the creation of a new pit going down to the centre of the earth, the dead rising from their graves, or the fortresses own civilization turning against them and attacking them because of the evil they have created.

Wait... I thought there were supposed to be *negative* consequences for failure.  This seems more of a win-win.

Well, the idea was for them to be 'negative' from the point of view of the dwarves but still interesting for the player. You could end up with the cursed Backpack of Micromanagement that made all dwarves keep forgetting their work preferences so you had to constantly re-designate them, but I doubt it would please many players.

I was thinking something more along the lines of a cursed artifact sword that made the champion who equipped it berserk.  You know, stuff that has a direct negative effect, instead of "you get a lot of free bones/combat xp/iron for smelting".

[Sindayven]

A failed dwarf could make a dwarf realize he needs change in his life.

The results of this could be a change in personality, as already suggested. But perhaps it could mean that the dwarf might loose experience in the skill that was related to his failed artifact, this experience could then be partially transferred to some other skill.

Another cool thing would be if the dwarf would steal some armor, weapons, food, and other supplies, and then just leave your fortress in search of adventure and maybe something to give his life meaning again.

This is my favourite idea. It'd also be cool if you could control him in adventure mode after the inevitable collapse of your fortress.

[MMad]

Many of these ideas are great, but I don't think very harsh failures meshes very well with the way moods work now - meaning, how often success or failure is simply out of your control. Like the idiot weaver I've got standing on my barren, waterless mountain top right now screaming for shells, or anyone who has ever demanded glass on a map without sand.

On the other hand, it's lots of fun to have some elements the player can't control or prepare for - semirandom invasions, foreign visits, weather, relationship dramas or other weird events would be awesome for this reason - but it's not fun to lose your whole fortress to a completely random occurance. Losing a dwarf is fine though.

Why not let the moody dwarfes aquire the ressources in other ways then from stockpiles ?

Just before going nova, they could check the fortress for substitutions ...

Urist McFeydwarf : My this steel floodgate is just what I need, surely nobody will miss it from this
remote tunnel, and it feels just so warm under my hands.

or

Bomrek Nobleguy : Has anybody seen my golden, gem encrusted cabinet ?

I *love* this idea!

A failed dwarf could make a dwarf realize he needs change in his life.

The results of this could be a change in personality, as already suggested. But perhaps it could mean that the dwarf might loose experience in the skill that was related to his failed artifact, this experience could then be partially transferred to some other skill.

Another cool thing would be if the dwarf would steal some armor, weapons, food, and other supplies, and then just leave your fortress in search of adventure and maybe something to give his life meaning again.

While I kinda like the idea that a failed mood should be invariably fatal (just one of those quirks of the dwarven mind) I like this idea as well. Perhaps different kinds of moods could have different results if they fail? I.e. fey moods might be fatal, possessions could lead to insanity, others might just lead to the dwarf becoming chronically depressed, but not necessarily suicidal... I dunno.

[Techhead]

A "depressed" option would be nice, where a dwarf goes back to his duties but does not eat food. Of course, a depressed dwarf will still try to drink his sorrows away.

The problem with dwarves stealing material is that they only need raw material, so furniture would likely not be stolen. Nice idea, but it wouldn't work. The only thing they could steal would be building materials, and those wouldn't be stolen.

[Qmarx]

The problem with dwarves stealing material is that they only need raw material, so furniture would likely not be stolen. Nice idea, but it wouldn't work. The only thing they could steal would be building materials, and those wouldn't be stolen.

You can melt furniture into bars... a moody dwarf could probably get something out of it a floodgate.

[Techhead]

Except for the fact that he's working at a forge, not a smelter.

[penguinofhonor]

The problem with dwarves stealing material is that they only need raw material, so furniture would likely not be stolen. Nice idea, but it wouldn't work. The only thing they could steal would be building materials, and those wouldn't be stolen.

Fey/Possessed dwarves can already make plate mail out of a single adamantine wafer without any fuel. I think they could mess around with furniture and stuff to make a flawed artifact out of the materials.

[Pickerel]

Disenchanted with Armok for not supplying him with the propper materials, for a wonderous sword to be forged in Armok's own legacy, Urist had become a legendary brewer.
Urist Zweistein has gained experience.
Urist Zweistein has claimed a Brewery.
Urist Zweistein has begun a mysterious creation.
Urist Zweistein has created Ustrubpuktabukra Sasperbaplik, "The silken drawers of rememberence", a gold booze bomb.
Urist Zweistein has died in the heat.
Urist Urgarbog has burned to death.
Urist Uhrshtul has died in the heat.
Burkatsatonmat Dogwagged has been shot and killed.
Urist Uristsod has died in the heat.
Uankle Todorok has burned to death.
A Stray Elephant has died in the heat.
Rogbuktak Dekten has been shot and killed.
Kartkary Betgerguy, human liason has died in the heat.
Kartkary Betgerguy, human liason has left unhappily.

Ustrubpuktabukra Sasperbaplik, "The silken drawers of rememberence"
This is a booze bomb, made of gold.  All craftsmanship is of the highest quality.  It is decorated with rings of electrum.  It menaces with spikes of iron and green glass.  There is an image of a dwarf and dwarves in turtle shell.  The dwarf is making an obscene gesture at the dwarves. 
There is an image of a dwarf in red maple logs.  The dwarf is brandishing a booze bomb. 
There is an image of a dwarf in crystal glass.  The dwarf is surrounded by dwarves. 
There is an image of dwarves in cave spider silk.  The dwarves are dead.

[i2amroy]

Fey/Possessed dwarves can already make plate mail out of a single adamantine wafer without any fuel. I think they could mess around with furniture and stuff to make a flawed artifact out of the materials.

Yeah those fey/possessed dwarves can actually think hard enough to duplicate materials in the world around them. Of course, think this hard creates so much heat in there bodies that they can then forge things together with their bare hands. It makes perfect sense.