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Author Topic: The NEW Future of the Fortress  (Read 353280 times)

Techhead

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #600 on: November 21, 2008, 11:05:10 pm »

So who is planning to mod in sweet pod syrup men?
Everyone.
Everyone wants the candyman to come to town.
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Duke 2.0

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #601 on: November 21, 2008, 11:08:11 pm »

So who is planning to mod in sweet pod syrup men?
Everyone.
Everyone wants the candyman to come to town.
If we had an idea of what the new RAW's looked like, I would post the code for a gingerbread man.
 Now if only we could make them weak to wate-

 Idea: Do water elementals die if they are frozen in a freezing biome, or become ice elementals...
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Mel_Vixen

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #602 on: November 21, 2008, 11:51:31 pm »

And at other temperatures fog/steam elementals thought that wouldnt work even with the new Raws aslong there isnt an form of trigger or something that can incoorporate temperatur.
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Granite26

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #603 on: November 21, 2008, 11:53:04 pm »

So who is planning to mod in sweet pod syrup men?
Everyone.
Everyone wants the candyman to come to town.
If we had an idea of what the new RAW's looked like, I would post the code for a gingerbread man.
 Now if only we could make them weak to wate-

 Idea: Do water elementals die if they are frozen in a freezing biome, or become ice elementals...

Sounds like a good idea for a new animal tag... Weakness:SUBSTANCE... Although giving it no-swim should deal with it....

StrayCat

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #604 on: November 22, 2008, 01:27:51 am »

Quote
Basic Army Arc

That. Just that. It's driving me insane to try and pick one of those to be my favorite.

Better squad mechanics? Oh yes sir! Attack enemy sites? Oh lawd! Sieges coming from actual armies? Better sieges? Real-time wars that just might be on top of my location? Dear. GOD. It's made of so much win I might cry...
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Philosophical Gamer

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #605 on: November 22, 2008, 09:28:30 am »

What about two creatures being able to combine and morph into a new super creature.  Like say some super badass goblin with 450 kills has finally attained enough power and alignment with his god, and the demon god melds with the goblin and now he's UberGoblin.

Sort of like in some games where after a certain level is reached you can upgrade a unit or character to a more powerful version of the character.  This could be integrated into the game, and so for instance a troll could become a boulder lobber with new skills, such as picking up the boulders on the map and throwing them like a catapult stone.

Or perhaps fire elementals could gain power if they move into the same square as booze, their power multiplies and they are now a lvl 8 fire elemental instead of a lvl 1 one.  Creatures could combine with certain items to gain power if they get near the item.

I don't know if it's been mentioned yet, but for instance water elementals could be more powerful when near a water source, or they could draw water from a lake and throw it like a bolt at another creature, but they wouldn't have this capability around dry ground.  They could even get weaker.

There's probably room for tons of new concepts with this new system.
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Tormy

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #606 on: November 22, 2008, 09:50:28 am »

What about two creatures being able to combine and morph into a new super creature.  Like say some super badass goblin with 450 kills has finally attained enough power and alignment with his god, and the demon god melds with the goblin and now he's UberGoblin.

That is a good idea actually, even if it's sound weird. Perhaps when we gonna have magic...something like this should be possible?
Either way, if this will be possible to do, crossbreeding will be a reality also. In fact crossbreeding should be available before magic even.
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Mel_Vixen

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #607 on: November 22, 2008, 05:59:12 pm »

And then we have to write another manual: "How to create proper chimeras".
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Zaratustra

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #608 on: November 22, 2008, 06:19:41 pm »

Spells for removing body parts from one creature and placing them on another.

Mikademus

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #609 on: November 22, 2008, 06:44:34 pm »

With you being able to TECHNICALLY apply gases and liquids as materials for the creature I wonder how long this puts us until we can have characters who are gases or liquids... Or at least until Blood is actually a seperate material.

Given what the dwarves make their food from I think it is a very good thing that they do not have gases.
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Osmosis Jones

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #610 on: November 22, 2008, 09:39:34 pm »

Ehh dwarven souffles;

This is a *hot air roast*. It's ingredients are minced hot air, finely minced hot air, exceptionally minced hot air and dwarven sugar.
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G-Flex

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #611 on: November 22, 2008, 10:04:38 pm »

Ehh dwarven souffles;

This is a *hot air roast*. It's ingredients are minced hot air, finely minced hot air, exceptionally minced hot air and dwarven sugar.

