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Author Topic: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)  (Read 26767 times)

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #405 on: February 10, 2022, 04:26:35 am »

PTW.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #406 on: February 10, 2022, 04:45:39 am »

Oh, if you want to PTW, you should quote this message:
I hereby grant Company Chaplain EuchreJack my proxy vote in all matters pertaining to this thread.
Oh, and you can optionally sign it too. But it's still valid if you choose not to do so.
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UristMcRiley

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #407 on: February 10, 2022, 05:40:32 am »

I don’t mean to be the bearer of bad news here but even if we got a ship yard up and running and intended to produce patrol vessels as a means of defense and observation of our territory, we would run into the same problem we’re having with the sentinel station except doubly so. Not only would we need to source astropaths for communication but also navigators to allow them to travel the warp. Mind you we might have a few spare navigators around but not a substantial amount of my memory serves me most ships have two in case something happens to the first but that’s no great reserve of highly specialized personnel.

In the short term the only real means I see of dealing with the psyker shortage is raiding imperial shipping lanes, any warp vessel will have a navigator at least and larger merchants will likely carry astropaths. I know it’s poking the hornets nest but I don’t see any real solution. This will also likely help us alleviate our resource shortages at least in the short term.

On another note we really ought to station garrisons of battle brothers and auxiliary forces on all are inhabited worlds. A squad of battle brothers could potentially see off any light pirate raids and it will also help our image with the locals to be seen actually protecting them. We can begin to start winning there loyalty instead of just haunting there nightmares.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #408 on: February 10, 2022, 06:20:37 am »

I don’t mean to be the bearer of bad news here but even if we got a ship yard up and running and intended to produce patrol vessels as a means of defense and observation of our territory, we would run into the same problem we’re having with the sentinel station except doubly so. Not only would we need to source astropaths for communication but also navigators to allow them to travel the warp. Mind you we might have a few spare navigators around but not a substantial amount of my memory serves me most ships have two in case something happens to the first but that’s no great reserve of highly specialized personnel.

In the short term the only real means I see of dealing with the psyker shortage is raiding imperial shipping lanes, any warp vessel will have a navigator at least and larger merchants will likely carry astropaths. I know it’s poking the hornets nest but I don’t see any real solution. This will also likely help us alleviate our resource shortages at least in the short term.

On another note we really ought to station garrisons of battle brothers and auxiliary forces on all are inhabited worlds. A squad of battle brothers could potentially see off any light pirate raids and it will also help our image with the locals to be seen actually protecting them. We can begin to start winning there loyalty instead of just haunting there nightmares.
+1

Note that we don't need navigators for ships that won't be leaving a solar system.  Same with astropaths.
I would advise shunting our raiders through a neutral system, and ensuring the raiders aren't being followed before they return to us.  Although Space Marines probably would already know that, so you can count this as a Reminder from Your Friendly Third Company Chaplain.

Madman198237

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #409 on: February 10, 2022, 11:50:21 am »

The shipyard is purely for economic benefits, principally through reducing maintenance costs on our warships. We could produce unarmed freighters (AKA not warships) to bolster trade between our different planets, possibly. But, again, most importantly it will reduce costs.

We also need to start some programs for finding more Astropath candidates and bringing psykers out of the shadows and into regulated environments (on a Feral World somewhere) where they can be trained to, if they're not strong enough to do anything else, prevent their powers from causing problems.

I suspect we also need to comprehensively throw out most of the Imperial's legal framework because it's nonsense. Luckily, the Emperor's original laws should be good enough and we ought to have a record of them somewhere, probably?


Anyway suffice it to say that next time we're at the Monastery we've got some things to start moving.
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Tube Wizard

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #410 on: February 10, 2022, 06:14:08 pm »

Attempt full integration. Everyone's alike enough that they should get along juuuust fine.
Launch an Inquiry, of course
Integration but only by having a human "upper class" of leaders and technical experts to manage the aspects of their society they struggle to, mitigating their disadvantages (no experienced souls, not very bright, being xenos) by providing them with human advantages (being smart, having lots of experience and potential for growth, being human).

