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[FallacyofUrist]

Yes, like I said before, that's exactly it. You have a unique and recognizable blend of competence and incompetence. You don't seem to realize how impulsive and, often, inattentive you really are. You are simultaneously smart enough to come up with plans, but not enough to stop yourself from stepping in them in certain noticeable ways.
That may be harsh, but I am being frank.

Well thanks, I guess.

At least you can reevaluate once I'm executed.

I don't think I'll be night killed honestly. I'm too much of a divisive figure for that. Somewhat like Tric, ironically.

Relatedly: Jack has two votes out of sixteen. It's not that special. If mafia wanted him out badly enough, he'd be out. I could get him out if I had been mafia, and that's not just bragging.

Yes.

Thank you, vile knave. This point. See above, Tric.

Honestly? And I know you didn't ask me and I'm not really going to push the point anyway? I assumed that Tric was probably joking about being a 3p (and is actually town). Not that he couldn't be, but that it didn't seem like it.

I was half-tempted to try analyzing Tric's sense of humor, but I think I have better things to do.

[TricMagic]

If I am not willing to die for town, then I am scum, yes? In a 15P game, getting out mafia is a fine sacrifice.
That and fake it till you make it. To answer you Lenglon, I did. It's only 2 pieces, maybe three if you count me talking to Knightwing, but it's there. Though it's closer to Townhunting than Mafiahunting. Which would be an Ally thing. I admit. But I always look for town to trust. Then back that trust to the hilt, even if I bleed and oftentimes doubt them. That's Mafia.

[Maximum Spin]

Thank you, vile knave. This point. See above, Tric.

I'm disagreeing with you. You said the mafia wouldn't try, or would have a hard time trying, to vote out a town double-voter. I said it would be easy and worth trying.

[FallacyofUrist]

If I am not willing to die for town, then I am scum, yes? In a 15P game, getting out mafia is a fine sacrifice.

Do you think I'm scum, and if so, why?

[FallacyofUrist]

Thank you, vile knave. This point. See above, Tric.

I'm disagreeing with you. You said the mafia wouldn't try, or would have a hard time trying, to vote out a town double-voter. I said it would be easy and worth trying.

But they can just shoot the double voter instead of risking a messy day fight and potentially making an enemy.

[TricMagic]

That and if it's not a mafia doublevoter, they don't want them around during later days where it has more weight. Sure they could kill them, but that's a bit risky this game. Could be watchers about. In the same manner, they need to tread carefully for any major figures who might draw attention. It's almost the perfect plan if you want to survive till day 4. At which point I'd hope to have established town credit to pull me out of the TP debt.

As for my humor, it is Dragon and Hats. Blame webadict for the latter, it's his fault. He dared us.


Ninja'd. Would you like spies with that?

[TricMagic]

Lenglon: I feel like it's a passable vessel for breaking the ice.  It rarely on its own generates real value, and I think it mostly happens because no one has come up with a serviceable alternative that's worth anything.  Many many years ago, you'd see practically arbitrary tunneling right out the gate, but it's been a while since I can recall seeing it.

Lenglon is obvscum. I used my one-shot infallible nuclear awesome day-alignment inspect no-failure-possible ability on her and she's mafia. Everyone vote Lenglon now or I will break your legs.

Hello RVS. The simple fact is, you pushed a case against me. So I pushed back. If I die overnight, any town credit you have would vanish. If you die, I at least get to steal a hat before I die. I might even make it to the second night to use it, hence confirming my role. I've not asked Webadict if I can use a hat and gift it the same night, but I'm hopeful given the change to action resolution.

And as you said... A divisive lynch will reveal info, wouldn't it? Are you willing to step onto the pyre~

On another note, it's 9:05 PM here.

[A_Curious_Cat]

I've been reading through Toaster's posts and I've come across a post where they say "TricMagic is Org 2.0.".

Who (or what) is "Org 2.0"?

[FallacyofUrist]

That and if it's not a mafia doublevoter, they don't want them around during later days where it has more weight. Sure they could kill them, but that's a bit risky this game. Could be watchers about. In the same manner, they need to tread carefully for any major figures who might draw attention. It's almost the perfect plan if you want to survive till day 4. At which point I'd hope to have established town credit to pull me out of the TP debt.

As for my humor, it is Dragon and Hats. Blame webadict for the latter, it's his fault. He dared us.

Yeah, but just as much as there could be watchers, there could just as easily be anti-watchers. We don't have that knowledge about the game state yet.

Sure, Euchre will draw more attention. But so will you, and me, and Toaster, and even Jim arguably. The players who speak up more get more Night attention. Having a second vote just contributes to that.

As for your humor, Spin said he thought you were joking about being a third party, but you said yourself it was a serious strategy, not a joke.

Hello RVS. The simple fact is, you pushed a case against me. So I pushed back. If I die overnight, any town credit you have would vanish. If you die, I at least get to steal a hat before I die. I might even make it to the second night to use it, hence confirming my role. I've not asked Webadict if I can use a hat and gift it the same night, but I'm hopeful given the change to action resolution.

