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Author Topic: The meaning of seige.  (Read 9327 times)

shadow_archmagi

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #60 on: July 04, 2008, 10:50:32 pm »

Personally, I love sealing off the world. My fortress, viewed by Surface Scum, seems to consist of a small trade depot.

And a small wooden door in the ground.
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NikkTheTrick

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #61 on: July 04, 2008, 11:33:46 pm »

Hmm... What if siegers just dig a holllow shell around the fortress, caving in the whole thing?

Imagine the awesomeness: watching gobbos slowly, for years (since they are not dwarven kind of miners) dig and dig. Until one day *CRUSH*

Should be possible to have AI do it (it would just designate a digging pattern that includes every tile, say, 5 tiles away from any given part of your fortress). And it would force players to sally sooner or later.
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Necro

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #62 on: July 05, 2008, 08:39:51 am »

The goblins could learn to use testudo. Another tactic they could have is using drugged-up naked warriors who feel no pain. There would be an amazing amount of threads about how overpowered they were.

They could also try to dress up as elves and have lots of naked (ok, not necessarily) warriors hide in the wagon. If you like to keep your trade depot deep inside your fortress, then you're royally screwed.
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McDoomhammer

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #63 on: July 05, 2008, 09:38:05 am »

Personally, I love sealing off the world. My fortress, viewed by Surface Scum, seems to consist of a small trade depot.

And a small wooden door in the ground.

Have you considered trying to amass enough resources to go critical and actually seal off the outside word entirely, vault-style?  See how long you can last before you need wood (or whether all your dwarves kill each other first).  Control the breeding of tame animals for food, extra points of you manage to get a breedable population of a nonstandard animal like marmots.
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Jamuk

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #64 on: July 05, 2008, 10:18:58 am »

Why do sieges need to be determined by play style?  Whether you get sieged or not should be based on where the fortress is placed.  If you start on a major road of course you're going to get sieged.  If you pick a place in the middle of nowhere why would they bother to fight you?
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nil

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #65 on: July 06, 2008, 11:32:04 am »

Sappers should be able to be toggled in the init file; that way people who are looking for a challenge can have them while those who aren't won't have to worry about the integrity of their fort.

Boomer

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #66 on: July 07, 2008, 02:34:39 pm »

Why do sieges need to be determined by play style?  Whether you get sieged or not should be based on where the fortress is placed.  If you start on a major road of course you're going to get sieged.  If you pick a place in the middle of nowhere why would they bother to fight you?

Sieges themselves will happen anyway, but the tactics the enemy uses against you should be based on what you are doing. Why send goblin diggers when you have your doors wide open? Why send sappers or troll smashers if you have no walls or doors?

But I semi-like the idea of being too far away for the enemy to bother. It can be based upon distance versus potential profit. The farther you are away, the more valuable you have to be before anyone bothers to send anything your way. So it's entirely possible for a place like Nist Akath to only have to worry about skeletal elk for years, then megabeasts, and then somewhere around year 15 with some of the massive constructions underway the first goblin squad shows up to see what is going on.
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Asehujiko

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #67 on: July 08, 2008, 02:32:33 am »

Aren't there a pair of fortresses directly bordering the tundra Nist Akath is on?

Anyway, once world gen armies also siege you, you can expect groups of 2000+ to show up anyway. See how many get through after all your traps are jammed.
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Kagus

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #68 on: July 08, 2008, 02:34:13 am »

I think most people would just surrender after five frames.  Or two hours, whichever's shorter.

Omega2

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #69 on: July 08, 2008, 08:13:16 am »

I think most people would just surrender after five frames.  Or two hours, whichever's shorter.
So true.

My desktop and my laptop already shudder when the goblins attack with 30 units and my fort is at 80 dwarves. After the Army Arch is released I guess I'll only be able to play at my work computer.  :'(

Methinks we'll need some streamlining...
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Granite26

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #70 on: July 08, 2008, 09:48:53 am »

the AvP card game (sequiter, I promise) had a neat system of stacking aliens, whereby one card could be used to model any number of aliens, with the extra aliens giving a combat bonus to the main one.

Anyway, something like that could be used for the goblins.  (Or just leave them as a stack until they get close to the dwarves.  Each squad only has one brain until they split up for combat.)

Belteshazzar

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #71 on: July 08, 2008, 04:34:41 pm »

Want:

Terrain Damage. So that craters with associated ejecta can be caused by explosions of booze or blackpowder (or any alchemical equivalent) barrels. Or even just some very angry Trolls or Titans who proceed to break apart the mountainhomes and throw parts of it at your fleeing dwarves. Or that let a truly Mighty adventurer hammer his way through goblin towers like a genocidal Kool-Aid Man of Righteousness.

Projectile Arcing: Especially in the case of catapults, but also so our Dwarven Hopalites can fight the innumerable beastmen of the Elven Empire in the shade.

Nonstandard Catapult Ammo or better bridge flinging just so we can have this: Goblin Spearmaster "Eah wots dat buzzen noiz I ear?" *smash* "Ohhhh Armok Not BEEEEEEEEEEEZZZZZ Dey iz gettern in mah eyezz da bees iz in mah EEEYYYZZEEE!!!! Arrrrrrgghgh!"

Enemy or Benign Tunnelers or Sappers. Perhaps harder stone has more damage reduction or something so iron walls work better than glass against seigers? Leave in an Init Option to disable for those who fear ruination of fort designs.

Fog of War. So that we have to scout in order to properly engage the enemy, but so do they. So if you don't want to be seen kill the scout.

Climbing as a skill. So adventures, dwarves and seigers don't get stuck in 5x5x5 pits?
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Neonivek

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #72 on: July 08, 2008, 05:24:24 pm »

Quote
" Leave in an Init Option to disable for those who fear ruination of fort designs."

As I said a few times... One fix is to have tunnels not created by you collapse naturally and/or when you select them to collapse

Well either that or the Tunnels are actually just like portals and can be removed just like a construction can be removed.

There we go... Three methods in which we won't need the "No enemy tunnels" init option because of fort design ruining.
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Belteshazzar

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #73 on: July 08, 2008, 05:47:54 pm »

No I don't want goblin tunnels just going poof just because. That makes no sense. The tunnels as portalish constructions makes even less sense and would feel like it was kitbashed in. It is ridiculously easy to switch an Init option from on to off.

Why do you want tunnels to just collapse? There is no reason for them to. I would love to have kobalds digging their way into my stockpiles to steal socks over a period of several months. Enemy tunnels always collapsing ruins so many possibilities for intrigue,treason and plot and I for one am of the opinion that plot be not forgot.

Now that we can mass designate constructions in the next update rewalling is going to be ridiculously easy. If the tunnel is that bothersome just rewall it. What are you afraid of?
« Last Edit: July 08, 2008, 05:50:53 pm by Belteshazzar »
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Jualin

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Re: The meaning of seige.
« Reply #74 on: July 08, 2008, 06:10:02 pm »

Kobolds going too deep. Demons everywhere!
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