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[TricMagic]

Imp: Daygame reminds me of Armed Forces Basic, particularly on D2; weird D2 post speculating about there only being one kill because of a (Dud) still feels like a scumslip to me

Elephant, this is solo Imp. Whether they're town, TP, or SK. I've not seen their SK play, but have seen them as solo mafia. They end up playing themself into a corner.

[Elephant Parade]

Imp: Daygame reminds me of Armed Forces Basic, particularly on D2; weird D2 post speculating about there only being one kill because of a (Dud) still feels like a scumslip to me

Elephant, this is solo Imp. Whether they're town, TP, or SK. I've not seen their SK play, but have seen them as solo mafia. They end up playing themself into a corner.

Yeah, that makes sense.

[Imp]

I will add though:

Everyone

I'm not particularly sussing NJW.

However, the valuable item they claim to give me, and I confirm I got, is the one that causes any item you give or trade to give you a copy of it (except me or anyone else who can trump an auto item or otherwise handle this; I can potentially turn it on or off as I see fit, no idea if anyone else could).

If NJW is antitown and wants to ever use a kill, they have to move that valuable item first to get rid of the Page.  They could give pages away all game and still have the thing.

I don't think NJW is SK.  Some chance mafia without a team anymore.  The mechanics of the understood-to-me play fit well to either town or Mafia.  Hope to see more great, pro-town play from NJW if the game goes on.

[Elephant Parade]

NJW: Unless I'm missing something, you haven't claimed anything other than your auto. Why not?

I meant to say I didn't analyze elephants votes yet. I think Elephant is town because I think they were being genuinely helpful. Also here's my reads:
Imp-town vibes
Toonyman-it is reasonable that they believed web due to their role. I think they were genuinely helpful d2
Njw-I think they weren't lying about the Bible
Elephant Parade-I don't like their d1 self since it seems too scummy to me. Trying to get newbies eliminated because they don't want a mafioso eliminated is pretty suspicious
Fallacy-Always suspicious but this version rubs me the wrong. If they are antitown I think they're sk
EuchreJack-I don't have a solid case against euchrejack either but I think they might be serial killer

OK, I compared this to your last read list and it's actually pretty plausible; I jumped the gun with that wat.

[NJW2000]

Imp: I don't want to pass the page around, so hopefully won't be an issue.

NJW: Unless I'm missing something, you haven't claimed anything other than your auto. Why not?

I think you are. It's easy to do in a very big thread.

D1 I gave Toony a wishbone and told people not to target me.
N1 I used the wishbone on Toony and FoU
D2 I claimed the second wincon
N2 I gave Imp an item that lets them keep a copy of any item they trade or give away (claimed above). This is probably the one you missed. They've confirmed.
D3 I described how my protect works

That's... most of my role.

[Elephant Parade]

Oh, I thought the item stuff was just down to what items you started with; I didn't realize it was related to your role powers. OK, I'm satisfied.

[notquitethere]

Some judgements begin to be made. Who was what where why and how. But still most electors remain doggedly undecided, committed only to prelonging the proceedings and deferring the moment of decision.

Vote Count — Day 2
- Crystalizedmire -
- Elephant Parade -
- Euchrejack - [1] TricMagic
- FallacyofUrist -   [2] Elephant Parade, Toony
- Imp -
- NJW2000 -
- Toonyman -
- TricMagic - 
- No Elimination

Current Elimination: FallacyofUrist

Hammer at 5 votes. Day ends 12th February 11pm GMT.


Let me know if I missed anything.

Trades

Imp: Trade Arthur Conan Doyle's Magnifying Glass for Purple Chaos Emerald
Fallacy: Trade Purple Chaos Emerald for Arthur Conan Doyle's Magnifying Glass

notquitethere: Is it possible for a role flip to have missing or altered information?

Yes and no. I won't lie in a flip but it is possible for abilities to trigger on death and for abilities to change roles, leading to a role-in-death having a different suite of abilities than they had in life.

[Imp]

NJW and all:

Imp: I don't want to pass the page around, so hopefully won't be an issue.

Perfect.  If you need a subtle out, door is open.  If you don't need a subtle out, I think that's highly pro-town, or high level

At this point I'm hoping Imp is scum so I can enjoy watching them squirm as we make them dance the supercop dance and also not break Hector's post restriction. Continuously having to help the town, until eventually...there's no one left to inspect. Their batteries run out, and the dancing toy stops moving.

