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Author Topic: Africa thread  (Read 7156 times)

MaxTheFox

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #30 on: August 10, 2023, 08:39:12 pm »

I am NOT hyped for the jokes surrounding this if this becomes another huge war... :o
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2023, 09:37:52 am »

I mean Sudan is already entering its latest civil war, complete with Wagner mercenary deployment. So this won't even be the first African civil war of 2023 with Wagner involvement. Just imagine, the year is 2028 and North Sudan, West Sudan, Middle Sudan, East Sudan, North South Sudan and South South Sudan all apply for U.N. membership

MaxTheFox

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2023, 09:39:58 am »

I mean Sudan is already entering its latest civil war, complete with Wagner mercenary deployment. So this won't even be the first African civil war of 2023 with Wagner involvement. Just imagine, the year is 2028 and North Sudan, West Sudan, Middle Sudan, East Sudan, North South Sudan and South South Sudan all apply for U.N. membership
No, I meant considering Niger's name, if this hits news in a major way the memes about it won't be pretty.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2023, 09:43:29 am »

No, I meant considering Niger's name, if this hits news in a major way the memes about it won't be pretty.
Not any different from Montenegro competing in Eurovision or Niger competing in the Olympics. Some people are just mad shite at geography. Now if this was happening in Chad then you'd be seeing some serious memes. Couldn't escape the "Chad suicide bomber" memes last time there was one and the news worded it without understanding the meme association, so they were titling their articles things like "Chad suicide bomber kills 87"

EuchreJack

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #34 on: August 15, 2023, 10:20:37 pm »

No, I meant considering Niger's name, if this hits news in a major way the memes about it won't be pretty.
Not any different from Montenegro competing in Eurovision or Niger competing in the Olympics. Some people are just mad shite at geography. Now if this was happening in Chad then you'd be seeing some serious memes. Couldn't escape the "Chad suicide bomber" memes last time there was one and the news worded it without understanding the meme association, so they were titling their articles things like "Chad suicide bomber kills 87"
Uh, pretty sure they get MORE clicks by tilting it to grab the memes, so don't go giving The Media any slack.

Loud Whispers

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2023, 08:39:46 am »

Uh, pretty sure they get MORE clicks by tilting it to grab the memes, so don't go giving The Media any slack.
You're giving BBC analysts way more credit than they deserve for how in tune they are with memes

Starver

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #36 on: August 30, 2023, 03:15:25 am »

...sounds like Gabon is also trying the military-overthrow thing. (But also sounds like it's more 'justified', considering the overthrown leader's particular (alleged) electoral shenanigans. And this is not for the first time.)

But it's a developing situation, and I'm not at all an expert in the region - just picking up on various reported details.
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Loud Whispers

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #37 on: August 30, 2023, 03:47:47 am »

...sounds like Gabon is also trying the military-overthrow thing. (But also sounds like it's more 'justified', considering the overthrown leader's particular (alleged) electoral shenanigans. And this is not for the first time.)

But it's a developing situation, and I'm not at all an expert in the region - just picking up on various reported details.
People on the streets of Gabon seem really happy. China is worried about the safety of President Bongo Ondimba. Bongo visited Xi in april so maybe they are friends :3.

StrawBarrel

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #38 on: March 07, 2024, 01:40:43 am »

US tech giants absolved in cobalt child labour case
https://www.africanews.com/2024/03/06/us-tech-giants-absolved-in-cobalt-child-labour-case/
youtube mirror
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Td9dGEWMdM

I find it unfortunate that "the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia sided with the tech giants". I think we ought to combat the practice of child labor.
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Duuvian

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #39 on: March 07, 2024, 07:30:02 am »

The Court of Appeals didn't side with the tech giants. They sided with the law as it functions, because there was a flaw in the lawsuit and it could not proceed. The judge even found the plaintiffs had standing to seek damages, which means it wouldn't have been thrown out for that reason. The issue was that the target of the lawsuit was not in a culpable business relationship under the law of the jurisdiction of the court (perhaps I did not phrase that or other things perfectly but I am not a lawyer and the meaning seems clear enough).

https://www.reuters.com/legal/us-appeals-court-dismisses-child-labor-case-against-tech-companies-2024-03-05/

