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Author Topic: Zombie preparedness  (Read 133959 times)

DJ

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1065 on: November 10, 2009, 09:07:05 am »

Now it's been a long time since highschool, but I remember learning that the building blocks of cells (stuff made out of amino-acids, English name eludes me) start unfolding at 40°C. When they unfold, cells just completely fall apart.

355°C is a light to medium fire.
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Neruz

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1066 on: November 10, 2009, 09:07:12 am »

Well fat is also naturally full of water, so it doesn't burn very well at all until you refine it.

Neruz

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1067 on: November 10, 2009, 09:07:56 am »

Now it's been a long time since highschool, but I remember learning that the building blocks of cells (stuff made out of amino-acids, English name eludes me) start unfolding at 40°C. When they unfold, cells just completely fall apart.

You may want to try explaining burn victims then.

Or cooked meat.

DJ

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1068 on: November 10, 2009, 09:10:06 am »

There are many recorded cases of people just burning up because they were smoking in bed and fell asleep. Nothing but limbs was found. This stuff is where the spontaneous combustion urban legends come from.

Cooked meat doesn't have much in the way of whole cells. Where do you think all the juice comes from? Ruptured cells.
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Vester

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1069 on: November 10, 2009, 09:12:42 am »

There are many recorded cases of people just burning up because they were smoking in bed and fell asleep. Nothing but limbs was found. This stuff is where the spontaneous combustion urban legends come from.

Well... that's because the cigarette set something extremely flammable on fire.
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Neruz

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1070 on: November 10, 2009, 09:12:51 am »

There are many recorded cases of people just burning up because they were smoking in bed and fell asleep. Nothing but limbs was found. This stuff is where the spontaneous combustion urban legends come from.

Cooked meat doesn't have much in the way of whole cells. Where do you think all the juice comes from? Ruptured cells.

*Facepalm*

We're talking about using fire as a means of destroying Zombies. It takes a long time to burn a person to the point where it renders the body inoperable. And if you're dealing with the more magical Zombie variants, then it might not matter at all.


We're not saying that fire wouldn't eventually kill a Zombie, we're saying it wouldn't kill a Zombie before the Zombie killed you.

DJ

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1071 on: November 10, 2009, 09:24:12 am »

Did you miss the part where I said you're already in a compound? Fire is for clearing zombies while saving bullets.

And if zombies are so magical, why would they need brains at all? Shouldn't they just work like the hand in Evil Dead? So you'd have to completely destroy them, which bullets just can't do.
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Neruz

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1072 on: November 10, 2009, 09:27:05 am »

So instead of running out of bullets, you run out of flammibles?

Angellus

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1073 on: November 10, 2009, 09:32:48 am »

I am still believing that in this thread the zombies are regarded to be taken by parasite or something like that. Thus, fire will be effective, but only when exposing the zombies to it long enough.

I think it is better to use the fuel neccesairy to light them, to power a machine which crushes their skulls or warms you in the winter.
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DJ

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1074 on: November 10, 2009, 10:52:54 am »

Gasoline is more abundant than bullets.
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RAM

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1075 on: November 10, 2009, 10:58:38 am »

It may just be e, but I get the impression that this thread addresses all zombie varieties. I would say that fire is pretty good for clearing zombies if you have a fire-proof compound. Zombies are probably a touch more flammable than humans, and once it gets going fire tends to spread, so a relatively small amount of fuel might be able to completely reduce an entire horde of zombies. Bear in mind however that fire does bad things to many materials, metal included...

I would recommend fire if you are in a military bunker and have the ability to distribute a large amount of accelerant over a small area to start the inferno and a small amount of accelerant over a large area to keep it going. But any structure will be destroyed if subjected to a hot enough fire for long enough, and you will be in the middle of it...
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The Willow Wisp

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1076 on: November 10, 2009, 12:52:05 pm »

It may just be e, but I get the impression that this thread addresses all zombie varieties. I would say that fire is pretty good for clearing zombies if you have a fire-proof compound. Zombies are probably a touch more flammable than humans, and once it gets going fire tends to spread, so a relatively small amount of fuel might be able to completely reduce an entire horde of zombies. Bear in mind however that fire does bad things to many materials, metal included...

