Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[NJW2000]

NJW, who's scum in Tric and Prefuzek?

Need to see more posts out of both of them to have any clear. Going to reread the thread. Tric a bit more dubious looking right now due to that kill out of nowhere, but...

Everyone, who are you most feeling like shooting right now? For me it's Tric or NQT, probably Tric.

Realised I forgot to answer this, which was impolite of me. For the record, it was webadict.

How about you, now?

[prefuzek]

I'm recovering from a busy weekend; I'll try to post more frequently.

Please don't kill anyone for a bit. LYLO is hard and I would like to have more interactions from previous days to help out.  I'm happy to have robo-Toony and robot-Web out, but them dying with so few posts has denied us a lot of information. 55.3 hours, people.


NQT

Prefuzek, who's scum in Tric and NJW?

Probably Tric, possibly both. They both shot early, which I dislike, but NJW had very strong reasoning for their vote so I'm more okay with it (though I still wish webadict was around for longer). Tric's super lurky and might just be playing the info denial game.

Unless anyone else shoots first, I'm shooting Tric then Pref.

This is bad and very much unlike what I would expect from humaNQT. Why are you moving from your normal cautious style to chaining kills?

NJW

How about you, now?

Still Tric. Why did you shoot web so soon? Also, have you played mafia on this board before?

[TricMagic]

Hmph. Well, that post you made kinda decided it for me Pref. You're probably a robot. Also, a second shot occurring while I went to play video games. Yeah..

As I understand it, Robots don't want to shoot others, and instead build up enough of a case late game to get a human to shoot the other. Anything else, like shooting early, is not to their liking. Less info to use means they can't push humans into paranoia.


So those willing to take those shots are more likely human than not, yes? Or do you have a counterpoint to this. Either way, I'm pretty confident NJQ is the other human.

[TricMagic]

Hmph. Well, that post you made kinda decided it for me Pref. You're probably a robot. Also, a second shot occurring while I went to play video games. Yeah..

As I understand it, Robots don't want to shoot others, and instead build up enough of a case late game to get a human to shoot the other. Anything else, like shooting early, is not to their liking. Less info to use means they can't push humans into paranoia.


So those willing to take those shots are more likely human than not, yes? Or do you have a counterpoint to this. Either way, I'm pretty confident NJW is the other human.

NJW.. Your name confuses me given we have NQT.

[prefuzek]

I'm taking my reasoning from Roguelike 6, where at LYLO Toony was able to go back and read posts and figure out who was scum very definitively. We lose that chance with short days.

So those willing to take those shots are more likely human than not, yes? Or do you have a counterpoint to this.

Strongly disagree. Robots are the only ones who can shoot without the chance of losing the game. Shooting your robo-partner is relatively risk-free, especially if it makes you look more like a human (which by your logic it does).

Speaking of which, you still haven't explained why you shot Toony. This looks to me like one of those risk-free plays.

[prefuzek]

I'm taking my reasoning from Roguelike 6, where at LYLO Toony was able to go back and read posts and figure out who was scum very definitively. We lose that chance with short days.

Roguelike 7, rather. Also to expand on this a bit more, coordination between robots is huge in this setup and having to do LYLO with only a couple pages of game would be very tricky.

[NJW2000]

NJW

How about you, now?

Still Tric. Why did you shoot web so soon? Also, have you played mafia on this board before?

Several reasons, but mostly because I was pretty sure he was a robot. I'd been mostly resolved to shoot him for a while, almost as soon as I saw the "pick who I kill post". Later on, I knew I was going to at some point, so all he was going to do would be to rack up uninteresting interactions and influence the other human in potentially unhelpful ways. It's true that he might have given us information, but I judged he would be pretty capable of not revealing who his fellow robots are - webadict has something of a reputation. I would rather I shot him than a robot did, so I wanted to get in first. I'd also comitted to shooting him pretty hard, so I needed to do it at some point rather than make an endless song and dance about it. Finally, I didn't really feel like struggling to make sense of any more of his arguments - his posts used "which" in very confusing ways.

I don't think holding up the days to gather information is going to be as useful as it might be in mafia, given the robots have the ability to create an incredible amount of muddy water. There's no pressure voting, the only way to really threaten someone is by claiming that you're inclined to shoot them, and that's not something you can step down from without a cost, unlike in standard Mafia. So interrogation is a less powerful tool. If we do even amounts of scumhunting, 1/2 of the questions are asked by robots still. Essentially, actions are worth more and words less in this game. So I don't really see myself as shooting Webadict unusually soon. I'm perfectly willing to sit back and not shoot anyone for a bit though.

(I have played mafia here before. Badly.)



Some interesting philosophies of timing here. I'm somewhere between pref and tric. You need a certain tempo, I think, otherwise you give too much to the robots... too much time to overcome their aversion to shooting their partners, too many posts to dull your edge, too much of an excuse for last-minute kills, too much confidence in the face of a gun. It is however a matter of degree, and I too would like to see some explanation of Tric's reasoning.





Noted that Tric and NQT have basically committed to pulling a trigger at some point. Now that is interesting content.

[TricMagic]

My reasoning was pretty simple. NJW comes off as town to me, and this latest post adds to that. Toony on the other hand wanted to keep things going for a long time.