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Since we are talking about US laws due to a US court decision I'd assume that would be what the point of desired change would be: if you want change there, you can surely try just the same methods as anyone else: electoral, popular pressure, or judicial. By that I mean you could fund a candidate who agrees with you into office and ask them to sponsor a bill, or you could own a major cable news company, or you could invite a supreme court justice onto your yacht which presumably is where the plaintiffs have gone wrong so far, though it would be untimely prior to requesting certiorari (a word not spelled how it sounds, as I have discovered just in time to edit the post) Lacking these crutches otherwise, it would require a simply exhausting amount of hard, uncompensated work. Of course, it would have to actually be a change in the law that could stand up with the rest, or else it's just wasting everyone's time building face to a public sadly unlikely to hold accountable a politician who sponsors a bad bill because clearly it is the naughty judge's fault it was unconstitutional just as in this instance it has been suggested it was the court's fault for dismissing an unlawful claim. If only instead of saying fruitless things that serve no purpose a person could advocate for a more desirable system of regulation of US campaign finance, which in addition to surely being better assumptive of the average person's capabilities would actually be more effective to accomplish something fruitful on this issue of concern that, forgive me for being skeptical, seems more likely to be an artfully chosen route to cast doubt on green energy supply chains in specific rather than the much broader issue of this being far from limited to the green energy supply chain.

Now, let's say that all works and it successfully does all this great stuff and it manages to convince or failing that strongarms big tech who then, against the interest reputed to them, manage to change regulation in the countries in question. When we consider strengths and weaknesses, this presumably would be through the scientific equation of  (x+money) where x stands for people willing to take money. This of course has never resulted in unwanted outcomes in leadership ever in human history, but I digress. Now, after all that, how do you convince wealthy countries to pay/loan for the mechanization required to make less workers more efficient so as to not significantly weaken the agricultural and mining sectors in what I can probably assume are export markets heavily dependent upon resource extraction and not accidently make things worse once we succeed in our gambit to strongarm big tech into arranging banana republics for worker's rights? After all, the goal was to help these young people, not make them angry due to economic reasons driving instability and making them vulnerable to destabilizing forces. Thus one of the attempts being made in a few places is stronger regulation that increases compensation for the worker and heightened safety standards. A crazy idea, that!

Here's a fun tidbit

https://www.ilo.org/wcmsp5/groups/public/---ed_norm/---declaration/documents/publication/wcms_decl_fs_37_en.pdf

That's from 2002 if I read it correctly. Now that was in the early  Bush years. Don't let me fool you into thinking there probably hasn't been some progress made IN GENERAL as that was (until recently?) a fair assumption to make on issues related to extreme poverty worldwide outside of extreme crisis areas so to speak afaik, but that link should illustrate that this is something that long predates green energy plans, lithium batteries, and fossil fuel industry pushed information operations. Other than what I've detailed or forgotten to do so, however, I in general agree with your sentiments.
« Last Edit: March 07, 2024, 08:08:10 am by Duuvian »
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EuchreJack

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #40 on: March 09, 2024, 03:47:12 am »

Actually, when you consider that Harvard or Yale is mandatory for certain levels of the Judiciary, you should expect some Big Business sympathy.

Terry Collingsworth, a lawyer for the plaintiffs, in an email said his clients may appeal further...yes, because the US Supreme Court is really going to help them, LOL.

Certiorari denied!
There, I just saved his clients $10,000

Uh, could we now discuss actual news in actual Africa? They have several conflicts going on.

The War in Sudan is one example

StrawBarrel

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #41 on: March 29, 2024, 01:37:18 am »

Uh, could we now discuss actual news in actual Africa? They have several conflicts going on.
I disagree. Legal matters are is fact newsworthy. It would be foolish to narrow one's digestion of news to purely war. Journalism is a field of work that covers an assortment of current events from business to fashion to sports to health science and so on.

