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[Imp]

Spoiler: To sof: (click to show/hide)

While I'm making myself busy, Imp, tell me, why is it that you're voting for webadict?

I don't see town focus from webadict this game, except for a brief bit after I first pointed that out he wasn't showing town focus.  I see last game web behavior, where he had an agenda D1 to be lynched for not-pro-town reasons, just for-web reasons, then had an anti-town agenda all the rest of the game.  It actually showed.  Compared to web in FBYOR6, where web played strongly pro-town from start of D1 and up until death.

Additionally, what do you think compelled Max to decide to switch to Crystal?  Please provide quotes to substantiate your point of view.

Provide quotes is a silly request, you're talking about my thoughts.  Max did not overtly state why he decided to switch to CM yet, and I haven't previously discussed, nothing to quote.

I think it's vote shuffling.  MS is willing to give FoU more time, and there's two elims, and MS needs someone else, and also wanted web's focus off of me because that's not helping web or finding scum.  MS clearly doesn't agree with a web elim then/today, so he needs someone else.  Of the someone elses available , I think MS most agreed with a CM wagon, and CM already had EP's vote at the time, so that's a nice three, tying CM with web (both 3 votes) at that moment and making web look less like tunneling me, who he said he wanted dead regardless of my alignment, so it only makes web look better to help web look like scumhunting.

I also think it's reasonable NAI behavior from Max, and decently pro-town in effect.

You know what?

No, I don't know what.  You have work to do, you said so yourself.

Clarifying/correcting a claim sof made about the previous game and his alignment then:

I assume Sofanthiel was scum in this game.

No.

Win Condition: You win if the humans win and your team has abducted at least one interesting specimen.

No and yes, you mean.

Because at time of death:

sofanthiel was:
Robot
Win Condition: You win if the vampire wins and all players not teamed with you are dead or have irrecoverably lost.

And as of when web quoted you smokescreening, you were already converted to scum.  So that game's a great view of your recent play as 'town-ally/town' late game converted to 'vamp-ally+sk to out of team folks'.

He was 'town' or close until D4 started.

[Imp]

Unvote, since I need to review the thread but understand that Max can unlink Fallacy's fate from being linked to me.

Did you know Fal's fate was linked to yours?  What are you willing to tell us about what you know about Fal's alignment and other pro-town things we should know about Fal that you choose to claim you can confirm?

[Imp]

Sof needs to get in here and vote, and not just rely on a daykill power. A reminder what Jim did to me in one of the last games.

Granted, you could just be some weird third party yourself. Make you case already!

I agree Sof needs to get in here, but making sure you're aware:

EuchreJack

And despite sof using other red text for non-players:

Vote Count — Day 1
- Euchrejack - [1] Sofanthiel,

[webadict]

Wait, both maximum spin and webadict voted me without providing a reason(in the post that voted me) to vote me. I was actually wrong about maximum spin voting me third, he voted before webadict. I'm not going to switch back to webadict though because they voted close to eachother timewise. I feel that the wagon started too quickly but that could just because I was offline.

This is true, I'm third, but I'd rather you voted me than Max at this point, if only because I don't like a Max execution, and Imp is never switching.

@Crystal:
What about Elephant?

I think I'll be driving when the day ends today as a heads up.

Who are the two you want on the block at the end of the Day?  Sofa and Crystal?  Or is it someone else?

[Imp]

Imp is never switching.

I'm a realist.  Chances are high I'll shift for either of these reasons:

You're believably pro town above what you've already shown, which if you are pro town can happen for many reasons.  If you're alive D2, maybe some mechanics will be involved to help confirm that, I don't know.  Your behavior can help, but I'm aware behavior can front.

Someone else becomes my top anti-town pick or I see some other reason to move my vote.

End of day vote mechanics and pragmatism.  If I still view you as anti-town but your lynch is not an option

That said, at this point I'd also be glad for CM to return to voting web.

And web, unlike you who stated you want me out regardless of my alignment, which I view as a shockingly poor playstyle choice - Even if you're that much of a whatever, if you're pro town I don't want you dead.  But I expect you excellent, and pro town.

[webadict]

That's  weird, I can't find it anywhere

[Imp]

...

Why'd you paste the votecount with that reaction?  I can't read your reaction there.

[Elephant Parade]

I will also add that Max generally hates playing the day game on Day 1 as town. He only truly relishes it as mafia.  Which tends to give Max away a lot. Max just isn't his obtuse annoying Day 1 town self.

This isn't the usual Day 1, IMO. We skipped RVS entirely, for one thing.

Oh, this isn't the usual Day 1, hm? Does that mean, I dunno, that other things could be different? Hm?
And if Max's meta read is invalid, could perhaps the meta read of some other person or people also be invalid? Hm?
...
But Max has been in other games that mostly dispenses with RVS, so it doesn't change my opinion. I assume that was your reason for bring it up, hm?