(Note my last post did give this reasoning, though you've expanded upon it. Which is good.)
Put simply, a human only has to find the other human to win. Robots need to trick a human into shooting the other. Shooting robots early on means not having enough time and posts to 'muddy the waters', as you put it. So on that point we're doing well.

[prefuzek]

OK so if you're confident in your read why haven't you killed NQT yet? Or me? The bit I'm interested in is why you chose to kill specifically Toony.

[TricMagic]

I killed Toony cause he was a robot. Of everyone, he was the one to suggest the method of waiting it out.

I'll be back in a bit to go over everyone.

[TricMagic]

Ugh. I've played a fair few games of this in person, and I'm pretty sceptical about Wuba's "Who do I shoot?" game. I'd also like to note, for the benefit of the one human out there, that this game always requires at least one human to make a game-deciding choice about who to shoot based on imperfect information. If you think you've found a way around that, you darn well haven't.

I don't understand the issue. If you're unwilling to choose someone as either human or robot, then you need to explain why.

I'd like everyone to pick a player for me to shoot. I want to see who you'll all pick, and then I'm going to pick someone to shoot from that.

Howsabout you shoot ME, Asshat?

Is this your plan for trying to gauge me as human, or do you actually want me to vote you? I suppose picking me is an option, but if you're human, I'd highly recommend picking anyone else, especially since calling anyone suspicious is inherently a suspicious act. I suppose you could be pushing me to see if I'm willing to do the same play, but it feels too much like how NQT's play looked, and not enough about why it was that way.

Hm, it's quite likely that if you're the other human, I'm exactly correct in how I'm going to have to play, which would be unfortunate for multiple reasons, and if you're a robot, you'll probably be voted early. It's quite possible I won't have to read you at all.

Right, out of everything, this post is probably a good thing. NJW does a lot right, in that robots can't shoot humans.

Please don't shoot me without warning.

You on the other hand, aren't willing to suit, don't want someone to shoot you without warning, and try to push things back onto me rather than give a reason not to shoot.

I think Web and NQT could possibly have the other human again. I weigh Web higher than NQT here.

Let's look at everyone's first posts.

NQT - You can tell from my post after, but I think this post has high scum equity for NQT. I'm pretty good at reading NQT and this post sounds phony to me. Particularly their question towards Webadict sounds like them trying to associate with Web, this could mean they're either both robots or that NQT is robot and Web is human.
Webadict - Shades me for not voting them. Says they'll try to think more clearly compared to last game. Relatively null but not my top pick for voting.
TricMagic - First a nothing post, then afterwards goads me into shooting NQT. This looks really bad. Makes NQT look possibly better.
NJW - Still unsure, if they're a robot then Web probably is too. Their game info and analysis is null of their actual alignment. Could be doing it on purpose.
Pref - This post is good. I think I have to top town read them again like in the last game even though they were a robot (hah). If they're a robot it's likely with Web or NJW.

Human
Prefuzek

Webadict
NJW2000

NQT

TricMagic
Robot

Associations Reads:

If NQT is a robot then Webadict might be the human.
If TricMagic is a robot then NQT might be the human?
If NJW is a robot then Webadict is probably a robot too.
If Pref is a robot then Web or NJW probably is a robot too while the other is the human.

@TricMagic:
I need more from you if you're human, please help me not vote you. Or give away your robot partners, that works too.

Of note, this is a good reason to shoot toony by itself. Knowing they are a robot, it can be used to determine humans and other robots.

NQT is OMGUS, also Notquitehere. Again. Association makes no allowance for Web being a robot, hence NQT being human. Instead it ties NQT as a human if I'm a robot, which makes no sense.

If Pref is robot, NJW or Web is human. If NQT is robot, Webadict might be human. It kinda reads like he's pushing a web human angle. But we all know who got shot next after toony.

Looking at the readlist, Pref is top, followed by Web and NJW. NQT is below that, with me as the obvious scum pick. The question becomes whetehr or not toony would stick two humans near the top. I get the feeling Toony didn't expect to get shot first, which makes sense given I don't often get a gun, so they don't see the fact I'd tend to use it early.

Now to the top, the posts and reads. My nothing post was in fact a question post. Not much of one, but brushing it off felt wrong, and his unwillingness to shoot so early continued till his posts finally convinced me he was going to wait until the last minute to shoot. And didn't actually have anything, they put me at the bottom because of a lack of posts, despite wanting to wait to gather more. If he was human, he could have shot me, but if he was human, he'd never structure the list like this and instead ask questions to be sure.

Of note, reading the post part, NJW and Web are both Null, while Pref is Good. (Hua... This doesn't make me want to shoot them myself, even if their posting is... I'd say unnerving, all I've got is instinct that Pref isn't on the up and up, while thinking NJW is the other human in our pair.)



And I've apparently got a surprise dental appointment after another person had to drop. I was going to go into NQT next, but seems I'll have to wait.

[prefuzek]

The question becomes whetehr or not toony would stick two humans near the top.

Bad slip? Two humans near the top referring to me and NJW I guess, which means that you're not a human.

Tric, I'm going to shoot you within the next 12 hours unless you shoot either NJW or NQT.

[prefuzek]

No posts? 5 hours left, Tric.

[prefuzek]

...

TricMagic

[ToonyMan]

MOD POST

TricMagic was killed! They were a robot.

Day 4 will end on June 26th at 1am EDT, 72 hours from this post.