Edit march 29, 2024:
Quote from: Jonathan Stempel
The 16 plaintiffs included representatives of five children who were killed in cobalt mining operations.
Thank you for posting that Reuters article. I had no idea that five deceased people where being represented as well. This further cements the importance of why we must fight against child labor.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2024, 01:44:10 am by StrawBarrel »
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EuchreJack

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #42 on: March 29, 2024, 01:43:33 am »

Point taken

StrawBarrel

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #43 on: March 29, 2024, 11:36:28 pm »

Since we are talking about US laws due to a US court decision I'd assume that would be what the point of desired change would be: if you want change there, you can surely try just the same methods as anyone else: electoral, popular pressure, or judicial. By that I mean you could fund a candidate who agrees with you into office and ask them to sponsor a bill, or you could own a major cable news company, or you could invite a supreme court justice onto your yacht which presumably is where the plaintiffs have gone wrong so far, though it would be untimely prior to requesting certiorari (a word not spelled how it sounds, as I have discovered just in time to edit the post) Lacking these crutches otherwise, it would require a simply exhausting amount of hard, uncompensated work. Of course, it would have to actually be a change in the law that could stand up with the rest, or else it's just wasting everyone's time building face to a public sadly unlikely to hold accountable a politician who sponsors a bad bill because clearly it is the naughty judge's fault it was unconstitutional just as in this instance it has been suggested it was the court's fault for dismissing an unlawful claim. If only instead of saying fruitless things that serve no purpose a person could advocate for a more desirable system of regulation of US campaign finance, which in addition to surely being better assumptive of the average person's capabilities would actually be more effective to accomplish something fruitful on this issue of concern that, forgive me for being skeptical, seems more likely to be an artfully chosen route to cast doubt on green energy supply chains in specific rather than the much broader issue of this being far from limited to the green energy supply chain.

I find your language to be odd.
If only instead of saying fruitless things that serve no purpose a person could advocate for a more desirable system of regulation of US campaign finance,
I presume this is in response to:
Quote
I find it unfortunate that "the U.S. Court of Appeals for the District of Columbia sided with the tech giants". I think we ought to combat the practice of child labor.
I do not quite understand why you expect of me to be posting 10 page outline on how to change the American government. : P. This is video game forum, not the super bowl.
I am simply just expressing my discontent with child labor. lol.

Edit march 29, 2024:
oops my bad. I missed this part:
Other than what I've detailed or forgotten to do so, however, I in general agree with your sentiments.
It's good to hear that you are in agreement.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2024, 11:45:33 pm by StrawBarrel »
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StrawBarrel

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Re: Africa thread
« Reply #44 on: March 30, 2024, 12:00:12 am »

The path to progress is not straightforward. There is a jungle of hazards and challenges to overcome. The big corporations and corruption in government do indeed pose large threats to us everyday people. So I understand your pessimism. The corporations and laws which allow for the abuse of workers in poor working conditions are daunting.

Changes in better working and living conditions are slow because our opposition will be very strong. It will be a multiple battles on multiple political fronts such as "regulation of US campaign finance". Us Americans will have to advocate for more regulation of our government to diminish the power corporations have over our lawmakers. Despite how slow and incremental the change will be, I think the change shall come if more Americans participate in politics.

Edit March 30, 2024 Saturday.
That's from 2002 if I read it correctly. Now that was in the early  Bush years. Don't let me fool you into thinking there probably hasn't been some progress made IN GENERAL as that was (until recently?) a fair assumption to make on issues related to extreme poverty worldwide outside of extreme crisis areas so to speak afaik, but that link should illustrate that this is something that long predates green energy plans, lithium batteries, and fossil fuel industry pushed information operations. Other than what I've detailed or forgotten to do so, however, I in general agree with your sentiments.
Also, no worries if you miss anything. You are only 1 person. The topic of child labor is an expansive one, no single person can obtain and present all information on such a topic in a single forum post. I often think of research as a collaborative effort.

The 2002 pdf from the ILO writes:
The ILO has recently estimated that some 246 million children aged 5-17 years are engaged in child labour around the world. Of these, some 179 million are caught in the worst forms of child labour.
The Child Labour: Global estimates 2020 estimates:
Child labour remains a persistent problem in the world today. The latest global estimates indicate that 160 million children – 63 million girls and 97 million boys – were in child labour globally at the beginning of 2020, accounting for almost 1 in 10 of all children worldwide. Seventy-nine million children – nearly half of all those in child labour – were in hazardous work that directly endangers their health, safety and moral development.

So I think that progress is occurring but sadly at a slow rate of change.
« Last Edit: March 30, 2024, 12:41:01 am by StrawBarrel »
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