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[FallacyofUrist]

Totally! It's... also only nine players, though. Seems to have skipped a bunch of them for some reason.

Wow that's convenient

Who's more trustworthy - Jim Groovester or hector13?

[webadict]

Lurker Track
------------------------
Lenglon - 108 110 112 114 122 124 128 131 134 138 140 168 171 176 188 192 194 200 206 211 273 275 278 280 318 346 359 361 365 371 375 385 389 410 413 414 417 430 431 433 434 437 438 476 478 480 482 484 487 491 494 498 500 502 525 Last post was 4 hours ago.
Maximum Spin - 181 183 187 191 196 204 208 217 223 248 253 255 259 263 269 286 314 319 321 323 340 363 366 372 374 380 387 388 392 399 420 426 429 432 436 439 469 473 483 497 499 501 505 508 512 527 529 531 534 Last post was 3 hours ago.
notquitethere - 143 145 147 152 163 186 213 220 300 310 316 339 349 452 Last post was 11 hours ago.
Toaster - 100 102 106 113 117 158 209 215 256 265 272 294 312 412 419 421 423 446 454 471 496 Last post was 7 hours ago.
ToonyMan - 155 161 162 164 172 177 202 207 251 254 258 264 266 287 288 324 333 334 354 355 408 409 411 415 416 418 462 464 466 468 472 511 514 520 549 Last post was 1 hour ago.
TricMagic - 149 153 154 156 159 189 193 198 201 205 221 222 227 234 236 325 327 329 331 338 344 357 370 376 378 381 383 384 391 395 396 443 444 445 458 459 477 479 481 485 486 490 492 493 495 509 513 517 521 523 526 530 533 539 Last post was 2 hours ago.

[webadict]

I got distracted because it was too big for one post.

[Fluffe9911]

Who's more trustworthy - Jim Groovester or hector13?

hector13 no contest simply through avoiding most of the Tric argument and not making bizzare semi contradictory or confusing posts like Jim has done

[Lenglon]

NQT: Lurkertracker just revealed that you haven't made a content-post in a very long while, and that you have some of the least interaction with the game in general. Please voice your opinions on the current happenings.

[Jim Groovester]

But why is he a bad choice and not a neutral one?

Because I want to lynch scum and TricMagic isn't scum.

Shouldn't I be trying to actively lynch the players I suspect? Isn't that how I'm supposed to be playing mafia? I'm really baffled at where these questions are coming from or where they're going.

Is a serial killer a bad execution? You're eliminating a threat to the town. If I had Tric's alignment confirmed to me as SK I'd rate his execution as fair, as opposed to good (executing scum) or bad (executing town).

This is pointless.

[Maximum Spin]

On this note. Is this a good game to actually skip the day 1 lynch? I'm a bit curious. and hat hungry, but eh.

Oh my god, no, I think I would quit. Didn't we learn that nolynch d1s lead to d1s all over again?

Spin:

Once you're next available, please respond to this.

Okay.


That's it, that's my response.

If you really want to use the argument that I’m scum because I’m conforming to my mafia self, then.

A. Why is it too unlikely that I’ve personally grown since my last game?

B. Are there no other factors that could trigger a difference in behavior?

C. Is that really sufficient reason to attempt to execute me?

D. Please provide examples and quotes to use for comparison instead of appealing to your authority as an ‘expert in Fallacy’. Justify what you’re saying.

Wow I don't have it in me to care about this tonight. Okay, fine, aliens probed you in the night causing you to personally grow into playing mafia worse.

That's it. That's my response. For real this time. After seeing the stupidly long post eight nine posts up where you respond point-by-point to Tric's rambling that you've already managed to manage him into posting three times now and waste even more posts on, you don't deserve any more of the air in the room. Good day, sir.

Funnily enough, your argument that I’m scum because I’m acting like scum me usually does is similar to Jim’s argument that Tric is town because he’s apparently within his town meta and needs no further explanation?

Well, Tric is within his town meta and needs no further explanation. If Tric is actually mafia here, or even a particularly hostile (like an SK) third-party, I would eat my aforementioned glass hat. This is a very common argument in mafia games around here and I think it is very silly of you to suggest that it is inappropriate (implicitly, scummy) that two players are both making it about two different other players. (I wrote this part before the earlier part, that's why it's politer.)

FoU is a mafia-ally. They're behaving like Webadict in FBYOR5. I'm done trying to reason with them at this point and it's a waste of time. They're wasting everyone's time and making everyone upset to cause trouble and help mafia. Maybe they are just mafia, but I think drawing this much attention to themselves is suicide and I don't really want to think about it anymore today. They probably realize Tric is very likely not to be mafia and that's why they specifically want to vote Tric out, because it's a merit to his team. I think this explains their shift in focus over the course of Day 1. [...]Jack, which players do you think are dodging attention maliciously?

You know what? I think this is incredibly correct and insightful.
I'll even give you one of my rare and highly valuable vote switches if you want, but you have to ask for it.
Goddamn it, Jim. (I'm neither a doctor nor a bricklayer.) You can't give up on Fallacy at the same time I give up on Fallacy or he's going to say we secretly coordinated giving up on Fallacy.

[Lenglon]

Fluffe, you asked for a summary of the arguments going on:

FoU proposed voting out Tric, because an overwhelming majority at the time thought that Tric was 3p, and a 3p lynch is better than a townie lynch, and there was a reasonable chance that Tric was actually scum faking 3p.

Jim and Max pushed a case against FoU involving problems with his case against Tric. You should ask for them to give you their own summaries of their cases, especially Jim, because I don't think they'd agree that my summary of their cases would be fair.

