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[4maskwolf]

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

[IcyTea31]

TricMagic

I am 90%sure luckyowl is mafia this game but I am not going to press that until I have evidence.

Reasons? Gambler's Fallacy is a thing.

NQT hasn't posted a lot but I think he is town this time as his posts don't look like he has been constructing townreads on himself.

I don't yet have enough on NQT to make a solid read on him. So this fits.

Luckyowl: Town-ish. This will likely solidify as we enter future days with less people.
notquitethere: Still notquitehere. Leaning more to scummyness than towniness, but not to the point you get a blue color.

Right after admonishing Secretdorf for making reads on the low-posters, you make the same reads yourself? That's hypocritical of you.

[TricMagic]

 

Two for the price of  one is pretty nice.

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I could just be saying that to throw you off track you know. Why the shift to Blue without any reasoning.

To IT, there is a fault in the circuit. How would you fix it?


To Toaster, I like my toast brown but not burnt. And there is a reason I tied those two. The third could be IcyTea. Or Jim, as I'm keeping that open. Or 4mask isn't mafia in which case it becomes mafia keeping a lynchee alive for when they need to use him to waste a day. Bit early to make tells, and my list(this is to IT) is more putting my thoughts into form.

On that note, the read on Luckyowl and NQT both state things that make that read less clear. But some must be assumed until proven guilty in order to put togehter reads on others. And I think as time goes on LO will reveal themselves to be townie, eventually. Or not, but we'll get to that point when we get there. If it's hypocritical, who exactly do you defend with that accusation IT?

[4maskwolf]

Two for the price of  one is pretty nice.

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I could just be saying that to throw you off track you know. Why the shift to Blue without any reasoning.

Because I already stated my reasoning on blue several times. Their push on me seemed forced and their backtracking on it insincere. I assume people reading my posts have read all my posts and understand where my head is at.

I'm actually pondering a Secret/X scumteam right now but I'm not ready to reveal who the second person is just yet, hopefully I'll have it nailed down by the end of the day.

[4maskwolf]

Two for the price of  one is pretty nice.

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I could just be saying that to throw you off track you know. Why the shift to Blue without any reasoning.

Because I already stated my reasoning on blue several times. Their push on me seemed forced and their backtracking on it insincere. I assume people reading my posts have read all my posts and understand where my head is at.

I'm actually pondering a Secret/X scumteam right now but I'm not ready to reveal who the second person is just yet, hopefully I'll have it nailed down by the end of the day.

I reread that and realized it comes across incorrectly: I already know who X is but I need more time to nail down whether I think they're definitely a wolf or not.

[IcyTea31]

TricMagic

To IT, there is a fault in the circuit. How would you fix it?

What circuit? I don't know what you're talking about.

On that note, the read on Luckyowl and NQT both state things that make that read less clear. But some must be assumed until proven guilty in order to put togehter reads on others. And I think as time goes on LO will reveal themselves to be townie, eventually. Or not, but we'll get to that point when we get there.

On what basis are you making those assumptions? You're judging one player to be town and another to be scum, when neither of them has posted much of anything yet. Why the different treatment?

If it's hypocritical, who exactly do you defend with that accusation IT?

I'm not defending anyone. I'm saying that you're scummy for doing something that you yourself recognized as scummy.

[4maskwolf]

Two for the price of  one is pretty nice.

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I could just be saying that to throw you off track you know. Why the shift to Blue without any reasoning.

To IT, there is a fault in the circuit. How would you fix it?


To Toaster, I like my toast brown but not burnt. And there is a reason I tied those two. The third could be IcyTea. Or Jim, as I'm keeping that open. Or 4mask isn't mafia in which case it becomes mafia keeping a lynchee alive for when they need to use him to waste a day. Bit early to make tells, and my list(this is to IT) is more putting my thoughts into form.

On that note, the read on Luckyowl and NQT both state things that make that read less clear. But some must be assumed until proven guilty in order to put togehter reads on others. And I think as time goes on LO will reveal themselves to be townie, eventually. Or not, but we'll get to that point when we get there. If it's hypocritical, who exactly do you defend with that accusation IT?

Also you realize that mafia don't want a survivor to die, yes? A survivor is someone confirmed to not have a dangerous PR and who can be potentially bullied to side with them in endgame. I'm not "being left alive as a potential lynchee later", if I'm left alive it's as a potential ally later.

