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[BlackHeartKabal]

BHK: please share why you wanted me marked and what the mark does.

Esteemed BlackHeartKabal:  Cool.  I really want you sharing everything you can and will, including why you picked Esteemed Lenglon, and what else you did or may have done while there.

If I die, I can one shot vengekill someone with the mark. To answer you and Imp, I'm marking people who I think would be suspects if there were less players, but who aren't liable to be lynched. I don't expect to survive to the end having fullclaimed, so my eventual exit from the game must take scum with me - my targeting behaviour has to be a bit speculative, accordingly. Secretdorf, for example, is likely to be lynched, so marking them would waste a night.

[Lenglon]

Cool. BHK: did you double my action last night?

[BlackHeartKabal]

Cool. BHK: did you double my action last night?

No? If I could double actions, I'd have done it to Imp's inspect.

[Imp]

Imp: close, but my inspect doesn't tell me the target's alignment at all. I get groupchat / no groupchat. It's useless against SKs but works on most millers.

Esteemed Lenglon:
And do I understand right, that you have told us you are keeping specifics to yourself, however you have a result for two where you expected a result for one, and you have conflicting results, that is, one of each?

I get that you may not want to discuss.  Just that's what I think I already understand from what you already said.

Esteemed BlackHeartKabal, for reasons I don't understand, it seems only Esteemed notquitethere and myself see potential real issues about Esteemed Secretdorf.

Do you think they're scummy?  Yes I would like them marked because that helps ensure you have to be one of the last they kill, if they go on that murderspree I think they're 1-2 cycles from, unless they are indeed just a juggernaut of a townie.  Even if they are a juggernaut of a townie, the way they played earlier, their willingness for anyone to die, their lack of scumhunting and lack of interest in trying to find out if the person about to be lynched was town or not before the roleflip that shows it, their sheer expressed disappointment in the few nightkills - I think they'd be happy having this game end with them as sole survivor, town or not, and think we should all be glad of that too.  Not quite my dream, even if it is theirs.

Are you going to vote them?

[Lenglon]

Imp: that is correct, I got:

is in a groupchat.

is not in a groupchat.

[BlackHeartKabal]

Esteemed BlackHeartKabal, for reasons I don't understand, it seems only Esteemed notquitethere and myself see potential real issues about Esteemed Secretdorf.

Do you think they're scummy?  Yes I would like them marked because that helps ensure you have to be one of the last they kill, if they go on that murderspree I think they're 1-2 cycles from, unless they are indeed just a juggernaut of a townie.  Even if they are a juggernaut of a townie, the way they played earlier, their willingness for anyone to die, their lack of scumhunting and lack of interest in trying to find out if the person about to be lynched was town or not before the roleflip that shows it, their sheer expressed disappointment in the few nightkills - I think they'd be happy having this game end with them as sole survivor, town or not, and think we should all be glad of that too.  Not quite my dream, even if it is theirs.

Are you going to vote them?

I don't understand why the rest of the town doesn't see issues with the votes being consolidated in this one player. Hell, NQT doesn't trust me, and I've stated that I haven't trusted you most of this game, but all three of us feel the same with this one player. You've pointed out everything there really is to mind about them. I'd be concerned if the most upright, scumhunting, innocent town player had that much power, let alone someone like Secretdorf.

This is the closest I'd be willing to advocate a policy lynch, if you could call it that. If they survive today, I absolutely intend to mark them. I would go as far to say that their death is instrumental to a town victory.

[Jim Groovester]

Ohshit it's a Noita beta update patch.

Fuck this mafia game bullshit see you assholes later

[Lenglon]

Jim: No Noita 4 U!

[Imp]

Jim: No Noita 4 U!

Is this where we find out if the infested gun gives ant-egg bullets to reload it?

[ToonyMan]

Imp: that is correct, I got:

is in a groupchat.

is not in a groupchat.

Can we determine which two players were targeted? It's been fairly obvious on most nights.

[ToonyMan]

Ohshit it's a Noita beta update patch.

Fuck this mafia game bullshit see you assholes later

Okay bye thanks for the help

[Elephant Parade]

I propose eliminating Knightwing since BHK is posting and they aren't (and, much less importantly, because I have a bomb on BHK). However:

BHK: Skimming your posts, you've only mentioned Secretdorf twice, and, unhelpfully, they aren't on your reads list at all (I think someone else already pointed this out).

(...)

