Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Maximum Spin]

I don't think the crown ability is actually a crown item... if you look, items always have "You have ___ in your possession.", apparently consistently - both Tric's and mine do. I'm guessing all of yours also do.

After getting some sleep and some other stuff I feel a bit better about this now. In particular, I realized I fell for a little bit of a trick. TolyK said that only Superdorf and I had visited Jim, and that framing automatically put me in the wrong perspective... because of course TolyK must also have visited Jim last night, with an ability that apparently hurts people. It's easy enough to claim this was for protection, why should I believe this? TolyK has been playing it really close to the vest for the most part this whole time. I forgot he was even in the game for a while. I don't like any part of this.

Another thing I contemplated on was that there may not even be any town-aligned investigative roles. It's one thing to say that people might want to play it safe and not become a target by claiming, but in a setup like this I don't think you keep that shit to yourself. This makes abilities like mine, Jim's, and, I admit, Vectoaster's far more important. I don't think I can support a Vectoastoon-team lynch just yet, even though they rub me the wrong way. (I would absolutely be willing to out a scumteam under the guise of masonry if I thought it would work... like in a game with two scum parties, where it would tend to draw less attention... but this thought process is not productive at the moment I think)

The other thing I don't really buy is Fallacy as Anti-Anti-Webadict. Why? Flavour reasons. I know that's not something everyone likes to hear, but I don't think Aeos is in charge of the Anti-Anti-Webadicts, I think Selene is. I have two independent reasons to think this:
1) Roden claims to have been mistakenly given an Anti-Anti-Webadict wincon and also claimed Selene spoke in the message. This is at least plausible. If I accept that it's true, it's easier to believe that the entire "template" of the post was mistakenly used. (He seems to have still believed himself to be Anti-Webadict, but since that goes with the role name I could buy that it's something webadict would have added separately and could thus not be included in the mistake...)
And 2) last EOD, Helia said her domain is the day, and Selene's is the night. I think the Webadict acts during the day because bullets work during the day. If I accept that the Anti-Anti-Webadicts are a traditional mafia team, then they act at night. I grant you that there is no evidence that they ARE a traditional mafia team or even that there is a plural "they" to begin with and not just one possibly-Fallacy player, but I'm trying to go with Occam's Razor here and assume the setup has at least some of the things I would expect.
Now given that, I just don't see it as likely that a mafia member would fakeclaim Aeos and not, say, Erebos. Even if we assume Jim's Selene-gambit worked, that should trick them into claiming Selene truthfully, right? It's not impossible, but, coupled with Fallacy's behavior, I don't really see it.
Now, that opens the question of what Fallacy is. I don't know. Maybe a catgirl cultist. I wouldn't put it past him. But realistically, probably just something weird and dumb, like him. I don't know why that sentence just veered into a burn. Look, mostly, I just don't care about Fallacy right now, he gives me a headache. NYA. All the fucking NYA. No, I actually do have a headache right now, that's why I keep getting distracted. Let me pull myself together.

It's not impossible that Roden was actually mafia and tried to recover after over-admitting, but I don't really think that's what happened. Roden seemed genuinely confused before and genuinely townie now. It seems more likely to me that any/all Anti-Anti-Webadicts were suspicious of the question and lied, but Roden, apparently not being included in any scumchat (I would hope he would've said... I assume if he was he would just have quietly been recategorized to AAW instead of told he got the wrong team), told the truth not knowing what it meant.

Uh... I guess that's everything I have to say right now.

[TolyK]

FWIW, the action I did on Jim was a day action, not a night action. Last night I, in fact, actioned someone else...

[TolyK]

Also, unless I'm seriously misjudging the power of my role, it seems much less powerful than "use abilities from dead players" levels... Have the "missing" parts returned to people yet? I don't believe mine has...

[Maximum Spin]

FWIW, the action I did on Jim was a day action, not a night action. Last night I, in fact, actioned someone else...

Well... Fine.

I won't ask you to try to prove it, I don't know why I'm even bothering, it's not like either of us get a vote right now.

Also, unless I'm seriously misjudging the power of my role, it seems much less powerful than "use abilities from dead players" levels... Have the "missing" parts returned to people yet? I don't believe mine has...

Mine did, but it was just one totally crappy thing that I went ahead and got rid of.

Fallacy might just be balanced for being some kind of lone-wolf, if we accept that he and Egan are not directly teamed.

[Toaster]

Maximum Spin:

After getting some sleep and some other stuff I feel a bit better about this now. In particular, I realized I fell for a little bit of a trick. TolyK said that only Superdorf and I had visited Jim, and that framing automatically put me in the wrong perspective... because of course TolyK must also have visited Jim last night, with an ability that apparently hurts people. It's easy enough to claim this was for protection, why should I believe this? TolyK has been playing it really close to the vest for the most part this whole time. I forgot he was even in the game for a while. I don't like any part of this.