Also your take on me is just, like, atrociously bad to the point where I genuinely question your mental state. I'm going to sound like a broken record from BYOR here but you don't claim dangerous, attention grabbing things D1 as a wolf because they fall apart the moment someone touches them. If I get tracked to a kill (or tracked anywhere at all for that matter), if I get inspected, or if a townie vig gets antsy and blasts me near endgame, the gig is up and the whole thing is wasted.

[Toaster]

TricMagic:

And there is a reason I tied those two.

Care to say what it is?


You're talking a lot but not saying much.

[notquitethere]

Possible Non-Town Factions
OK so I have collated the roles from all the old games in a spreadsheet (I'm probably re-doing work that already exists, but I couldn't see it anywhere). There's a bunch of possibilities to work through but here's a comprehensive overview of all the possible non-town roles. I've included roles from the Bastard as we can't rule them out as possibilities (Meph included them in the OP after all): the bastard nature of that game was just that there were 3 competing scum teams and no town.

Scum Teams

Werewolves - 3/11 previous games

Werewolves act as a normal mafia team. They can also have werewolf specific roles, but not always and never yet exclusively:

Werewolf Leader - Kills a random non-werewolf when lynched
Werewolf Flanker - When aiding the nightkill, it makes the kill unblockable.

Cult - 4/11 previous games

Cults can either be charismatic cults (i.e. what we usually mean by the term "cult" in mafia) but they can also be ritual killers and act like a regular mafia team with a kill power. Cultist have normal town roles as well, but depending which kind of cult, they'll also may have one of the following:

Charismatic Cultist - Converts people into the cult
Cult Leader - Appears as town on inspections

We've never seen both appear in the same game and while I suppose I wouldn't rule it out absolutely, it wouldn't match the normal setting info as both are leader-type roles.

Vampires - 2/11 previous games

Vampires are cultists, but unlike the regular cult, their converts become Vampire Slaves and lose their prior roles. Vampires can have town roles, though in both full-Vampire teams so far they've had a Vampire Lord. The specific vamps are:

- Vampire Lord: Converts town players into Vampire Slaves
- Vampire Slave: Has no powers

See below for the third party "lone vampire" variant.

Dark Magus - 1/11 previous games

A one man scum team with a mafiakill and a bunch of one shots. They resurrect automatically once per game.

Magic Brotherhood - 1/11 previous games

Magic-themed town roles (Witch, Wizard, Fortune teller). Can mark a hex on one night and then invoke that hex on another to kill. This team has only appeared in the semi-bastard.

Templars - 1/11 previous games

A scum team with a joint block any of them can use. Can have normal town roles (though templar themed, so it was Sage and Knight). This team has only appeared in the semi-bastard.

Can have the powerful specialist role:
- Veteran Templar: immune to conversion, can night-kill or protect

Third Party

Always anti-town

Demon: A serial killer immune to blocks and redirect
Ghoul: Serial killer. Can eat the dead instead of performing the kill: if they do then their next kill is unstoppable.
Necromancer: Serial killer. Raises a dead player as a Zombie who can then perform the kills.
Zombie
Werebear Serial Killer: unlike the town werebear, they have an active kill power, not a reflexive one
[X] Serial Killer: As we've seen an existing roles (werebear, necromancer) be repurposed as a serial killer, I wouldn't be too surprised to see this happen again. Could even have a wererat serial killer.


Anti-town except in edge cases
Devil: Leaves the game with a win if they gather 3 souls. They can offer a player a powerful one-shot each night and if that player accepts they get the souls. When the Devil wins, the players who have traded their souls go to hell with the Devil.

Survivors
Lone Vampire: Survivor. Can feed on anyone, roleblocking them, and if they feed on the same person twice in a row, that player dies.
Wererat: Survivor, no powers. Sucks to be them.

Town Allies
Guardian Angel: Town Ally - wins so long as a town player is alive at the end of the game, leaves town if they fail. Has four different kinds of protection they can use on their target (vs. death, conversion etc.)


