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Elves have become the true and awesome avatars of Armok

71 (48.3%)

It's hard to be worse than the where...

18 (12.2%)

I like the idea, but the're unbalanced now.

41 (27.9%)

ARRGH THEY ARE EATING MY BRAIN AND I AM NOT HAPPY ABOUT IT

17 (11.6%)

Total Members Voted: 147

[PTTG??]

I was curious as to the forums sentiments as a whole. I'm not sure myself.

[Keiseth]

I'm happy with them. Now every core race is pretty unique.

[Teh Zip File]

Zerg rushing corpse eating elves are awesome.

[Koji]

Ditto. They're the most believable and non gag-inducing portrayal I've seen in all my years of fantasy gaming. They used to be amusing, and now they're a serious primal force in the DF world. They stepped out of the realm of "oh god here come the stupid E caravans" and into my imagination right alongside their stumpy cousins, the Dwarves.

[Keiseth]

Koji says it perfectly. They've been "DF-ized."

[KaelGotDwarves]

http://www.bay12games.com/forum/index.php?topic=20563.0

rest my case

[Erk]

They are fantastic now. Koji said it well. My problem is less and less with current DF elves, and more with the now-pansy goblins. It's like they switched places!

[Keiseth]

Goblins got lazy. They still worship demons of death and fire while building obsidian fortresses but... invade? Ehh... later, I'm playing Dwarf Fortress.

[Aqizzar]

While I think a little bit a tweaking is need to make them fight people besides just the humans (and win a little less often), but other than that, I have no problem with them.  I agree with the sentiments elsewhere that this can be where Dwarf Fortress begins to truly distinguish itself from other fantasy milieus - our elves* are violent sociopaths who will start a war at the slightest hint of disrespect to wildlife, are so committed to environmentalism that they eat their kills, and breed like humans but live forever yet have no concept of perspective and combine these traits into an assurance that they will always have more spear-catchers.  The new elves are great but could be better - this is a direction that must be reinforced.

*_{these need editing.}

[Neonivek]

The Elves by any other name would be as flawed...

Their reproduction rates are MUCH too high... In a game where the civilisation numbers are infinate this wouldn't be too much of a problem... However the fact of the matter is that they max out the world's population in a matter decades sometimes.
-Note: This would apply even if these were "Ants"...

They are a tad Hypocritical and violent... to sociopathic degrees... Even the stories of Elves Toady told were they more sane and could have lasting peace. However the area around a Forest retreat is like a aura of death after 100 or 150 years. What do they do when they take over a population? Do they enlighten them? Destroy their homes and force them to leave? HECK NO!!! They slaughter them all for no reason just like animals do... Ohh wait... I forgot... Animals generally don't mindlessly mass kill other creatures. (Goblins had a reason... Elves have Plotholes). Of course without any Writing on DF elves available this would become moot
-On both ends of the spectrum... Peace between Elves and Humans are too short lived... If they are going to war the next week why did they accept a treaty? While I am aware this happens in real life... the fact of the matter is it is on and off. Id even expect Goblins to be beaten into peace for a few years...

They are FAR too weak in World Generation one on one... The fact of the matter is that Elves have Bows... Bows and Crossbows HOWEVER overpowered are the Megaweapons of the game. I don't care HOW good that Hero is... Him/Her/It Vs. 200 bowmen just seems unlikely.

They are overall worse...

Edit Addition: Opps I almost forgot... Now they fill up your Forts with useless junk

[Erk]

I've honestly not seen yet any of the massive scale elf/human wars people are complaining about. Maybe it is because I am running my games to around year 1000 rather than 5000 or higher, which doesn't allow the immortal elves to breed out of control.

Neon, try making them not mature until age 50 and having a lifespan of around 400, maybe you'll see fewer of them. And if the other stuff really bothers you, try changing it from UNTHINKABLE to SHUN.

[Neonivek]

No that is alright... I realise most of the problems with elves are things that will be fixed eventually.

It doesn't "REALLY" bother me, I am just simply answering the Topic

I should state I voted: "I like the idea, but the're unbalanced now"

[Wooty]

Erk, I had routine 800 elf seiges against human towns from 400-800. You might just be unlucky.


I myself think that its just fucked up and screwy. The entire elf and goblin 'system' is built around elves being good and goblins being bad. The demons, dark towers, torture and death religion, baby stealing and theft, VS. tree loving, at peace with wildlife, skinny elves who never retaliate against your caravan butchering.


If elves lived in depraved and evil forests filled with the skulls of their enemies and butchered animals and trees, and goblins lived in little villages with shops and friendly dun loving mayor to stab and had no demon overlord and worshipped flowers, I would be okay with it. As it is it feels a lot more like a bug than a feature.

[Kagus]

Ever consider that goblins just do the whole demon/wasteland/skulls-on-pikes/obsidian tower thing because it's cool?  They're just your average laid back DF players, stretching the skins of their enemies over the sides of their black fortresses.

The elves, meanwhile, are embracing the savage side of nature and striking out at the prey races that are encroaching on their territory (namely, the world).  They kill, eat, and share the meat.  Just like any intelligent predator.

The forests are no longer safe...  Watch your back, there are elves afoot.

[FZeroRacer]

Much, much better.

I see goblins as being evil still, but more in a "We really don't give a shit about you and will take all the land around us as we want. If you don't bother with us, we don't care much about you". They use skulls/towers and the like to reinforce this "Don't screw with us" medium, but are willing to trade with others if they have good stuff. In D&D terms, I think they could best be described as Neutral Evil.

Elves are more along the lines of "Screw you, your ideas are stupid and you're ruining the earth by being here. Be like us, or we'll make you be like us!" sort of way. They don't believe in the whole "not eating other sentient organisms" other than themselves and they truely think that they are following the nature god's whims by eating the corpses of their foes. They live almost forever and breed like rabbits, but are built with flimsy bone/muscle structure. They attack in swarms and completely disregard any peace treaties, laws or anything of the like. They remain in the traditional Chaotic Good alignment, though the only good they believe in is their own.