This lightly modified integration should minimize the affront for everyone---the Cannon Fodder Zoguwn benefit from Human innovations and us helping them with advanced techs and get to reap benefits there, while Humans see that we are not treating them as equals, we've put Human overlords over them. And in the end we get a unified alien polity to tax and conscript.

With a few decades' (each decade is a generation or even TWO generations!) manipulation we could alter their society in any way we found necessary...
+1
In regards to our immediate decisions I say we ought to
Launch an inquiry
Involve Ourselves

With regards to the sentinel station I say we begin the construction of a armed variant above this world (Zog?) mainly due to the reasoning that the only reason these squids joined us is because we assured them we can protect them from greater threats in the galaxy so if our fleet wonders off and ork raiders pay this planet a visit with us not lifting a finger to defend them there goes the whole incentive for them subjugating themselves to us. We can utilize the ambassadorial psyker of ours as a astropath at the station it'll also allow him to continue his role as our primary ambassador to the Squids
 
I, of course, Accept my own suggestion.
As for the Station, I'd like to research the possibility of training our own Astropaths.  Ask if the station could run without them?
We should proceed with researching the unarmed design.

I agree with Attempt Full Integration, primarily to offload the responsibilities of governance to the superior humans. 
We expect a tithe of resources and auxiliaries. Their planet is of no further importance to us.
Their homemade rifles are sufficient enough as primary armament. 
Their Heavy Equipment shall be Missile Launchers, which they should be capable of manufacturing. See if they take to Krak missiles.  We can train the ones that actually serve us in Frag missile usage.

Launch an Inquiry. Unless of course my troubleshooter gets a mysterious gift, then I might change my mind.

Accept the proposal wholeheartedly!

You decide to Launch an Inquiry into the 3rd company chaplain's request. It is rather sudden and unusual, and as Renegades, you cannot afford risks the Imperium in its inefficiency can ignore. The situation is probably nothing, but there's no reason not to involve yourself. You exit your office and make a leisurely stroll through the bridge of the 1st Battle Barge. Soon you've left it entirely and the auxiliaries salute in respect as they step out of your way. You're intent on a very specific location and you step through the corridors with a quiet, determined purpose. Ten minutes later you've reached the 3rd company's chambers and with three, massive strides, step through the barracks to the door into Euchre's personal quarters. As a seasoned heretek, even if you weren't Chapter Master with universal clearance, it would be trivial to unlock. You don't bother to knock and step in.

His room is well-kept as one would expect, save for the cards scattered over a table of parchment. Anti-Imperial hymns to the Emperor, transcribed as is his duty. The sleeping rack he rests on is made, the dust meticulously swept. His power armour, resting in the corner, diligently oiled and consecrated. Your eyes sweep over it to see him now knelt at the customary, even obligatiry, shrine to the Eternal God-Emperor. The prayer beads are in his hands, he mutters the litanies, and doesn't interrupt his prayer for your arrival until it is done. As is to be expected. He gets to his feet and turns, looking at you with tired eyes and an easy smile. The chaplain's teeth are clean, polished regularly, and none of his grooming seems out of the ordinary. He asks what he can do for you and you say to do nothing. The chaplain moves not a muscle as you rifle (a very popular word in the Sentinels) through his desk, digging into the slightest corner and poring over the smallest notes. Even for potential code you scan through the syllables, parsing the narrowest possible metaphors, and find no firm evidence of treachery. You tip over his sleeping rack to see nothing, not even dust, and finally examine the shrine from top-to-bottom. All is in its proper place.