Additionally:

- Scum priests can resurrect town into their ranks (this happened in Supernatural 5 with a werewolf priest)
- Resurrections can go wrong and create third party survivors, like Demons and Lone Vampires


Quick Note on Town Roles

- In some games there is the "Townsperson" role, which is just vanilla townie.
- The monster hunter is usually a hunter of a specific monster (vampire or werewolf) and they can inspect players to see if they are that monster (+ they have a kill). In Supernatural 8 there was a Vampire Hunter in a game without any vampires. As such, their inspect would never be positive.
- Sometimes there's a Lone Witch, so instead of being a mason, they're a watcher


OK. There's the information. Going to attend to what's happening here in my next post. Let me know if I missed anything or got anything wrong.

[4maskwolf]

The only thing I have to say is that the werebear SK can choose between visiting a specific person and killing them or killing anyone who visits the werebear at night, which isn't clear in your big post-o-things.

[webadict]

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I'm still under the impression Blue is Town, even if they're sheeping me, so I'm gonna need to see more than usual on that one. Secretdorf is a legit pick to go for, though, and I definitely see scum equity in it. Tric has done enough for me to not want to eliminate them today. What's your feel on Vector for w/w?

Also, I rescind my useless claim, I can at least semi-believe you are trying to help Town.

Also, for people calling Lucky Town, did I miss the obvious Luckyclaim earlier? I don't remember it, and I can usually read Lucky super easily.

Also, I feel like I'm sheeping ToonyMan hard because I agree with a lot of things they're saying.

I am also liking Toaster pushing cases that need pushing.

PPE: Okay, will read later.

[ToonyMan]

Zombies don't play during the day but they can talk with the Necromancer in private and are in fact actionable by abilities if players suspect something is up.

[TricMagic]

TricMagic

If it's hypocritical, who exactly do you defend with that accusation IT?

I'm not defending anyone. I'm saying that you're scummy for doing something that you yourself recognized as scummy.

For making a joke post, then pushing forth another as the actual readlist, but it's just as bad? I simply gave my Honest opinion on things. It's by no means a final one, that will occur as the day approaches the end.

[4maskwolf]

Tric misunderstanding how an SK werebear works leads me to believe he's probably not one, he's just being a wolfy townie as usual.

Blue

I'm still under the impression Blue is Town, even if they're sheeping me, so I'm gonna need to see more than usual on that one. Secretdorf is a legit pick to go for, though, and I definitely see scum equity in it. Tric has done enough for me to not want to eliminate them today. What's your feel on Vector for w/w?

Honestly the sheeping you isn't wolfy so much as it is just weird, he's basically just parroting you word for word on me while expressing his own thoughts elsewhere and I'm not sure what to make of that. What I find wolfy there is his case on me and subsequent retraction. His post where he voted me felt very fake and like he was forcing anger and fire into his tone rather than genuinely believing his case, and his unvote was timed shortly after the thread started to move towards "okay the claim is probably more legit than we initially thought" with very little commentary other than that I'd "proved my point". Scum has more reason than town does not to want a survivor dead, so the quick unvote was a little weird in a bad way.

Secretdorf is indeed a legit pick and I think there's plenty of scum equity there, I'll have more to say later.

Tric I've come around on, as his posting has picked up today he seems like his usual, derpy town self.

Vector... hmm. I'll get back to you on that.

[ToonyMan]

@Toaster:

ToonyMan:

If somebody else comes forward I will be voting one of you two. There is a very high probability one of you is lying scum. If you're legit and mafia decide to gamble the odds that's their move.

Assuming a counterclaim, how would you determine which is real?  Would you concede the possibility they were both survivors?

No. I don't believe this game would start with two survivors. One at most.

Since everybody has had a chance to say something I will make my thoughts known. If somebody came forward to try to counter-claim 4mask then I would have voted them because they are mafia.

4maskwolf instant-claimed survivor 20 minutes into game start. He did not talk to anybody about doing this. Can we discredit that they aren't some other harmful third-party? No we cannot, but he's not mafia and not worth lynching today.


@NQT:

[X] Serial Killer: As we've seen an existing roles (werebear, necromancer) be repurposed as a serial killer, I wouldn't be too surprised to see this happen again. Could even have a wererat serial killer.

Do you think 4mask is actually an anti-town third-party/SK?


@Webadict:

Also, I feel like I'm sheeping ToonyMan hard because I agree with a lot of things they're saying.

That's because you know I'm right or you know I'm right.