If you quietly pass the page to me, I'll only discuss it if I think it's pro-town to do so; if I ever die folks see it on my corpse (even out of play it's on my role, I checked with nqt, whew.)  Folks, the stuff I take out of play, if it's out of play when I flip, you'll never know.  I can actually use items that I took out of play and flip that phase and you'd never see them.  So, when/if I flip, know that there's some amount of hidden info leaving play.  This is the best I can give you that's pro-town to share.  Again, is Imp pro-town or not - look at the total of what I do.  You'll never know it from tracking my visible actions, you can't see enough of them, no matter what.  Scum, should you kill me or not if you can?  Depends... think I'd be able to do this much if any of it was actually useful against you?  Let's find out.

Toony and all:
Also, Toony, the item that has limitation/kill on it, it's one item.  And it's in NJW's hands.  You saw him trade it to me.  I took it out of play N2, the same N2 that Toons checked for kill and limitation.  1 item has those spheres... no.  2 do.  You'll never see the one I take out of play, unless I bring it back into play by giving it to someone.  If I can do this maybe others can too, we should know.

As killing items go, it's 'quite underpowered'.  It has 6 shots, and every time it is used, 1/shots chance to kill the target.  Once it does kill its target, it reloads to 6 shots and can continue to be used.  NJW has no reason to use it while they hold the Page, regardless of alignment.  Once they don't have the Page, if that ever happens, it's probably not the most scary kill item method in play.
NJW and all:
NJW, I see no reason for you to try to avoid annoying anti-town or avoiding attracting attention because of your scumhunting day play or anything else you can pro-town do.  Supposedly, anyone gets hit, it's you taking the hit.

I'm not going to scream my head off at you, but... you can't hide from scum.  That got established D1 when you took the page.  I don't think you have any reason to try to minimize or hide, so I'd really, really appreciate your help to find scum every single day as best you can, town probably needs top-level town play.  And I think you've got a top-level mind and a lot of skill.  Your day game appears... hands off and passive.  I'm running out of ideas why you especially might not be doing your level best to find anti-town, presuming you're pro-town, because as pro-town the sooner the game ends the sooner you don't die from page.

As anti-town, you have good control over if you die from the page or not, especially with me flippin' out over trying to control and prevent any possible kills that come from me or anyone who will listen to.  So long as we're sure you're town and saving us from night kills, we might let you coast, even if you're scum, all the way to end game.

Noooo, I hate that idea.  And can't see why you as pro-town don't want to find scum as you can.  So... please be obviously trying.  I hate to push you; I've got CM saying I'm giving orders, EP saying I'm breathing down his neck... I hate to push them and I have no reason not to give you pressure (Max's Supernormal, I had reason to not push nqt or allow others to push him; I was trying to play 'hide the human(s)' and wasn't sure there was more than 1 human in play, or even if there were still any).  But I don't have reasons like that this game.  Please come up to their... or better yet, your own... standard of quality day town play.  I understand if you're busy, but seriously.  If you're pro-town, I need your help.  And while you can laugh with me and say 'Imp, who has helped you more this game?' I actually could point at someone who has, I just won't.  And I don't take bribes, not even if you gave me a quadrillion dollars, or hold the night kill off my and everyone's heads - because I can see reasons why scum might do that.  So, bring out your day game, as time and your choice allows, please.

All:

While that Page remains in play, I am 100 committed to not using, allowing, or triggering kills, insofar as I can prevent them from happening.  May the mod have mercy on us all.  I'm sorry my role is scary (presuming it scares anyone but me, I am so scared of my role it drives my goal to get the anti-town out immediately; but I'm also town.  If I seem tense, I know what I can do (I still haven't close to full claimed) and I'm afraid of my anti-town counterpart(s) that may still be alive may in their own way be more capable than I, especially as they unlock and grow themselves.  We may not have time, I hope game ends with D3 elim.

[Imp]

Presuming D4 comes.

I presume we all agree that using a kill while the Page is in NJW's hands is anti-town.

But what is the will of town about EJ's inductions into the chats?

Are we cool about him bringing folks into his chats still?