Sorry, but this doesn't fit with the timescale of DF. Talk radio was only introduced within the past century or so.
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furrot

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #612 on: November 22, 2008, 10:09:13 pm »

I wonder if at some point it would be possible to make items that effect what a creature is made out of. Certain mythological things pop into mind like the Midas touch turning everything to gold or the glare of Medusa turning adventurers to stone. I guess there would have to be a mechanic for keeping things alive after their composition has changed. I can see a lots of fun stuff coming into play with potions, like a stoneskin potion that actually gives you stone skin.

Of course there could be even more insanity if you added in some really strange items, like a cursed fruit that turned the person who ate it into rubber, or fire, or ice, or syrup. I can't imagine how tough a rubber dwarf would be.
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Tormy

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #613 on: November 23, 2008, 09:10:21 am »

I wonder if at some point it would be possible to make items that effect what a creature is made out of. Certain mythological things pop into mind like the Midas touch turning everything to gold or the glare of Medusa turning adventurers to stone. I guess there would have to be a mechanic for keeping things alive after their composition has changed.

This is somewhat related to my suggestion:)
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Toady One

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Re: The NEW Future of the Fortress
« Reply #614 on: November 23, 2008, 10:29:51 am »

note: again, no proofreading!

Quote from: Neonivek
I wonder if that means someone who is very strong can actually increase their "Size" or if someone who is very strong only makes their muscles larger inside their body relative to everything else.
Quote from: G-Flex
However: If fatness is linked to energy storage, well... do dwarves have different metabolisms or natural fatness? If not, I'm wondering if we'll get issues where any well-fed fortress ends up full of fat dudes and no skinny guys whatsoever. It would be hilarious, yet problematic/unrealistic.

For both of these, it depends on how far I get with it this time around.  I'd hope to be able to handle both properly.

Quote from: i are not good with compu
So really, really huge creatures will have really, really, huge guts, which when ripped and teared, should hypothetically become blood baths of biblical proportions?
Quote from: Footkerchief
Haha.  The blood won't actually flow, but it would be pretty badass if the amount of blood splatter was linked to actual blood volume loss, i.e. you cut off a Titan's arm and all the nearby tiles get drenched in blood.

The current version already sort of does this (as those that are bleeding a lot leave larger puddles), but yeah, it's a pain to track too much info about blood on map tiles (though it might happen when I do the liquid type expansion that's sort of a prereq for having terrifying areas with rivers of blood and all that).  I'm probably going to do a bit this time with blood events that track more information about blood stains beyond the bits I've set aside now, but that'll depend on a few things (time, mostly).

Quote from: Aqizzar
This actually makes me worry slightly.  DF is ultimately a fantasy game, and there's a few creatures in the raws that don't strictly obey the laws of biology.  If fat stores energy and you make a big creature with no fat storage, will it pass out all the time from exhaustion?

Only if I handle it really poorly, or a modder neglects any relevant tags.  I'm sure there will be bugs though.  All kinds of bugs.

Quote from: Random832
Actually, he listed three jobs. That take place in three different workshops.

This implies (at least, without too much wishful thinking) that the reaction raws have been generalized to accept any workshop.

Nope -- the three workshops are some of those with the easiest jobs/interfaces currently.  Updating something like the crafts or forge shop would take more effort, and for those item crafting shops, there are also additional issues, such as their future form after some of the req/bloats come in.  It's a much larger project, and something I don't have time for for this release.

Quote from: Random832
Do these support racegloss or something like it? Is there any support for selective racegloss so it's not just picking just _any_ appropriate material but limit it somehow

Right now, for tissue materials, you pick a specific material either from the inorganic/plant raws, a material from a material template like "skin template" (which you can then modify with additional tags), or a material from a previous creature (or make a new material from scratch).  I haven't updated race-glosses yet, and I'm not sure if I will yet (it's in the countdown but isn't a top priority).  That was always sort of a strange hack to get an extra descriptor out in front of the creature (it was used originally for animated trees which aren't even used in the game anymore -- the elven druids used to cast spells on the forest outside the 2D cliff).