And as you said... A divisive lynch will reveal info, wouldn't it? Are you willing to step onto the pyre~

Yes, pushing back is understandable, but pushing back can take more forms than just a counter vote. Do you think I am scum? Yes or no answer, with details as to why, please.

Yeah, my own death will create information, but I know I am town, and the definite death of a townie is not preferable to the likely death of a mafioso/potential death of a third party/unlikely death of a townie.

I've been reading through Toaster's posts and I've come across a post where they say "TricMagic is Org 2.0.".

Who (or what) is "Org 2.0"?

Org is the name of a player from years (think over a decade) ago famous for shitposting and doing basically nothing else.

TricMagic is far better than Org, I'll give him that.

[Maximum Spin]

I've been reading through Toaster's posts and I've come across a post where they say "TricMagic is Org 2.0.".

Who (or what) is "Org 2.0"?

Distant forum history, a player named Org. Before my time too, but I gather he was bad.
He was saying TricMagic is like a new Org.

[Egan_BW]

ugg. hey guys. I should be post number 400, which is neat. I don't have mental energy today, which is probably disappointing after yesterday, but it's the truth.

[juicebox]

Gonna give my thoughts on Hector and Toaster so far, and then I'll read through the Tricmagic/Fallacy argument.

I do like Hector so far, we agree on quite a few things, like Tricmagic and EuchreJack, and he's been pursuing several different cases. I'm leaning town on hum.

Toaster on the other hand, I don't like. He's been tunneled in on Tric for half of D1, to the point where pretty much all of his interactions with other people are abut Tric, while Tric can be a polarizing figure, Toaster is a vet and he should know how to pursue multiple cases. I also have a hard time believing that he's this unfamiliar with Tric's playstyle when they've played together in BYOR 15,  and even if he doesn't remember the game well, I feel as though he would be the type to look at past games for reference

[juicebox]

I also want to mention that I do like this post from Fluffe

But anyway, who do you think is scum right now, and who do you think is town? Why?

Oh hey a question I love those! Anyway as far as town goes the only person im like almost certain on of at least not being mafia is Tric their role and general abilities are just too out there for me to think webadict would make a mafia that public having a mafia that gives buffs to (presumably) everyone would be a bit strange as well. In my eyes they are either some type of neutral third party or town.

As for who the scum is this one im much less certain on but if I had to say someone I would say at the moment EuchreJack his logic for his votes so far seem quite questionable and while most of it I think is RVS sheniganry he keeps changing it up so dang often that its making me lose track of what his actual views on things are which feels like something a mafia would do. His logic for who is and isnt bad is also questionable but when its the first day and your forced to go off gut feelings more then anything else that isnt that surprising. This is a very weak convention atm though and im probably not gonna push it if he makes a compelling case for what he is trying to accomplish.

And this post from knightwing.

Knightwing64, EuchreJack:  Are you sure the people you are following are your benevolent shepards?  Or, are they wolves in shephards clothing leading you to your doom?  Also, how did you come to this conclusion?

What’s with the riddles? I don’t trust anyone 100% at this point, it’s d1.

Generally I make it a rule to trust Tric, which normally bites me in the ass, but sometimes has good results.

Jack has opinions that seemingly deviate from everybody else, obv scum or perhaps a unbelieved prophet?

Personally not a fan of voting Jack, it seems a little too easy. I won’t fight against it, but I don’t prefer it. Jack is generally a useful town, so if they turn out town, that’s a huge loss for town, at least in my opinion.

Juicebox at first glance appears to just be a dedicated town, but I don’t know how they play, so for all I know that could be a scum tell.

Fluffe exists, I have a bad feeling about them, but it’s just a gut feeling and I have no actual evidence, so probably not too important right now.

Toonyman is as always 200 IQ, I cannot hope to fathom his thought process, so I am a firm neutral on them. Although anyone who has a few braincells leaves me on edge. 

Curious Cat has a cat in name, don’t trust, dogs are obv better

Toaster is kinda a null, other then their opinion of Tric.

I naturally distrust Lenglon, as they drove me insanity trying to get me out during a game I was town because they didn’t like the cut of my jib.

Jim is in the same boat as Toony, mostly.


And that’s everyone I can currently think of at the moment. Huzzah, a post of length, width and height!

Glad to see them coming in and participating, I hope they keep it up. Leaning town on both for now

[juicebox]

To Note, Jack is actually the safest lynch target, both on Scum's side and Towns. A doublevote they don't know about? Yes, perfect Day 1 Elim.

In the same manner, this lynch on me would also be perfect. Had I not been awake. This dragon don't lie, the hats are mine to steal and gift. And perhaps most importantly... My strategy for day 1 was to be seen as Third Party. Tell me this is a strategy that mafia would approve of? I say they'd have to be insane to do so. Ignoring my first NAI post, my plan from the start was to be seen as the Third Party, cause no one would hunt me on Day 1. Mafia won't believe me to be a threat naturally. But as a lynch? I'm extremely divisive, enough to hide connections between mafia partners, and you were their scapegoat and mouthpiece Fallacy.

