Depends on strategic considerations. If your objective is to take and hold ground, then retreating is defeat. But if the goal is simply to inflict pain on the enemy, then performing a successful raid and then scattering before you're overwhelmed counts as a victory.
An argument has its own strategic dimension. If your goal is simply to dominate the opponent and get the last word for your own satisfaction, then persistence will reward you. But if you want to accomplish anything deeper than that you'll have to think differently. If someone's shown themselves to be saying nonsense, it doesn't really matter how much nonsense they say because the audience will soon stop listening to them. In that way, a few words can defeat many.
The goal here is just to inform the Ukrainiaks regarding the ignorance of the situation in Ukraine there position is based in. 99% of the time a Ukrainian supporters position is usually based some combination of a conspiracy theory (conspiracy theories involving Russia are totally fine in Western Media) involving Russian agents/secret armies and Hollywood style dualistic narratives involving a valiant, heroic Ukraine and a wicked, evil Russia.
Your aim as a Pro-Russian is simply to point out the actual historical facts of the situation and once you have done this, your Ukrainiak will gradually deflate a bit like how a balloon pops when you prick it with a pin. Ukraine's false halo depends upon ignorance in order to exist and for this reason most Ukrainiaks are enthusiastic bullies and censors. An advantage of the deflation process is they become less censorious the less fanatical they are owing to knowing facts which contradict the core fantasy.
Just because you continue posting asinine BS doesn’t mean you’re winning.
*reads more*
A-a-are you the Chosen One? The idiot troll who brings us conspiracies so ridiculous they entertain rather than frustrate?
Tell me more if the Western Satanists. Are they paedophiles? Where does their Authority stem from if they hate it so? What of these Rebels they support? What if the Rebels rebel against their Authority (which of course doesn’t exist because authority is bad)?
That wasn't a serious point but a passing observation regarding belief structure Hector 13. There are no real devils involved in this, unless you want to believe that there are. In any case, in case you didn't already know, Satan is a symbol to Satanists, not something they literally believe in. A symbol of what however? Is it a symbol of rebellion against God? But they don't believe in no gods neither. What then is the Satan symbol they identify with a symbol of?
The symbol of Satan is an archetypal figure of the rebel against authority. Western culture is presently overrun with archetypal rebel figures and these figures are glorified, as are their rebellions, while the downsides of rebellion as were very much in evident in 2014 Ukraine are. So we can quite confidently say that modern Western culture is Western Satanic, totally overrun with biased cultural works that glorify rebellion and demonise authority; Star Wars can be seen as a work of Western Satanism (excepting the Prequels, which is why they are hated
).
The Western Satanism is a name given by myself (and Putin) to the cultural glorification of rebellion which leads to ridiculous statements like the one you were making, where you literally argued that the Ukrainian constitution allowed a rebellion to overthrow their elected president. Any normal person, not highly enamoured of Western Satanism will logically conclude that anyone who rebels against a democratically elected leader serving his elected term is not representing the People.
Not however the Western Satanist. The Western Satanism supports Democracy because it undermines the authority of rulers, not because he believes the people should rule directly or through their representatives. So when somebody rebels against democracy itself, the Western Satanist is always on board because the People to them is a symbol for Satan/Archetypal Rebel, which does not fit with the meek image of the voter filing papers in the ballot booth.
The end result is nonsense like when Hillary Clinton went on about how they needed to interve in Libya because Gaddhaffi was going to massacre his people in Benghazi (he was winning). Someone who isn't a Western Satanist pretending to be a Democrat would not identify rebels against a Libyan regime as the People of Libya and imagine a ruler crushing a rebellion as somehow the annihilation of the People itself.
Actually the whole thing reminds me of folks wearing Che Guevara/Anarchy symbols teashirts even though they ain't actually Communists/Anarchists.
Hey Red Diamond can I have some of what you're smoking because it sounds like some good shit.
Also the whole "Western Satanist" thing is interesting and he should tell us more about it.
It isn't really about Satan, unless Christianity is true in which case it very much is.
There is a game that depicts Western Satanism's strategic operation pretty much spot on and this game is actually Liberal Crime Squad, because there the LCV do not actually ever overthrow or get elected the US government however well they do. Western Satanism (ideally) does not have to rule and create a Western Satanist regime, but instead to preside over a state of fear and intimidation directed against a powerless authority. Said authority will both give the Western Satanists whatever they happen to want but also allow them to freely do whatever they wish to whomsoever they wish.
Euromaiden is like that. The reason to overthrow Yanukavich is not because they could not win the next election, indeed they even forced him to back down from his chosen course without removing him from office. The reason is solely because of fear that overthrowing a leader will create in subsequent leaders, even if said leaders actually supported the rebellion against the previous leaders. Thanks to overthrowing Yanukavich, all subsequent leaders of Ukraine fear to ever defy the Western Satanists ever again. Removing a leader peacefully and legally does not create any terror, so it is useless to them.
This explains the mystery of why, despite the obvious threat of utter ruin that a war with Russia represents, the Ukrainians made no concessions to Russia to avoid war. The leaders of Ukraine fear the Euromaiden/Western Satanist faction more than they fear the Russians. If said faction demands no concessions, then no concessions will be made because whoever makes them will be brutally removed from power.
To return to the
"Real Satan" aspect everyone is so interested in, the literal teachings of Christianity are that *all* rulers rule by divine sanction. This makes Christianity an inplacable foe of Western Satanism, since there is no room there for any kind of glorification of rebellion but rather it is clearly demonized. Destroying Christianity altogether or keeping their followers in the dark regarding the actual teachings of the religion against rebellion is fundermental to their strength. For obvious reasons a population propogandized by Star Wars style cultural narratives is far better for them than one propogandized by a religion authority cult, since the former is initially biased towards the rebellion while the latter is biased against the rebellion.
The easier it is to create a rebellion, the more frightened the rulers are and the more frightened they are, the more power the Western Satanists have.
At the rate Russian tanks get destroyed it seems like they'd be better off dropping them out of plane onto Ukraine.
Hey where's Red Diamond at I need more conspiracy goodness!
It is your position that spreads conspiracy theories about secret Russian invasions. No conspiracy theories over here at all, though maybe I should find some just to entertain as part of my new position as Court Jester.
The Church have been used for a long time. Early on --when Ukraine was still subordinate of Russian Orthodox Church-- it was used to promote the Russian narrative and the necessity of Ukraine's geopolitical alignment with Moscow.
More recently, it been used to provide a better unifying narrative to fight for than tzar Putin's imperialism, in similar fashion to the 'Russian mir' it frames it as war of values/cultures playing on the pervading attitudes regarding pluralism and the decline of conservative values. On several occasions Putin began his addresses to the nations with jibes about ~ westren rich gay people from villas telling them what todo. This framing as fight for conservatism (and coastal elites) is something that many in USA right took too, just as the framing as anti USA hegemony is something that many in China took to.
Meanwhile this is just the "good ol' " war. Whether you like or not, black and white narratives and dehumanization helps to break down moral inhibitions and morally disengage from the horrors of war, and Soldiers who have come under fire often find God.
I feel that is how the whole fantasy about secret Russian armies invading Ukraine back in 2014 came about. The Ukrainian government's commanders would tell their soldiers they were fighting secret Russians in order to hide from them the fact they were really fighting their own people.
In Crimea which the Russians *actually* annexed and *actually* deployed Russian troops with full colours, the Ukrainian forces backed down entirely. I feel any secret Russian troops must have made a mistake by removing their insignias.
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Topic: Emotional Responses to War in Ukraine - Personal Diary & Mutual Support (Read 135910 times)