Here's my problem with this post; you aren't offering alternatives.  You offer no alternate proposal for why you took damage, you offer no alternate proposal as to who killed Jim, you offer no alternate proposal as to who is scum.  You list some people you think might not be it and throw a vague, loose suspicion at TolyK, but don't commit to anything.

So yeah, here.  Who do YOU think killed Jim?  Why didn't they take damage?  Who should Fallacy and EuchreJack vote?

[EuchreJack]

EuchreJack:

@Fallacy: Right, you're town.

Three things to point out:
1) Fallacy's recent play puts him right in the spotlight, where mafia doesn't want to be.  Fallacy's reveal that the Crown is one-turn only means that Fallacy has basically put all the attention onto him.  While if he thought he was definitely going to be voted today, he might figure it was worth it to eliminate one town player, it is far more likely that he is just a townie struggling to help before dying.
2) Fallacy's prior play also puts tons of suspicion on him by apparently answering honestly, however not completely.  That is more the play of town.  Mafia would have shut up.
3) Perhaps most importantly, I HAVE to assume Fallacy is town for this vote phase, or we can't vote anyone.  You all need to either assume Fallacy is town, or try to set Fallacy up to vote correctly, which you do by acting as if Fallacy is town.  Fallacy has the vote, you don't, so you gotta coddle/banboozle/schooze/trick Fallacy into doing the right thing.  Slinging mud on the guy doesn't help, unless you are sure Fallacy is scum that will abuse this power in such a way as to give town NO INFO, in which case you just advocate for me to vote Fallacy and skip voting this phase.

At this point, I'm considering voting between TolyK, Maximum Spin, and Roden. Objections?
Even though most of you can't vote, the opinions of the majority still matter, so I would ask everyone to vote in Purple as if you could vote.
Try to do so at least a couple hours before end of day, so Fallacy and I can make our decision taking into consideration everyone's opinion.
You could even put extra pressure on us by listing whom you DON'T want us to vote in Green. We'll assume you don't want yourself to be voted, so please chose someone else instead of yourself, if this is an option you would like to use.

[ToonyMan]

I have not stolen items from TricMagic, nya.

Okay.

Knightwing, want to confirm that statement?

At this point, I'm considering voting between TolyK, Maximum Spin, and Roden. Objections?
Even though most of you can't vote, the opinions of the majority still matter, so I would ask everyone to vote in Purple as if you could vote.
Try to do so at least a couple hours before end of day, so Fallacy and I can make our decision taking into consideration everyone's opinion.
You could even put extra pressure on us by listing whom you DON'T want us to vote in Green. We'll assume you don't want yourself to be voted, so please chose someone else instead of yourself, if this is an option you would like to use.

I'll forgo the colors here:

If I had a vote:
I would be voting FoU or Max right now. Egan or Roden is a distant tied third.
I would not vote Knightwing, Superdorf, Jack, Vector-Toaster, or the Figments today.

Between TolyK, Max, and Roden I would prefer Max the most and TolyK the least. I don't object to this.

I can see your argument for town!FoU, and it is possible. Their claim of "copying" people's actions during the day is also possible currently. This is foreign territory if you are correct, however I find it hard to believe with how badly FoU has pushed for my death this entire game. Unless they're being outwitted by mafia, which I have to see as a possibility. Although I feel a lot of it is their own fault...

[ToonyMan]

@FoU:
Who do you think stole Tric's Sprint Hat on D1? Your insight might be valuable here.

[EuchreJack]

I can see your argument for town!FoU, and it is possible. Their claim of "copying" people's actions during the day is also possible currently. This is foreign territory if you are correct, however I find it hard to believe with how badly FoU has pushed for my death this entire game. Unless they're being outwitted by mafia, which I have to see as a possibility. Although I feel a lot of it is their own fault...

Yeah, I gathered that, hence why I had to scream Sea Cucumber.  My current theory is you vs. FOU is most likely Town vs. Town.  It's easy to disregard that theory when there are at least three parties at play, but it makes the most sense currently.  But you're thinking clearer, so good job.

[EuchreJack]

@Fallacy: We're NOT voting Toonyman today, just to be 100% clear.  Focus elsewhere.

[Knightwing64]

I have not stolen items from TricMagic, nya.

Okay.

Knightwing, want to confirm that statement?

I would like to learn the games secrets.

[Knightwing64]

Ugh, quoting is hard.

