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[Ghostpaw]

What does the [ART_FACET_MODIFIER] tag and the [ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER] tag for entities do?

[Sean Mirrsen]

They define how likely is a race to include certain creatures or items/events in their images and engravings.

[Ghostpaw]

quote:Originally posted by Sean Mirrsen:
<STRONG>They define how likely is a race to include certain creatures or items/events in their images and engravings.</STRONG>

Alright so how do you use them and how are they different?

[Sean Mirrsen]

There's the readme for that. Or, more specifically, the "file changes.txt" file.

Here, I'll quote it and highlight the relevant bit:

quote:Auxiliary file changes for 0.27.173.38a:

New entity tags
   [USE_EVIL_WOOD]
   [USE_GOOD_WOOD]
   [USE_EVIL_PLANTS]
   [USE_GOOD_PLANTS]
   [USE_GOOD_ANIMALS]
   [USE_ANY_PET_RACE]
   [USE_MISC_PROCESSED_WOOD_PRODUCTS]
   [IMPROVED_BOWS]
   [RESPECT_ANIMALS]
   [RESPECT_TREES]
   [LOW_SKILL]
   [INVADERS_IGNORE_NEUTRALS]
   [AT_PEACE_WITH_WILDLIFE]
   [EQUIPMENT_IMPROVEMENTS]
   [ABUSE_BODIES]
   [SPHERE_ALIGNMENT:<sphere>:<amount>]
      <STRONG><amount> is a multiplicative modifier that runs from 0 to 25600 with 256 being the neutral value
   [ART_FACET_MODIFIER:<facet>:<amount>]
      <facet> is one of: OWN_RACE, FANCIFUL, EVIL, GOOD
      <amount> as above
   [ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER:<art>:<amount>]
      <art> is one of: CREATURE, PLANT, TREE, SHAPE, ITEM
      <amount> as above</STRONG>
   [ITEM_IMPROVEMENT_MODIFIER:<item>:<amount>]
      <item> is one of:
         ART_IMAGE
         COVERED
         RINGS_HANGING
         BANDS
         SPIKES
         ITEMSPECIFIC
         THREAD
         CLOTH
         SEWN_IMAGE
      <amount> as above
...
...

[Ghostpaw]

For ART_FACET_MODIFIER what do each of the following do:
-OWN_RACE
-FANCIFUL
-EVIL
-GOOD

For ART_IMAGE_ELEMENT_MODIFIER for the <art> can you specify a specific CREATURE, PLANT, TREE, SHAPE, or ITEM?

Also could an example of how radically the amount affects how likely is a race to include certain creatures or items/events in their images and engravings be given?

[Sean Mirrsen]

No, no specific creature, shape or item, just those tags.

Facets supposedly mean what races the images will usually depict. For example, an OWN_RACE facet combined with an ITEM image makes a picture of something related to the race in question, like a common accessory, or a recent artifact. EVIL combined with CREATURE would make images of goblins. Stuff like that, or so I understand it.

And, you have the range values given. If you put 25600 on both OWN_RACE and CREATURE, you'll get some very egocentric creatures, 99 out of 100 images will have them and their doings on them.

[Ghostpaw]

quote:Originally posted by Sean Mirrsen:
<STRONG>No, no specific creature, shape or item, just those tags.

Facets supposedly mean what races the images will usually depict. For example, an OWN_RACE facet combined with an ITEM image makes a picture of something related to the race in question, like a common accessory, or a recent artifact. EVIL combined with CREATURE would make images of goblins. Stuff like that, or so I understand it.

And, you have the range values given. If you put 25600 on both OWN_RACE and CREATURE, you'll get some very egocentric creatures, 99 out of 100 images will have them and their doings on them.</STRONG>

Thankyou for the clear explanation.  How about with 10,000?

[Sean Mirrsen]

Do I need to quote the file again? The default on each value is 256. Think how much 10000 is bigger than 256. I guess you'll only have 97 of 100 images depicting themselves.

[Ghostpaw]

quote:Originally posted by Sean Mirrsen:
<STRONG>Do I need to quote the file again? The default on each value is 256. Think how much 10000 is bigger than 256. I guess you'll only have 97 of 100 images depicting themselves.</STRONG>

How about 256 then?

[Sean Mirrsen]

Average. I mean, is it really that complicated? The game chooses from those variants at random. The numbers specify the relative chance that a variant will be chosen in any specific case. Given that 256 is default for all the variants given, then if you again specify any of these at 256, all variants will be present in a statistically equal amount. If you specify more, the variant will be chosen more often, and the higher the number, the more the probability. It's not like we're talking rocket science here, this is pretty basic modding stuff...

[Ghostpaw]

Hmm.  I just wanted specific probabilities.

[Sean Mirrsen]

But, aren't the values specific enough? A simple comparison of numbers gives you the data you're looking for. I was specifically irritated by the "How about 10000/How about 256" question sequence...

[Ghostpaw]

quote:Originally posted by Sean Mirrsen:
<STRONG>But, aren't the values specific enough? A simple comparison of numbers gives you the data you're looking for. I was specifically irritated by the "How about 10000/How about 256" question sequence...</STRONG>

It seemed to me like you were purely guestimating which really made me uncomfortable about the accuracy of your values.  Look at it this way.  Going from 256 to 10,000, which is a 9,744 difference, raises makes the odds 97/100.  But a raise from 10,000 to 25,600, which has a difference of 15,600, only raises the odds to 99/100?  It might just be me but something seems off.  You have even failed to mention the baseline, default, odds are at 256 which will be critical with "guestimation".  What would really help in figuring out how radically these numbers change the outcome will be to find out how many different possible outcomes there are.

[Dasleah]

...does it really matter? Do you need something so precise that 78.21% of your engravings are of animals?

The scale is just one of Toady's little things that only he truly knows the ins-and-outs of. All we know is 256 is the middle (so I'm guessing that's 50%).

[Sean Mirrsen]

Is it that important? The 99/100 wasn't calculation, it was exaggeration. The 97/100 was effective comparison - 10000/256 ~ 40, 100/40 ~ 2.5 ~ 3.  

edit: hm, beaten to it. Also, image element chooses from 5 varaints - meaning a 20% default chance for any given one.  

[ May 24, 2008: Message edited by: Sean Mirrsen ]