Eh? Dunno if you're addressing me or just the room, but if it's the former, I don't see your point. I don't think I've interacted with you at all.

EuchreJack: Did you miss this?

[ToonyMan]

@Web:
I want Jack the most, but FoU and Max have convinced me to hold off. Although I agree with Max that Jack is still scummy, and that both Jack/FoU being scum seems quite unlikely.

Sofanthiel and Crystal seems...okay. I'm like 50/50 on at least one being scum. I think it's more likely Jack is scum than either of them, but maybe combined it's more likely one is scum.

I have no strong feelings about NJW so I wouldn't mind that except I'm making a trade with him.

I have inherent suspicion toward Elephant but there's not any good reason to vote them.

Max is a possible vote, but at that point I'd rather vote Jack since voting Max would mean giving up on "saving" FoU from Jack. It goes without saying that if both are town then scum will be licking their chops for a Jack kill.

[Quarque]

I'm just going to do the thing. CrystalizedMire
Toony? Web? Anyone?

Web & Toony:

this is another reason why my vote now remains on Spin.
Out of all of my meta reads, the one one CM is the most solid and Spin has seen enough CM play to know better, this vote does not feel genuine at all.
I am almost completely certain they're town and don't understand the case. As NJW said somewhere, this is exactly how town CM plays. In a mafia team, either

a) with little coaching CM couldn't act this way, or
b) with good coaching CM couldn't act this way either for different reasons

You guys are lynching a town player and one that's a whole lot more "useful" than Fallacy.

[Elephant Parade]

The CM wagon is something, but I'd need to be satisfied this was scum weak D1 and not newer player weak D1.

...

Hm. No, I don't like the CM elim, I think they struggle with null reads D1 and sheep a bit as town. In the armed forces game, they followed public opinion quite hard, especially EP.

(See this post where they explain their vigilante nightkill choices, then immediately say that it wasn't a good decision because I looked worse. Potentially reasonable, but it does look like the EP post a few inches above that just swung their opinion.)

Hmm. I especially don't like three strong players piling on, though I guess EP seeing a procedural thing like sheeping and voting on it is pretty in character. Max seems to be being genuinely very interested in scumhunting today, which is weird but maybe a good sign unless they're on a bad elim? And I don't pretend to be able to read Web. Don't like Toony thinking about hopping on it either.

Out of time now but need to look harder at EJ, Imp and QQ. EJ in particular might be a sensible elim... shame about FoU but triple eliminating would be hilarious.

This is a sensible and detailed take that makes me feel a lot better about you.

I dislike how reactive EuchreJack has been this game and I'm not particularly fond of FoU either. I would be OK with either a triple elimination or just voting the two of them out.

I'm just going to do the thing. CrystalizedMire
Toony? Web? Anyone?

Web & Toony:

this is another reason why my vote now remains on Spin.
Out of all of my meta reads, the one one CM is the most solid and Spin has seen enough CM play to know better, this vote does not feel genuine at all.
I am almost completely certain they're town and don't understand the case. As NJW said somewhere, this is exactly how town CM plays. In a mafia team, either

a) with little coaching CM couldn't act this way, or
b) with good coaching CM couldn't act this way either for different reasons

You guys are lynching a town player and one that's a whole lot more "useful" than Fallacy.

How would you distinguish their play this game from their play in FBYOR?

[NJW2000]

Hm. No, I don't like the CM elim, I think they struggle with null reads D1 and sheep a bit as town.

Even though my play has improved, I still have a lot of null reads and I still sheep from time to time.

I've killed Crystalized before basically for not have strong enough opinions of their own, and don't want to see it happen again. That being said... ya gotta stop doing this. At least change the words a bit more.


Vet players say EuchreJack looks like scum then pile on a very new player when the link is claimed. Something is rotten in the state of Denmark. Reading too many of Imp's posts is impeding my talk words. Sheep Magellan patriot Tuesday. I'm starting to agree with Quarque.

Hmph.

You know what? I like the Maximum Spin votes, and how they probably won't overwhelm but could easily equal the CM votes. I like the idea of killing the obvious target and the person that started the wagon on the obvious target. Let's use Tric's daypower. Or at least discover who doesn't want to do that. And yep, I know how I'd look afterwards with scum!CM and town!Max, and I'm willing to take the flack for that.

MaximumSpin

[TricMagic]

...

Why'd you paste the votecount with that reaction?  I can't read your reaction there.

Pretty much me not wanting a webadict lynch, Jack looking scummy to me by tying things up, an not really having a good alternative to any of it.

Toony, is there any reason you seem a bit hands off this day? I remember you going at it with webadict, but you to just seem to have clicked together. It's not really something I see as good, and a reason to vote you.

I don't much like NJW either, but holding my verdict on that front.

[TricMagic]

Quarque too I guess. Not any clear scum day 1. Or at least scum teams.

[TricMagic]

No more voting right now please, checking votecount.