[Toaster]

EuchreJack:

Three things to point out:
1) Fallacy's recent play puts him right in the spotlight, where mafia doesn't want to be.  Fallacy's reveal that the Crown is one-turn only means that Fallacy has basically put all the attention onto him.  While if he thought he was definitely going to be voted today, he might figure it was worth it to eliminate one town player, it is far more likely that he is just a townie struggling to help before dying.
2) Fallacy's prior play also puts tons of suspicion on him by apparently answering honestly, however not completely.  That is more the play of town.  Mafia would have shut up.
3) Perhaps most importantly, I HAVE to assume Fallacy is town for this vote phase, or we can't vote anyone.  You all need to either assume Fallacy is town, or try to set Fallacy up to vote correctly, which you do by acting as if Fallacy is town.  Fallacy has the vote, you don't, so you gotta coddle/banboozle/schooze/trick Fallacy into doing the right thing.  Slinging mud on the guy doesn't help, unless you are sure Fallacy is scum that will abuse this power in such a way as to give town NO INFO, in which case you just advocate for me to vote Fallacy and skip voting this phase.

Regarding the first two points, I'm going to take a meta read here and say Fallacy has zero problem being in the spotlight.  He's eagerly hopped in the center of attention in nearly every game I can think of playing with him.  This doesn't make him scum, of course, but it also nullifies your argument of him being town.

Citation from Magic Mafia MM:

FallacyofUrist.  What Jim said, pretty much.  He spend D1 BYOR15 threatening the town, and here he goes again.  He was scum there, he's probably scum here.

...and he was indeed scum there.

As for point 3... I mean I see where you're coming from but the best outcome of dealing with Scum!FoU for everyone else to want him to vote his scumbuddy.  Force his hand to either bus or force a tie.

At this point, I'm considering voting between TolyK, Maximum Spin, and Roden. Objections?

I strongly object to a TolyK vote.  He's reading town pretty hard to me.  I've explained why I think you should lynch Maximum Spin.  Roden... eh.  I don't have a strong read either way on Roden.




Actually, @WEBADICT, what happens in case of a tie with this two-person-vote deal?

[FallacyofUrist]

Still posting from phone.

@FoU:
Who do you think stole Tric's Sprint Hat on D1? Your insight might be valuable here.

Honestly? Egan or Roden. It’s an intuition based read but it’s a strong one.

EuchreJack:
Regarding the first two points, I'm going to take a meta read here and say Fallacy has zero problem being in the spotlight.  He's eagerly hopped in the center of attention in nearly every game I can think of playing with him.  This doesn't make him scum, of course, but it also nullifies your argument of him being town.

I have to be honest with you here. I have not played a single game as town or the town equivalent in the past few years. I have played as scum and third parties nigh exclusively during my play time as some sort of quirk of RNG. Maybe I’m forevermore doomed to be evil. The result of this, however, is that I have no idea how to play as town and nobody has any idea what a town version of me even looks like. Heck, I don’t even know what my town self looks like. I’m playing like a scum player trying their hardest to function as town because that’s all I have experience doing.

@Fallacy: We're NOT voting Toonyman today, just to be 100% clear.  Focus elsewhere.

Ugh, okay. We can revisit the issue later - that three-person cluster has not been anywhere near as open as I would like but at least Toony volunteered some information.

Wait, why the hell did Toony push to use the truth power to confirm that I haven’t stolen instead of just using it on my alignment?

Fuck, it’s already submitted now.

Nya.

@Jack and FoU:
You need to determine what to prioritize here. Is it Egan and their possible convert? Or is it Jim's killer? I think those are the top two priorities we are aware of. I'm open to either.

So Fallacy, which do you prefer as a priority? I'm also open to either.

Hmm.

Do we have to focus on only one? No, you’re right, narrowing focus is better when our time is this limited.

However we know someone killed Jim and we don’t know for sure that Egan successfully converted.

[EuchreJack]

@Jack and FoU:
You need to determine what to prioritize here. Is it Egan and their possible convert? Or is it Jim's killer? I think those are the top two priorities we are aware of. I'm open to either.

So Fallacy, which do you prefer as a priority? I'm also open to either.

Hmm.

Do we have to focus on only one? No, you’re right, narrowing focus is better when our time is this limited.

However we know someone killed Jim and we don’t know for sure that Egan successfully converted.

Good points, also we don't know if Egan's possible convert can convert but we can be reasonably sure Jim's killer can kill again.

It would help if you came up with your list of three suspects.  Unfortunately, I may be doing End-of-Day on my phone, and I have dinner plans EOD.
So I might just have to vote at some point.  I've given the three people I suspect.