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[slMagnvox]

I am having alot of fun with this build and thought I would share it:

3 Miners, Skilled Wrestlers
1 Mason, Building Designer*, Nov Mechanic
1 Nov Butcher, Nov Tanner, Nov Grower, Bone Carver, Proficient Bowyer**
1 Grower, Brewer
1 Grower, Cook

* I went with Skilled Building Designer because it is a hard skill to train and I want a Legendary Architect one day.

** Crossbow making is also hard to train and again I spent the extra points to get a headstart.  High quality crossbows are definitely something to look forward to.

3 Picks
6 each seeds
21-35 assorted 2p meats
30-60 assorted drinks
0 pets
0 battle axes

Basically, spend what ever is left over after skills on a bare minimum of seeds, plus meat and drink.

This build can mine alot.  I had a very very large farm room ready by mid summer creating lots of mud for tower caps.  Very large halls and large stockpile space.  Excavation impresses immigrants, both times I've played this I've gotten large immigrations in the Fall.  Wood will be available as soon as some axes immigrate and putting carpentry and bed making off for a year hasn't proven much of a disadvantage, there is always the 6-9 wood from your wagons if you need a well or a bed for resting.  And it should go without saying that 3x miners and no axe is natural build for treeless maps.  Lastly, those miners are an impressive fighting unit, just be sure you keep them together and they can "hunt" -i.e. slaughter- wildife and defend against many threats.

Thought this was worth sharing, I just noticed the wiki had been updated with a revised Starting Builds entry.  Anyone else have something interesting?

[herrbdog]

I have to say, I second this build. I have been doing very similar builds recently, even on Forested maps, with no woodcutter. I really like the massive excavation.

[Maximus]

Are those miners Proficient?  'Cause 2 Proficient miners are better than 3 adjectiveless ones.  Cheaper, too: 270 vs. 322 starting points when you include the picks.  Overall I agree with a mining-heavy build: it turbocharges every aspect of the fortress.

You can forge a battle axe as soon as your first anvil arrives in summer; all you need is 2 charcoal plus some galena or malachite.

I recently took a Proficient Architect with me.  Although she's built dozens of bridges she's still merely Talented.  She does build them faster than other dwarves, but it'll clearly take years of training (tiny bridges using nearby stone blocks) to get her to Legendary.  And I already have nearly all the bridges I need, so training her would just be for the fun of it.

[slMagnvox]

Mine were basic Miners.  Two Proficients are better than three basics for the first month or two but once they get going ...?

If I was to place a wager on which team would mine more rock in six month's time, my money would be on the three Miners and against the two Proficients.  I might be a sucker though.

The real kicker is the points spent on Wrestling.  My three could sure kick the ass of your two.  Hah.  And cheaper is relative, you stated 322 vs 270, for my 322 I have three miners ... thats just an extra ~20% cost for 50% more workforce.

My Skilled Architect is now Talented too after building every bridge, several supports and every section of my smooth rock road two blocks at a time.  And yeah, mid winter I tore apart my wagons and made two charcoal for a bronze battle axe.  And if you wanted a third miner before one immigrated you could always forge a pick, and you know, train him up from dabbling ...  sucker.   :p

[4bh0r53n]

my usual set up is 2 miner/masons,
1 woodcutter/carpenter
1 farmer/fisher
1 architect
1 gem cutter/craftdwarf
and 1 hunter,
is this actually any good?

[Aquillion]

quote:Originally posted by Maximus:
<STRONG>And I already have nearly all the bridges I need, so training her would just be for the fun of it.</STRONG>

The skill of the architect assembling a structure affects how much happiness it generates, too.  Having a legendary architect put things in your dining halls and meeting rooms can improve happy thoughts significently with no other costs.

[FaultyLogic]

quote:Originally posted by 4bh0r53n:
<STRONG>my usual set up is 2 miner/masons,
1 woodcutter/carpenter
1 farmer/fisher
1 architect
1 gem cutter/craftdwarf
and 1 hunter,
is this actually any good?</STRONG>

Well, I would make the architect a mason instead of the miners. They usually have plenty of work early game anyways. Not sure you need two masons to begin with either. On the second year i usually have at least 5 immigrant masons. Now, I came to the conclusion that I hate fisherdwarves so I never use them. Hunters are keewl.. But they find a way to die in the most serene locations. I would probably change the hunter for another farmer/brewer and dig quick to get farms up and running the first year. Oh, and you need a mechanic too!

[wereboar]

i usually combine architect with mechanic. masons are too busy in the first several years.

[Walker]

I've been doing a couple of 3 proficient miner/no woodcutter type builds, and I have to say it's a lot of fun.  Three proficients mean you bring a lot less food though, which can be an issue.  If you need a bucket/a couple of beds you just set your mechanic or mason to carpenter and break down the wagons and build your bed/bucket.

I always find it facinating to see who reaches legendary first.  And how much any single one lags behind.

[qwip]

I have combined Architect & Brewer, since I usually need Architect early but not constantly, and I don't have enough barrels early to keep the Brewer occupied either.

I've also tried Proficient mechanics and set them to making mechanisms as fast as stones are mined: still not legendary yet, but close...

[ January 27, 2007: Message edited by: qwip ]

[slMagnvox]

No sense giving the arcitecture job to anyone except the mason!  Bridges, supports, the trade depot, they all will require masonry once designed, thus if your mason does the designing then he will jump right to the construction job.  If he doesn't design the structure, he'll just have to come around and construct it later rather than sooner.

[Sucker Punch]

I usually had the mason with architecture, but I found, most of the time, once I get a mason's workshop built, my mason does pretty much nothing for the rest of his life other than build stuff there.

[slMagnvox]

except going out and building the buildings your brewer designed.  Good luck figuring out that drunk's blueprints.  Heh.

[darknight]

4bh0r53n,

I would ditch the gem cutter. Even mid to late game, there is rarely much need for one. But by the time you do need any, you usually have half a dozen of them that you have to assign to other things. I normally assign the extras as weavers or bolt-making craft dwarves. I just keep one cutter on active duty. And I assign them to repeat cutting green glass to help bring up their skill. That also keeps a supply of cut green glass "gems" handy for mood dwarves. But right at the start they just arent needed.

[ January 30, 2007: Message edited by: darknight ]