I would recommend fire if you are in a military bunker and have the ability to distribute a large amount of accelerant over a small area to start the inferno and a small amount of accelerant over a large area to keep it going. But any structure will be destroyed if subjected to a hot enough fire for long enough, and you will be in the middle of it...

The only problem with lighting zombies on fire is that the zombies will not die right away. You want some distance between you and them, otherwise you have to deal with flaming zombies in close quarters.

I have a master plan for when the Zombie-geddon happens.
1) Find 18-wheeler with fuel in the tank and a trailer.
2) Empty trailer of useless contents, and load it with things I want to keep.
3) Drive to nearest construction site and use welding equipment to re-enforce the walls of the trailer and the cabin with the materials at said site.
4) Drive to nearest Wal-mart and stock up
5) drive around and collect as much fuel as possible in tanks and jugs.
6) Find Firearms. (Possibly at Wal-mart)
7) Drive around looking for survivors
8 ) When I have gathered enough survivors, Find remote location in middle of Canada and build a house.
9) If alone, live what is left of my life as a badass hermit; if with a group, try to gather more survivors and re-populate the earth.

It is much harder to actually do but it is do-able. The 18-wheeler will allow me to plow through traffic and zombie hordes much easier than in a car of on foot. The trailer will work as a moving fortress and stockpile. If I gather enough peole I can get more 18-wheelers and form a zombie killing convoy.
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The Architect

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1077 on: November 10, 2009, 07:49:09 pm »

As much fun as it is to think up your own scenarios for each zombie type, it's MUCH more fun to shoot holes in other people's plans! I really do like the 18-wheeler plan. However, I don't think it would work in the slightest.

Yay for the 18-wheeler plan, it's cool and impractical together! The perfect zombie plan. My friend, you can make the perfect zombie b-movie! In the face of all of these fuel-intensive plans and the ridiculous "gas is more abundant than bullets" statement, allow me to restate (as someone else did earlier) that gasoline has a short shelf life, and that everyone snaps up the available gas during a crisis. Also, most 18-wheelers run on diesel, which luckily for you has a much longer shelf life than gas, but which unfortunately will be just as scarce. And an 18-wheeler isn't a tank, so if you are facing the usual cliche hundreds of abandoned and/or zombie-filled cars blocking the road, it will be just as useless as any other non-offroad automobile.
Oh yes, and once again, gas isn't more abundant than bullets in terms of killing power. One bullet will effectually destroy a brain; I doubt a gallon of gas will put one out of commission.
So instead of running out of bullets, you run out of flammibles?
Exactly.

Repetitive statement #2:
Spears
Don't
Kill
Zombies.
Spears poke holes. For bleeding and organ damage. Spears get stuck and break in bones. Spears require little force to poke holes, tremendous force to slash and bash. They simply aren't effective for anything but poking holes in things (not like skulls and ribcages, unless you have plenty of time and a good foothold to jerk them out), and like any edged weapon they will also become dull with repetitive use. Not that you'd get a second chance to use them vs a zombie horde; you'd be stuck with your spear in a zombie who probably wouldn't even be stopped, and even if they were on the other side of a fence you will wear yourself out just dispatching a single one with a spear. You probably won't be able to get your spear back, either. Can't you think of 1000 better ways to send a helpless rotting shambler on the other side of an indestructible, perforable barrier to hell?

As cool as burning zombies is in a video game sense, I don't want to be anywhere within 10 miles of a burning human corpse. Do you know how badly that would stink?