This isn't enough to satisfy you. A deep, two hour interrogation commences wherein your every word is sharper than a monofilament blade and each sentence bristling with hidden traps of loyalty and theology. The chaplain answers them all appropriately, missing none, and at no point asks what this inspection is for or what this investigation is over. Not once was his request of a transfer of veterans mentioned. Finally, unable to find even inconclusive proof of wrongdoing, you sigh in relief and grip his neck with a servo-arm without warning. You raise the chaplain over the floor, limp, not daring to move a muscle, and speak, pistons hissing with iron will. "EUCHRE, HEAR ME NOW. WE ARE RENEGADES TO THE IMPERIUM BUT THE PROPER CHAPTER CHANNELS ARE NOT TO BE REJECTED. YOU ARE TO GIVE ME NO MORE REASON TO RETURN. AM I UNDERSTOOD?" He nods his head, gasping. "Y-Yes sir, Chapter Master Talnior, sir." You release him and he falls onto the floor. "I WILL DISCUSS YOUR PROPOSITION WITH THE THIRD AND SEVENTH COMPANY CAPTAINS. BOTH ARE TO BE FULLY AWARE OF YOUR INVOLVEMENT. I WILL HEAR NO MORE OF THIS FROM YOU. AM I UNDERSTOOD?" The Fallen Astartes nods, raggedly shaking his head up and down. "Yes sir, Chapter Master Talnior, sir." You look down and give a slight, curt nod. "THEN MY WORK HERE IS DONE. AT EASE. I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING YOU AT THE NEXT MEETING IN THE HULL."

At that, you turn to leave and exit. In the room you've left behind, unknown to you, the chaplain resumes his prayers and an hour into them, goes silent. Tears of gratitude flow down his face and in the deepest, darkest recesses of his tainted mind whispers the most fervent of prayers, but they are not toward He on His Throne on Terra, but to something far older, and as impure before Him as the east is far from the west.


Your investigation has you thinking there is little to blame the chaplain for but a lack of tact, but the fact that you felt motivated to launch an inquiry has left you wary, of what might linger in the Chapter that you don't yet know of, and of what might fester in the years to come. The chaplains are disciplined, firm in the faith, and unflinching in zeal. They can be trusted and yet, what of the rank-and-file? The battle brothers in their dozens, new and old alike, what if one of them should preach dissent with the best of intentions and cause a fracture in the Chapter? Or worse, a sundering, to leave The Watchtower scattered in a dozen petty bands? No, this can't be allowed. You need to reassure yourself, somehow. You'll speak to the High Master of Sanctity, perhaps, or gather the Astartes together to hold a meeting. Part of you considers the possibility of having the most trustworthy of the Prognosticators do a psychic deep dive of the Chapter to confirm, but down that road lies a dangerous path. If you can't trust your gene-brothers, can you even trust yourself?

You dwell on these thoughts as you return to your quarters and resume your work. Much of it is addressing the brilliance of Archaeus, tragically confined by a sore defecit of man and material. You inform him of as much and release a missive, with a tentative sketch of a shipyard's schematic. It's simple to the point of crudeness, barbaric even, but it should be functional enough to meet some of your needs. You don't desire to begin building voidships, not yet, but to dock those you have without need of mothballing them and delaying their reactions when they might be needed most? That is a desire you cannot afford to ignore and in a matter of hours, an auxiliary returns with a response. You haven't left your desk since, too feverishly counting bolts and outlining diagrams. The auxiliary hands you his, you dismiss him with thanks, and eagerly open it to find... in the time since sending you his letter and your 'discussion' with Euchre, he's drawn a similar schematic of his own. Archaeus... You do suppose great minds think alike. Over the next few Terran days you enter into a sprawling correspondence that involves the Master of the Forge, whose 'hide bound' tendencies led to a confession that he, himself, has been searching for appropriate STC fragments to accomplish the same. Between the two of you and the dwindling treasury, you soon sway him into accepting inspiration of the STCs and consecration in the name of the Omnissiah as sufficient. By the end of the week, the techmarines are in a giddy uproar the less-mechanically inclined members of the Chapter can't begin to comprehend. Not truly. It isn't long before you have a true schematic.