Regarding you and hector, yes, they were both the same questions, but hector was never suspicious to me, and your questions were posted first to begin with. I've outright said that I consider hector to be town, and I trust his reads - so that both of you focused on Sofanthiel early made it a good lead to follow, barring the concluded unlikely circumstance that both you and Sofanthiel were scum. Even if hector were suspect, then the only thing that would matter in that regard would be copying your reads - but he wouldn't. As you pointed out, he likely came to the same conclusion independently. Which, again, wouldn't just happen without a reason. What's the issue here? And, following that, what gives the impression that just because I'm focused on you and Sofanthiel doesn't mean I consider Mire and Secretdorf suspects as well? We can't do everything all at once - we have a system of days and nights that provide us limited opportunities to do things, and the priority is not just in finding scum and hostile thirds, but also prioritizing order of investigation and elimination one we have that info, in this case.

(...)

How does everyone feel with the Esteemed Secretdorf having the only vote in the game?  And/or so many that they can instantly hammer by themself?  We're not there today.  Tomorrow?  D5?

With the control over the vote, and the lack of scumhunting so far, and them still being alive.  I am as close to concerned about this as my calm and kind ruleset allows.

Should I mark them, as a safeguard in case they try to do something funny later on?

(...)

In terms of reads -

Firm Town camp -
hector13 - As again, I have a fair confidence in him. He hasn't done anything I have a particular distaste or suspicion for.
Maximum Spin - Webadict and Jim's mason, apparently.
Lenglon - Again, not a suspicious person, if a bit overeager to policy.
Toony - The trusty bus miller that was willing to sacrifice themselves. Again, not really suspicious at all, and verifiable.
Jim - Webadict and Spin's mason.

Town Lean -
Imp: Why do I want to trust you, but still feel that small bit of suspicion that keeps me from wanting to confirm you in my mind, even after our cordial interaction?
Canadian - They've been more active and scumhunting. Not shifty enough to go either way.
Parade - If they've claimed, I might have overlooked it. There's nothing to really verify with them, but they've been acting decently independently and haven't done much scummy.

Ambivalence and the Unknown -
Knightwing - mimir
Mire - Hasn't posted, and could go either way. I should pay more attention to her.
notquitethere - I don't know, at all. The lack of webbing is suspect, but maybe it's because anyone visiting me stops my actions, blanket?

Sofanthiel, of course, must die.

Given that, what makes them priority numero uno today?

[Imp]

I don't understand why the rest of the town doesn't see issues with the votes being consolidated in this one player. Hell, NQT doesn't trust me, and I've stated that I haven't trusted you most of this game, but all three of us feel the same with this one player. You've pointed out everything there really is to mind about them. I'd be concerned if the most upright, scumhunting, innocent town player had that much power, let alone someone like Secretdorf.

This is the closest I'd be willing to advocate a policy lynch, if you could call it that. If they survive today, I absolutely intend to mark them. I would go as far to say that their death is instrumental to a town victory.

Well, for me the issue is more, I've talked with them as I've talked to you.  Except for a talk flavored based on their behavior, just like your behavior is what I focused on with you, it's pretty much the same talk.  I wasn't very aggressive with you - your play doesn't look that aggressive to me.  You do appear to care who you kill.

While I don't know (at this time) if you're town, and I really bet you're pretty darn powerful, either before or after death, because if you're honest about being stopped just by being visited by a living player - that's one heck of a weakness, and I'd expect it to be balanced out in some wonderful way.  But your play feels reasonable for town to me, both your night and day game that's been revealed so far/seems confirmable.

Esteemed ToonyMan, Esteemed Lenglon:

Seriously, what are your reads on Esteemed Secretdorf?  Why do you appear so comfortable with that, and why are the issues I'm concerned about not bothering you?

If you feel everything is NAI about that one, why are you not chasing them yourself to scumhunt and do your job that way?  How can they get to D4 and be NAI and that's okay?  If you feel they are town, why are they townie to you?

And are you ready to vote them?  If not, why?

[Lenglon]

Max: I do actually want secretdorf gone here myself. If you recall the BYOR that I Fused with Shakerag, non-killing SKs have been done successfully, by giving them additional vote power and a vest mechanic. Since secretdorf seems to serve no investigative or protective role and lacks an agressive scumhunting attitude, I think that may be what we have here. I do not think dorf is mafia, but I don't view them as town. however...

Toony: my results were phrased as if they were both about Max, who was my intended target. I do not think they hit Max.

BHK: I find it odd how you agressed on the first player suggested to you without providing justifications of your own. Please answer Elephant Parade's query very carefully.

[hector13]

Now, I targeted Esteemed Jim Groovester last night, and evidently hit Esteemed Maximum Spin. Do we assume this is an unclaimed bus/merge thing, or just an unclaimed redirect?

What makes you think you didn’t hit Esteemed Maximum Spin?