I'm not sure of this, but I don't think a rotter-type zombie would burn as well as a living or freshly dead human being. As bodies rot, bacteria and other organisms decompose them. This is what rotting is. So if we are dealing with rotting zombies, they will have less chemical energy to burn. Unless somehow mummified, they will be just as wet inside as anyone else. Taking these two facts together I think you'll find that rotten corpses burn less well than living or freshly dead humans. If they are mummified/dried, then yes they might burn better. If they aren't rotters then they won't burn any differently than any other living human. In case the first disclaimer wasn't enough, let me repeat that this was just conjecture and unlike the spear/.22 comments it is not based in research. If anyone actually has practical knowledge of this, feel free to correct.

It would be by far the most disgusting and uncomfortable way to deal with zombies, but in terms of infection control a fire might be your best bet. Just make sure they can't reach you before they turn charcoal-ish. And bring gas masks and wet blankets to insulate any openings in your shelter.

I hope people will read carefully before repetitively bringing up the same points: we were talking about a .22's ability to pierce a human skull and cause brain trauma. Obviously if brain trauma doesn't work on zombies it won't be an effective weapon against them. It's a weapon for killing the classical shambler, and the strategy is good for nothing else.

Also, you won't have to repeatedly bash someone in the head with a mace to crack their skull. You'll crush them in one lightly powered swing. Ever wonder why people with steel helms got their skulls crushed by iron maces? It's simply kinetics. Not to say that a steel helm might not save your life, but it didn't always stop a direct blow.

Did you miss the part where I said you're already in a compound? Fire is for clearing zombies while saving bullets.

And if zombies are so magical, why would they need brains at all? Shouldn't they just work like the hand in Evil Dead? So you'd have to completely destroy them, which bullets just can't do.

I agree that fuel has many better uses than "clearing zombies". If there are more zombies than you can shoot, then you're done for anyway. If we are up against the magical zombies that keep killing down the last severed finger, we're doubly screwed. Find an attractive person of the opposite sex, spend a waking day or two with them, then blow your brains out before you can be killed in your sleep? You'll be one of them soon enough anyway.
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Strife26

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1078 on: November 10, 2009, 07:57:33 pm »

It doesn't take that much force to run a survival knife on the end of a pole through an eye socket.



New topic. I just bought myself an entrenching tool (Army overstock). http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entrenching_tool

I think that it'll be heavy enough to smack skulls open, and it comes with a jagged edge.
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The Architect

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Re: Zombie preparedness
« Reply #1079 on: November 10, 2009, 08:27:11 pm »

You will never give up on the spears. Of course it doesn't take much force to jam something through an eye socket! The problem with spears is that THEY GET STUCK in bone. You will never get it back, if you somehow have the precision and athleticism to jam it into their brain. It only needs to get stuck once.

The entrenching tool still has an edge. While edges make penetration easier, they also get stuck and dulled. Undoubtedly a decent last-ditch spur-of-the-moment anti-skull weapon, no doubt about it at all. Yay hyphens! I would still stick with a blunt instrument on a short handle for repetitive use, though the shovel has great trade-offs in utility and portability. A short hammer/mace isn't much good for anything but smacking stuff. The question now comes up: How much good is a ground-level shelter in a zombie apocalypse? The entrenching tool is designed to create such a shelter on-demand for moving/patrolling soldiers. However it would probably be pretty far down on my list of tools to carry (for zombies, though high on a list for a post-apocalyptic bullet-ridden landscape).

The most useful thing it would do for you is probably your gardening. If you have any really serious digging to do yourself, a bigger shovel will truly be necessary. It really does come down to mobility: how mobile do you plan to be? If you are going to be migratory, a small spade will dig a nice grave to go to sleep in each night until the zombies show up. If you don't plan to move, you have no need for the mobility of the spade and you can just use a real shovel to dig any holes you need much more quickly and easily. If you just want to garden, take a small gardening tool. If facing intelligent humans and trapping wild animals, an entrenchment tool could be useful to a migrant.

In the event of a much more likely non-zombie crisis, your entrenchment tool is the bomb diggity.
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