Quote from: Footkerchief
I can't wrap my mind around the idea of a game that models the color of your guts.

I actually went through images.google and the color entries on wikipedia to try to match things.  I'm not fully satisfied, but I think it'll do.  I think I whiffed on fat and just made it yellow, but I also made some other things mauve-taupe and ecru, so it all balances out.

Quote from: i are not good with compu
I'm hoping we'll be able to define phases of development (i.e. [Child] of creature has its own tokens, and at [Age] it becomes [Adolescent] and its tokens change).

Not yet -- I didn't want to deal with wound/inventory transfers yet for completely different bodies, but I'm hoping to get there in some future release.

Quote from: Zaratustra
Hm, so iron men are solid iron all the way through? Are hollow body parts implemented?

They are, yeah.  You could do hollow parts by adding an "air" material as the inner tissue layer, but it should probably be supported through more info on the layers (as with hair/skin).  Not sure I'll get there this time around.  This is going to make iron men much, much harder, but they aren't supposed to be easy, without some kind of trap or something to take care of them.  Adventurers don't yet have enough tools to handle them, most like (like ropes or the ability to make their own pitfalls or whatever), but this'll certainly give me more impetus to add such things.

Quote from: Footkerchief
It would be cool to reanimate the empty molted exoskeletons of giant cave spiders.

Zombies are actually an interesting problem that's part of the wound countdown...  instead of just lowering their bodypart hitpoints to simulate rot, it'll have to go ahead and do the rot explicitly.

Quote from: Greiger
I seem to recall making pants out of bunny brains in Armok 1.  Will we be able to do the same thing with the new version I hope?

I stopped right in the middle of this so I don't have the specific tags for you yet, but the brains would probably need to be given some kind of skin tag so that the tanner knows they can be made into leather that can then be made into pants.  That would make the bunny kind of nasty.  In later versions, it's the sort of thing you might ask an adventurer to do, in which case it might outright refuse to follow the order or have your adventurer just play with the brains for a bit or have the adventurer make a crude pants figurine or have the adventurer wipe them all over his or her legs, at my discretion, really...

Quote from: Akroma
I wonder, does this ugrade include gender-differentiation ?

There are different entries for the genders.  I have not added any body changes.  I'm sure that won't stop other people.  I haven't yet decided where if anywhere I'm going to go with that, but chopping off the little warrior and having it flop against a wall or something is probably too distracting to my nation for me to include in the vanilla game, although the lines of the other potty-oriented stuff.  I don't have any personal objections, but it's not at the top of my list either.

Quote from: Techhead
Can we give all the necessary tags for survival to a single body part?

What stops you from doing this currently?  I never tried it.  They'd be like the Armok 1 fleshballs I guess, although Armok 1 fleshballs selected their blood color from a list I think, as skin colors varied among other creatures.  We're almost there.

Quote from: Kanil
Can we now make pig tail sock puppets?

Or will we just be limited to "pig tail man"?

I haven't changed how toys currently work.  You could make a monster, but nobody could arm its bottom.  Do you mean sock puppets as a toy or as something terrifying that attacks you?  No, there was no scarring childhood memory...

Quote from: Neonivek
With you being able to TECHNICALLY apply gases and liquids as materials for the creature I wonder how long this puts us until we can have characters who are gases or liquids... Or at least until Blood is actually a seperate material.

Blood is a separate material now, but we'll have to wait for wounds to see how far I get with temperature effects for weird outer layers and "pin~ata" effects, like using a gaseous inner tissue layer or gaseous blood materials.  The quick approach is to ignore it.  I'm not sure what I'll feel like at the time.

--

The more complicated ideas for messing with creature materials and morphing them and doing all of whatever is of course further away than the next release, but part of the idea here was to set up the groundwork for that sort of thing so special effects can be put in without adding any glossy variables on top of the creatures (that then need to be handled with every other mechanic as special cases).  I'm pretty happy with how things are going right now, as opposed to Armok 1, where I went with a strict bottom-up approach and never really wrote a game part for it.  There are still a few ways (in particular, item components) where Armok 1, while crude, is far more general than DF, but I'll address those over time as well.  Not for this release though!
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