I pushed a case against Jim because of problems involving his case against FoU.

Most of the other posts have been discussions about the cases listed above, or mafia theorycraft or forum behavior requests like asking for quotes to be formatted in readable ways and suchlike.

PPE: Max, what you just said about nolynches doesn't seem right. I could have sworn that you've said that you hate night 0 because it makes games start on Day 2. Aren't those two statements directly contradictory? I do admit there's a chance that I'm mis-remembering who says that but...

[Fluffe9911]

Jim and Max pushed a case against FoU involving problems with his case against Tric. You should ask for them to give you their own summaries of their cases, especially Jim, because I don't think they'd agree that my summary of their cases would be fair.

Alrighty sure
@Jim
@Max
@FoU
@Tric
What's your summary of the argument so far? Would you say Lenglons is close to being right?

[Maximum Spin]

PPE: Max, what you just said about nolynches doesn't seem right. I could have sworn that you've said that you hate night 0 because it makes games start on Day 2. Aren't those two statements directly contradictory? I do admit there's a chance that I'm mis-remembering who says that but...

I definitely didn't say that. I actually like Night Zeros, perhaps uniquely here. I even used one, man that was a long time ago. I admit it didn't work too well the time Fallacy tried it recently (I forget which, sorry) (Oh, right, here, you were in it too.), but I still like the concept. I like starting with more information.

Jim and Max pushed a case against FoU involving problems with his case against Tric. You should ask for them to give you their own summaries of their cases, especially Jim, because I don't think they'd agree that my summary of their cases would be fair.

Alrighty sure
@Jim
@Max
@FoU
@Tric
What's your summary of the argument so far? Would you say Lenglons is close to being right?

Uh, sure, I guess. For me I think it was more like "I walked into this weird thing with previously-voted scumread Fallacy accusing Tric and Jim, two of my strongest townreads, so I intervened". Like I suggested last post, I don't even want to think about that ever again, though. This day one has lasted too long and I don't even remember how it started anymore.

[Lenglon]

Max: do you mind explaining what the important difference between a game with a Night 0 and a game with a nolynch D1 is?
(I actually agree that we generally should lynch every day including D1, but I find your reasoning here odd.)

[juicebox]

After reading back, I don't think FoU's case on Tric is really genuine.

His suspicion of Tric starts here, he mentions that Tric is playing like he knows what he's doing and that's not like him. However at this point, most of Tric's posts have been RVS/hat related, I don't see how that is Tric playing like he knows what he's doing/outside of his meta.

He then follows it up here, saying that Tric is being aggressive.

He then says here that he'd be willing to vote for Tric, but not if he's a third party, because he'd rather find scum

He starts to focus more on Tric after Jim votes him for his read on Tric

But what's interesting is that here Fallacy says that he thinks Tric is TP, either an Outsider or SK.

and in his next series of posts, he builds up to what is essentially an information lynch on Tric here.

He almost immediately goes back on his theory that Tric is TP, and flips to saying that he's outright just scum. The only basis he provides is that Jim/Hector/NQT are potentially in a team with Tric. He doesn't even give any consideration that Tric might be TP until Lenglon brings it up to him a few posts later

and here he goes back on what he said earlier on wanting to lynch scum over TP, saying that even if Tric is TP there's a lot of information to be gained, but I don't see very much information to be gained from him flippng TP, in fact if Tric does flip TP

[juicebox]

Thank you Mamobo.

Toony, still hold reason to vote Toaster?

No, I'm going to Unvote.

Can mafia-allies be in this game? *checks* Looks like they can, okay.

FoU is a mafia-ally. They're behaving like Webadict in FBYOR5. I'm done trying to reason with them at this point and it's a waste of time. They're wasting everyone's time and making everyone upset to cause trouble and help mafia. Maybe they are just mafia, but I think drawing this much attention to themselves is suicide and I don't really want to think about it anymore today. They probably realize Tric is very likely not to be mafia and that's why they specifically want to vote Tric out, because it's a merit to his team. I think this explains their shift in focus over the course of Day 1.

This also makes me feel better about Jim.

I can honestly see this

[Toaster]

FallacyofUrist.

I smell panic, and not the good kind of panic, where he's trying to stop the town from making a mistake.  This is the bad kind, where he's trying to save his own ass. 


Juicebox:  Sure enough to vote for Fallacy?



Again, first quick post to fire off what's important, and now some more reads.  It's close enough to day end for a reads list.

Spoiler: Mostly OOC (click to show/hide)

If I mess up any pronouns let me know.  I'm bad at the neutral they.

[Maximum Spin]

Max: do you mind explaining what the important difference between a game with a Night 0 and a game with a nolynch D1 is?
(I actually agree that we generally should lynch every day including D1, but I find your reasoning here odd.)

There may not actually be any reasoning behind it. In fact, the game I was referencing where we "learned" what I said also had a no-kill and it was my own fucking fault, too, I brought it on myself, on purpose. Don't worry, I get what I deserved in that game.
The difference between a game with a night 0 and a game with a nolynch day 1 is that I don't have to play through an interminable d1 for no reason in the first one.
I'm actually secretly going increasingly insane over this forum having progressively longer days 1 lately. I'm not even coherent right now. I don't even remember who's playing.
Okay, after running through all the players in my head I was able to remember everyone eventually, but it took me the longest to remember notquitethere, so let's vote him out to make it easier on me.

After reading back, I don't think FoU's case on Tric is really genuine.

I take back what I said about suspecting you, you're my favorite townie now