Small Crude Shipyard: A tiny and ramshackle stardock, if it can be called that, but one that can be made with minimal infrastructure and which represents a tremendous leap forward for the Chapter's naval ambitions. (This requires 100 Resources and 10 months to manufacture; doubling as a dock and forge for a single Escort-class vessel at a time, or two smaller. To manufacture additional docks, able to hold additional Escorts, will require 50 Resources and 5 months. To expand on its size to accomodate worthier vessels will need deeper research and a nearby industrial base. As is, this model is primitive enough it needs little to no external technological base to keep it orbital once established.)

It's a simple schematic, the work of a dozen hereteks and more conventional techmarines pitching in to make something new. Alone, it isn't capable of meeting your needs but... it is a start. More than that, it's a sad remainder of how deeply humanity's knowledge has decayed under the dictates of Mars. This shipyard... it and others will be a start. To that end, it's essential that you find a higher yield of resources as soon as possible, and to that end and seeing their potential, you decide to move ahead on to Attempt Full Integration between humanity and the zahgun. You find little need to use their wretched tongue for themselves but you can see much for their work. Their technology may be of the Xenos and primitive to a degree that frustrates your analytical mind, but unlike the Imperium, they are not set in their ways and may yet change.

The, ah... Adeptus Econometrica will doubtless be escatic to ply their theories on the pliable minds of a species that endures a half-dozen lifetimes for each baseline human's cradle-to-grave. In particular, that design out of Audenach. You have little doubt the Xenos have some variation of assembly-line themselves, their circumstances leave it too necessary to forgo, but their inferior minds have likely seen a sore lack of efficiency. No matter, you won't begrudge them that their spark cannot match humanity's flame, but you'll allow their heat to fuel your industry all the same. Later, during your daily multi-target strafing practice, you dwell on the importance of this system relative to the empire and deduce that you'll leave a vessel, or a few, to oversee their advancement under your chosen emissaries while the rest of your fleet returns to Death World #14/2- Antwir, and regroups while you determine what the Chapter should do next.

Which ships and forces, Astartes and auxiliary, do you want to take and which do you want to leave behind? At bare minimum, a handful of techmarines and the Prognosticator will be amongst the Xenos for the next few months. You can also take your entire fleet but in the (unlikely, but never impossible) event of an external raid or invasion, the absence of any defense could leave the Zoguwn doubting your intentions. (Note, it's more likely than not that a few months will pass during the fleet's transit back to the Fortress-Monastery, effectively taking several "turns" at once for the Chapter. Time-skips like these aren't going to be uncommon, a month is only the smallest unit of time measured on a strategic, Chapter-wide scale. They'll be much moreso once you've found a means of settling your Resource defecit. In the absence of orders to do otherwise, fleets that have been sent out will attempt to return to the Fortress-Monastery at Death World #14/2)
« Last Edit: February 10, 2022, 07:34:36 pm by Tube Wizard »
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EuchreJack

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #411 on: February 10, 2022, 06:37:56 pm »

*Frantically search for the Captain of the 3rd Company*
(AKA would anyone like to be the Captain of the 3rd Company so I have someone to interact with in the chain of command?)

Psst, want to join the conspiracy?

Egan_BW

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #412 on: February 10, 2022, 06:46:54 pm »

Requesting fleet data update.

Likely will leave behind a few ships and a company to oversee the integration.
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Madman198237

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #413 on: February 11, 2022, 01:15:08 am »

For the love of goodness stop with the Chaos nonsense, you're just going to cost us time, resources, and the dwindling shreds of my patience.

I'm thinking two or three of our frigates left behind to keep watch and serve as support for the Marines on the ground. Much as I'd hate to leave two Prognosticators that is a possibility as well, if for no other reason than it allows them to take dealing with the Xenos in shifts.

We need to get some new psykers so that someone OTHER than incredibly valuable Marines can tackle these mundane duties. That or just learn their language, I guess. Actually, let's make sure that we have some of the officers aboard the frigates we leave learn said language, or maybe we've got somebody else somewhere who'd be more suited and, again, isn't an incredibly valuable Marine?
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Tube Wizard

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #414 on: February 11, 2022, 01:23:39 am »

Requesting fleet data update.