Hmmm.
Jack. If you aren't scum, come vote Fallacy with me. I may end up regretting saying this, but I don't think Toaster is likely to be scum. His read may be dumb, but it's consistent with what I've seen from him as town before: uncomfortable with deviations from a rigid idea of Proper Mafia meta. I don't really believe he is using this as a replacement for scumhunting, but rather that he genuinely believes he is scumhunting.
Also, you too, Toony. Come over to the, uh, non-Fallacious side!

Is it bad that I've seen Tric OMGUS so many times that I consider it a nulltell in Tric's case? It's stupid and unhelpful, but if you do it every time...

That's not bad, that's just "being right". If he doesn't do it, that's when you worry.

I mean, you're not wrong. I never tell my actual alignment. For all you know, I'm spreading WIFOM around and Fal is right. But that still makes me an uninformative lynch. I would need to be mafia, but mafia would never have approved of this. I have a higher chance of being an SK than mafia. Some sort of weird Hat Arsonist. As such, my lynch doesn't tell anything if I'm third party, and if I'm town they can use that to build a smokescreen.

Nin.

The first part of this post is off to me. It reads to me as if Tric is certain Jack isn't scum

[juicebox]

To Note, Jack is actually the safest lynch target, both on Scum's side and Towns. A doublevote they don't know about? Yes, perfect Day 1 Elim.

In the same manner, this lynch on me would also be perfect. Had I not been awake. This dragon don't lie, the hats are mine to steal and gift. And perhaps most importantly... My strategy for day 1 was to be seen as Third Party. Tell me this is a strategy that mafia would approve of? I say they'd have to be insane to do so. Ignoring my first NAI post, my plan from the start was to be seen as the Third Party, cause no one would hunt me on Day 1. Mafia won't believe me to be a threat naturally. But as a lynch? I'm extremely divisive, enough to hide connections between mafia partners, and you were their scapegoat and mouthpiece Fallacy.

I mean, you're not wrong. I never tell my actual alignment. For all you know, I'm spreading WIFOM around and Fal is right. But that still makes me an uninformative lynch. I would need to be mafia, but mafia would never have approved of this. I have a higher chance of being an SK than mafia. Some sort of weird Hat Arsonist. As such, my lynch doesn't tell anything if I'm third party, and if I'm town they can use that to build a smokescreen.

This is all garbage.

Jack is a poor execution target for scum since he has two votes, and at least for Day 1, for town too because town would prefer to keep a double voter in their pocket than to remove them willy-nilly.

There are enough mafia players here willing to go for a gambit that would make enough sense from your perspective that I don't think this disqualifies you from being scum. Taking refuge in audacity won't save you. (But your partners might) The strategy you propose also makes a lot of sense as a scum player. It'd also be very competent of you to do so, albeit madness at the same time. But you know. That's TricMagic.

The fact that most everyone has a divisive opinion on you makes you a very informative execution. You can't say 'mafia would never approve of this'. That's WIFOM. Audacious strategies are valid.

I'd eat my hat if you were town.

The fact you can call this trash says a lot. As mafia would want a doublevoter doubledead. After all, if it's not their doublevoter, then it's a liabilty. Unless they think they can control Euchrejack. I have little hope of doing so. One of his sheeping targets might, but uh... Sheeping is bad Jack, make reads before you commit to that.

And yeah, it's audacious. For a solo player. Between getting my role and posting, what are the chances that mafia approved of this in the first place? There isn't much time between things, and OoT you can check my arrival in the discord for when I clicked the link. That's WIFOM too though.

drinks from the chocolate river. If I flip as town, mafia wins. If I flip as TP, mafia wins. If I flip as mafia, mafia wins. A better plan for me would be to cause as much Chaos as possible before Time's up. Looks at thread title. In any case, there isn't a scenario where this is good for town. And shooting me is worse, since I currently have no powers. They just don't want their hats taken and given to someone actually deserving of them.


So.. Fallacy. Are you saying you want to Thunderdome with this most fiery dragon of hats? You first, me second.

If you flip as mafia, then mafia loses one of their limited members. The mafia, being outnumbered, do not want to lose members. That makes no sense. If you flip as third party, at least the mafia don't lose one of their members, but neither do the town. It's a neutral outcome, good for them only in that it narrows down their targets. Of course if you flip as town, then the mafia benefit, but I am willing to bet that you are not town.

Yes. I will fight you. I will suffer and bleed for it, and be tortured by the spears of your partners and admirers, who believe that the most holy dragon of hats TricMagic cannot possibly be scum in any way due to your sheer audacity

But I will make you bleed, dragon. My mere mortal hands will pierce your scales, rip out your heart, and bring an end to your menace.

Even if you kill me, by curse or by time, I shall burn you to ash. For none can stop the Dragon of Hats. (haha. Very serious Fallacy. Nice to see you having fun.)

Here too, he's still talking as if he's certain that Jack isn't scum. I think I may have to reevaluate my position on Tric here