I have a concern that he could be driving a killer chat to visit Jonestown.  Otherwise I'm not concerned, long as he doesn't use a kill while that Page is in play, all's reasonably fine, though I can't rule out something like gasoline and all die at once when he chooses, instead of 'just one' that doesn't sound so scary.

A normal game may have an arsonist.  His thing is quite visible, potentially useful in various ways, and seems completely in scope of this game to be a mass kill, a single kill, not even a kill.

I am highly confident it is not a conversion because:

There will be no traditional cults or conversion

I could be dead wrong, but I am going to hope we didn't have anyone make a perfect case for a perfect non-traditional conversion role.

But, do we 'request limits of EJ on his use of induction into chat?'  I don't handle pro-town terrorists well.  Secretdorf's a great example of that.  I don't read full anti-town in EJ's attitude, and if it's just a single kill I don't even care.  Long, slow prep for mass kill, that might work, wow do I care.  One does not let cancer grow; one lets farmers' fields of delicious good stuff grow.  It's 100% detectable and 'our fault' if EJ slowly walks the kill around all who live and SKs out.

I suspect I'm EJ's intended N3 chat inductee, seems 'relevant'.  My really huge objection to this is that 'how many hostages do we give him, in case he can kill us all instantly?'  I had a similar concern and wanted no more inductees D2.

Anyone willing please discuss.  I would absolutely pin that power if I could see a way to.  Sure, he seems the type to start pulling triggers the moment he doesn't get his way or someone might take his toy away.  I'm only worried about him killing us all, though I don't want him killing anyone pro-town, and the fact that the deaths don't happen until N6 and take all remaining survivors out does not make it okay with me.  I'm guessing, but what the bleep is he doing.

[TricMagic]

This becomes an issue where no one trusts and the easy vote get lynched.

I can say from the silence, it's not Fal that's the scum. Pick someone else.

[Crystalizedmire]

I don't want to tie the votes so Fallacy of Urist. I remember you thinking that Tric was sk because of their ability. Also, I'm pretty sure Toony could not be maf or sk since they gave the page to someone who is basically bullet proof. These attacks seem pretty forced to me and you are very concerned with self preservation due to cooperating with a flipped mafia during d1 to get vulnerability removed.
Tricmagic: why?

[TricMagic]

There isn't any proof. No signs, no gambits. In order to convince me you'd need a very goo case. I've yet to see any. You're just as likely to be SK as Fal. So is NJW for that matter. (Though the claim of a second wincon could mean their primary was SK.)

You know who is suspisous? Jack. Elephant. Jack for the self-revival claim, which probably needs self-protection. Elephant for having multiple chats and an item designed to kill them. For some reason.

[Elephant Parade]

This becomes an issue where no one trusts and the easy vote get lynched.

I can say from the silence, it's not Fal that's the scum. Pick someone else.

Have you considered that it might be silent because Fallacy has no living scumbuddies and is electing not to defend themself in the hopes that people will get distracted and move on?

There isn't any proof. No signs, no gambits. In order to convince me you'd need a very goo case. I've yet to see any. You're just as likely to be SK as Fal. So is NJW for that matter. (Though the claim of a second wincon could mean their primary was SK.)

You know who is suspisous? Jack. Elephant. Jack for the self-revival claim, which probably needs self-protection. Elephant for having multiple chats and an item designed to kill them. For some reason.

I have multiple chats to make my chat-targeting spherecop ability more versatile. The item exists because I took Vulnerability.

[Imp]

But hey, ToonyMan, can you find me that meme from a few games ago where there's crickets at EoD only when we're lynching town?

This was brought up in 'defense' of scum!web by scum!max as well.

I don't mind the speculation, but it makes me think immediately of this.

Why's this a meaningful innocence-tell to you, Tric?

[TricMagic]

I remember in one BYOR where Fal was the mafia pizza man. They were engaged, witty, and made it to a mafia victory. Town Fallacy finds themselves floundering like a fish out of water, not knowing hw to hunt cause they rarely make it this far as town. And it's not an easy situation either. The rate we've hit scum this game makes finding a single solo player quite difficult. So we need to start poking holes in things.

Lynching Fallacy bets the game that this silent Fallacy is SK or similar. If they're not, then no information is gained. The perfect scenario for the lone remaining scum. We are severely ahead on the timeline for this game. More time is something scum desperately wants. Anything that nets town additional info to sus them out? To be avoided at all possible cost.