Likely will leave behind a few ships and a company to oversee the integration.

(You are currently in control of 1st Fleet, consisting of the 1st Unnamed Battle Barge, 1st and 2nd Unnamed Strike Cruisers, Warmonger, the 2nd Unnamed Gladius Frigate, and the 1st Unnamed Nova Frigate, altogether consisting of 1 Battle Barge, 2 Strike Cruisers, 2 Gladius Frigates, and 1 Nova Frigate. Between them are Companies 1-3 and 9, as well as 10 units of Antwir Auxiliaries, each consisting of 25,000 Death Worlders equipped with Crude Autoguns and Fatigues, and a noncombatant crew complement of roughly 410,100 souls. Any of which can be left on the planet to garrison or settle. A ship can function at 75% of its crew capacity without issues, 50% with some noticeable problems, and 25% with a severe loss of combat and void readiness. Among them, there are doubtless at least a handful of men and women willing to volunteer themselves to colonize the salty marshes of the Zoguwn and lead them into the empire.)


(Concerning the Small Crude Shipyard's upfront cost and limitations, if you were to spend 100 Resources to construct it, then take a Gladius Cruiser costing 4,000 Resources (not counting the 2,000 Terran months or 166 Terran years of assembly at the lowest level of industrial refinement possible, assuming no further Resource investment on top of that) to manufacture, and set it on the Shipyard, its maintenance costs of -40 Resources per month would be reduced to only -4 Resources per month. In terms of Resources saved, assuming that the Gladius Cruiser were the only vessel docked there, the maintenance costs saved will have more than paid for the station's manufacture within 3 Terran months. Everything after that is pure profit. In the same vein, nothing prevents you from constructing more than one shipyard capable of churning out Freighters/Escorts at the same time, although adding docks may be more cost-effective if you don't intend to grow your fleet for the time being or have other plans to do so.

These shipbuilding costs, in Resources and in time, may seem excessive but one of the biggest parts of the setting is that shipbuilding is extremely difficult to do. If you have your techmarines and mortal followers, this can be outsourced, researching blasphemy to the omnissiah more efficient means of manufacture than doing almost everything by hand, this can be reduced significantly. Coming to understand the mechanisms and manufacture of almost any form of old technology, or even new technology, is possible, as long as you're able to invest the time and effort into (re)discovering them.

In regards to Navigators, your Armada currently has (at a guaranteed 1 per Battle Barge and subsequent 2d6+4) 13 Navigators scattered through the fleet. That's 1 Navigator per Battle Barge and enough leftover to give every ship currently in the Warp an active Navigator. You're much more fortunate than most Renegades. These have been forced into towing the line at various points and may, given sufficient time, reproduce and train a new generation of Navigators but in the extremely long-term, this closed gene-pool could lead to their descendants degrading and becoming non-functional. You can always attempt to acquire more Navigators and potentially gather enough to form your own Renegade Navigator House, but Navigators are extremely high-priority individuals for the Imperium and such an ambition becoming known could lead to problems. Navigators are not 100% essential to traveling through the Warp, they're only essential for doing it safely between distant systems. With a Navigator at the helm, the individual likelihood of a ship suffering the Perils of the Warp are 1-in-1,000, without a Navigator, they are lowered to 1-in-100. These may seem like insignificant odds, but they worsen when the Warp is unstable and over the course of enough traveling, a ship without a Navigator is far likelier to suffer serious consequences at one point or another. None of the Freighters of the Chapter's small tithe-fleet have Navigators at the helm, they're only following pre-charted Warp routes to minimize the risks and hoping for the best. So far, it's worked for them and their patrons in The Watchtower, for the most part. These could be mustered into combat as a handful of fragile, weak vessels that could possibly turn the tide of a pitched conflict, but doing so would also interrupt your tithe collection and consequential Resource gain.)

