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[fitmoos]

First at all, Thanks Adams Brothers for the all, is not only a wonderful game, is a software simulation marvel.

DF is full of bugs and errors, and the game is in alfa stage.
The problems with the game are common, like crash and others.
A better GUI mask , like developed by Kitfox, do not solve this problem.

For a experimental free gaming environment, this is not a problem. But, if the game is realized, this could be a big problem and headache. A advertisement for a capitalist consumer like "this game is in alfa stage", or the legendary reputation of the game/software will not save for a bad calcification or cash returns of the median steam consumer.

To avoid some of this, i propose to use by default some mod like "Moddest mod"[1], the mod itself ,or some modules of the mod. Maybe this solution is note entire enough for reach a Lean Six Sigma Standard [2] , but avoid a lot of bugs, fps dead, and improve the performance.

Please, for the pUrist of DF, this suggestion is a pragmatic one.

Thanks for all. Close the topic.

[1] http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=174231.0
[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lean_Six_Sigma

[Putnam]

Modest mod doesn't fix any crashes, nor do its modules. A lot of the crashes you see these days are caused by certain popular DFHack-based modifications that are, in fact, made obsolete by the better GUI and graphics.

The GUI seems to be developed by Toady nigh-exclusively, too, not by Kitfox, who are doing... I mean, a lot, but the programming's all in the same hands as usual.

And, like, managerial fads aren't exactly the be-all-end-all of design, not even if they're a neat little combination of two of them.

[Salmeuk]

I must agree with Putnam. IMO the vanilla game feels basic compared to many other modern titles, even. So, to include default modification further distilling that simplicity, that might take it too far.

I would also suggest that, with the new GUI, many of the confusions of old will become irrelevant. Perhaps even mythologized. . .

[fitmoos]

Modest mod doesn't fix any crashes, nor do its modules. A lot of the crashes you see these days are caused by certain popular DFHack-based modifications that are, in fact, made obsolete by the better GUI and graphics.

The GUI seems to be developed by Toady nigh-exclusively, too, not by Kitfox, who are doing... I mean, a lot, but the programming's all in the same hands as usual.

And, like, managerial fads aren't exactly the be-all-end-all of design, not even if they're a neat little combination of two of them.

Its true that Moddest Mod do not avoid all crashes and bugs, and still the crashes exists. But , the better performance of the Modest Mod avoid crashed, and the game has a better performance. For example, with Modest mod, in adventure mode, has less probability to enter in a heavy populated site (like dark fortress) and avoid a crash. And the game, it self in both modes, have considerable better performance, even possibility biggest fortress and FPS dead.

But, the solution of use MM itself it not de proposal. The suggestions is clean all "lean" or "noise" to avoid by default the 99,9% of crashes.

I don't believe the majority of crashed has to be the in the GUI (that will be excellent news)... so many are problems in the calls to engine.

[Putnam]

The problem here is that none of the crashes are the cause of bad performance. In fact, bad performance, in general, cannot cause a crash. The main crashes I've identified are stuff like trying to call the virtual method that gets a type for an item on a null pointer or what-have-you, things that are totally unrelated to performance.

[fitmoos]

Yes, i agree. Maybe Moddest mod it not the final solution.
Also, i believe this would be optional "mode" easy to change, like a "easy mode".


 The important point is to avoid crashes, to avoid bad launch of the game. It will be terrible if the commercial release is a failure, and i my experience, of example, Moddest Mod give better impression to the game to new players.  The game it self feels so better.
Obliviously with a high cost of diversity of the world, but in the first experiences the commercial beginner user will not realize of this details, avoiding frustration and bad ratings .   

The first fortress are very FUN in DF, but crashes are not FUN.

[gchristopher]

This suggestion is a little confusing, because the core Modest Mod (without the modules) should be raw fixes that almost nobody would argue about, and by definition, those are great to add to base game. Stuff like fixing plant processing, seeds, and cultivation for lots of above-ground plants, horns and hooves healing, size-proportional skin/leather, more sources of "shell" for strange moods, lots of animal detail fixes, etc, are pure quality of life improvements.

It makes sense to add those to the base game, they really shouldn't be controversial and are mostly fixing papercuts where the raws aren't as good as they could be.

The Modules, especially Accelerated, have some downsides or debatable benefits. Part of what makes DF distinct is the sense of scope and depth. Part of that is having 200 types of stone lying around, and yes, in some circumstances, the weights and melting points of all those stones can matter. Part of the wisdom of Modest Modules is realizing they don't always make sense for the base game are should be left as optional mods.

But for the base Modest Mod, with all the wonderful little fixes for what feels just like oversights in the base game Raws, yes, the base game would definitely benefit from it.