Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Zemat]

This question might sound silly since civilizations due go on to perform conquests and capture cities. But right now every conquest war, every war in fact, seems to be started due to some excuse (sentient eating) and no war seems to start only for conquest reasons. Apparently, without any excuse, civilizations will not go to war. Which I think it's the main reason goblins never start wars and actually they become the frequent victim of invasions. They don't get appalled by any of their neighbors actions so they never bother to invade. But everyone seems to find a reason to attack them.

I think the ethics system is not enough to motivate wars. If it not where for the elves and their strange customs wars would die out quickly. Which is what happens in my worlds with elves eradicating themselves in stupid sieges and goblins getting exterminated by their neighbors rather quickly.

Where's the greed and lust for power?

Also, humans never fight between themselves (unless you count pseudo-goblin humans), which is a pity.

[Toady One]

Of course that was on my mind, but the greed and power motives don't work because there are no possessions and no real power over others (except the power to start meaningless wars).  So they have silly excuses that work in the absence of those things that are centered more around murder than the expansion of a domain (though personality traits do drive whether or not a war happens once they've got such an excuse).  It would be enough perhaps to have the ambitious people just start wars for the hell of it, but I was hoping to have a bit more in place first.

The necessary infrastructure was going to start with the humans glueing their little cities together under ambitious rulers that conquer their neighbors, but I didn't get there.  Resource tracking is needed to make things more satisfying as well.  Anyway, I'll get to something sometime.  As usual, the caravan arc (resource tracking) is desperately needed, though it'll probably take more interrelationships between people as well.

[Zemat]

Heh, well. I guess the caravan arc is becoming the holy grail of DF's development cycle.

Thanks for the quick response.

Edit. I guess I'll mod the game to play as the gobos. They seem to have the most fun with the constant invasions to their fortresses.

[Toady One]

I'll probably slip in the parts of it that I need for the first post-bugfix release.  If my keyboard had speed-dial, "the caravan arc is needed" would be #2 next to "Okay, I'll note it down."

[Sean Mirrsen]

I think you can type "Okay, I'll note it down." ten times without errors with your eyes closed, in under a minute. Years of practice couldn't have gone without effect.

[Walliard]

I'll probably slip in the parts of it that I need for the first post-bugfix release.  If my keyboard had speed-dial, "the caravan arc is needed" would be #2 next to "Okay, I'll note it down."

I think I'm going to have to sig that.

[Toady One]

I think you can type "Okay, I'll note it down." ten times without errors with your eyes closed, in under a minute. Years of practice couldn't have gone without effect.

I managed this is 20 seconds before I felt myself slip and knew it was impossible to guess the backspacing needed to fake a recovery:

Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
Okay, I'll note it down.
okay, I'll note it down.
Omkay

[Aqizzar]

You're a better man than I then.  I have so many typos, I don't even notice I have to hit backspace.  Ironically, there's a typo in your actual sentence...

You mentioned a while back that you weren't enjoying working on just one area of DF at a time.  Is the vaunted Caravan Arc next on the development list, or you not locking yourself to a specific line of work?

[Toady One]

So there is.  I'll leave it.

Definitely 100% not locking myself to an arc.  It's not healthy.  I'm probably not going to lock myself strictly to the army arc from here on out, but I'll certainly be doing the things I have scheduled with roughly these upcoming releases.

[thvaz]

I would love to see the the next releases of the Army Arc as soon as possible, but we can't have a completed Army Arc without many of the others (Caravan Arc, Life Cycle Arc, and others).

With this release, I'm having more fun with adventure mode than ever before (I used it just to explore my old forts before) but there is still so much lacking on it. Some of the Adventure Arc would be really neat.

 

[Solmyr]

In my latest world a goblin civilization led by a demon (who was also their deity) went to war with the neighboring elves because the demon didn't like their deity. So I would say goblins can definitely start wars.

[Deon]

I noticed that soem playing with opposite religion spheres leads to nice world-wide wars so it's possible to make the world you like via some modding and worldgen luckiness.

[axus]

Greed as a reason for war is good.  Like Toady says, you need resources; that way you can see which of your neighbors is poor, which is rich.  A kobold group that steals a super-valuable item from your dwarves suddenly find themselves a target of greedy humans or gobs.  Eventually the game could keep track of food production and stockpiles, hungry civs might attack groups with a lot of food.

[Omath Erius]

I like to imagine that the leaders are already going to war for conquest reasons, the curent excuses are just that, excuses.

It's hard to convince your people to send off citizens to die just so you have one more city to play around in, so the leaders start cooking up propoganda like "the elves devour sentient beings! They must be stopped!"

Obviously that isn't really happenning now, we need people to actualy be greedy before they can start lying to cover their greed.

[Zemat]

Wars have been fought over worthless pieces of land quite frequently. I imagine that one civ's need to expand it's territory over another civ's area a justification enough to go to war for some civ's like the goblins.

Also, some civ's religions could instill the desire to burn and maim other civs regardless of the later's current religion. More so if the former's religion requires sentient sacrifices to appease the gods.