For the love of goodness stop with the Chaos nonsense, you're just going to cost us time, resources, and the dwindling shreds of my patience.

I'm thinking two or three of our frigates left behind to keep watch and serve as support for the Marines on the ground. Much as I'd hate to leave two Prognosticators that is a possibility as well, if for no other reason than it allows them to take dealing with the Xenos in shifts.

We need to get some new psykers so that someone OTHER than incredibly valuable Marines can tackle these mundane duties. That or just learn their language, I guess. Actually, let's make sure that we have some of the officers aboard the frigates we leave learn said language, or maybe we've got somebody else somewhere who'd be more suited and, again, isn't an incredibly valuable Marine?

(There are plenty of noncombatant crew, some of whom are quite intelligent and/or lack the Astartes' reflexive hate for the Xenos. The Adeptus Econometrica informs you that a few thousands or tens of thousands could in theory immediately jumpstart the Full Integration process and be replaced from either Civilized World #5/5's or Death World #14/2- Antwir's population bases without much hassle.)
« Last Edit: February 11, 2022, 01:43:25 am by Tube Wizard »
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Egan_BW

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #415 on: February 11, 2022, 12:54:22 pm »

Leave in orbit [strike cruiser 1] Emperor's Spleen and Warmonger, carrying 9th company, 2 units of auxiliaries, the prognosticator, and a techmarine or two.

Leave on the surface whoever among the crew and auxiliaries will volunteer to live among and rule the Zahgun.

Instruct the prognosticator and 9th company captain to help our mortal volunteers with learning the language and whatever else they need help with.
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Madman198237

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #416 on: February 11, 2022, 01:31:04 pm »

Spoiler: Lengthy Plan, Sorry (click to show/hide)

OK that got ridiculously long, but I want this thing to run on autopilot for awhile so that we don't need to be constantly revisiting them. The tithes they'll send will be, if I understand correctly, initially very small, but any bit helps at the moment.
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EuchreJack

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #417 on: February 11, 2022, 03:22:45 pm »

Quote from: 3rd Company Chaplain inquiry to Master of Sanctity
Your Eminence, I inquire as to how you wish me to proceed with instruction of our Brothers in my Company.  This newness has inspired...questions.  I dare not give answers without first humbly seeking your guidance.
Which of these principles should or should not have sway in the coming years:
1) Ingenuity
2) Perfection
3) Valor
4) Resilience
How should our chapter view Psychers:
Scorned, Reviled, Tolerated, Accepted, Encouraged, or Revered? Or some other more appropriate word(s)?
I humbly leave it to you whether our Esteemed Chapter Master's valuable time would be worth consulting on these issues.  I also heard a rumor that our Chapter may be seeking to further instruction of gifted citizens on our worlds.  I am unsure of the accuracy of these rumors, hence I am bringing them to your attention.  I am unsure what role the Chapter's Chaplains may play in this task, if the Chapter seeks to pursue this path.  We do aid our Brothers in discipline and teaching.
Your Humble Servant,
EuchreJack

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #418 on: February 11, 2022, 04:21:11 pm »

The shell-things seem unconcerned about their dead and dying.  Perhaps we could use their unique brain material and rugged physiology as a replacement for human meat in servitors.

True cyborging should be left to humans of course.  I just mean the near robotic servants.

Mix xeno heresy and tech heresy.

Long term goal of course.

We have way more manufacturing than resource production.  Perhaps we should find some worlds to forcefully tithe.  Like some orc worlds that act like imperils we could land kill a bunch of orcs then take their stuff.

Madman198237

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Re: Renegade Space Marine Simulator (40k)
« Reply #419 on: February 11, 2022, 04:23:01 pm »

Ork stuff is not really technologically advanced, it is in fact not technology at all, just random bits of stuff held together with duct tape and literal belief. Stealing it would come with a risk of infecting our worlds with Ork spores, too.
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