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[Secretdorf]

Missed Toonyman, who I think hasn't said anything scummy so far.

So anyway what are the trending wagons so far?

[Secretdorf]

So anyway, Juicebox. That is the person I'm most confident about being mafia.

[SHAD0Wdump]

Hmm... Allow me to try something.

Secretdorf: Why juicebox? Can you explain how you see that I'm trying to solve the game? Why am I voting you?

[Secretdorf]

Hmm... Allow me to try something.

Secretdorf: Why juicebox? Can you explain how you see that I'm trying to solve the game? Why am I voting you?

Oops I thought I explained my reasons for voting juicebox already. But to reiterate:

Lurking which ONLY benefits scum IMO.

To Q2, This post:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I cannot believe that Hector's post ha given me pause but... It has.

So I realize a problem. For his argument to be wrong, we are looking at one of the following scenarios.

-Hector and Webadict are both mafia: Possible but unlikely on the principle that I don't strongly believe two out of the mafia team are going to be spouting this much nonsense and gathering attention to themselves. I'm still partly willing to believe Hector went ham and Webadict tried to pull him back with this, but the way it was done has me feeling like he wouldn't be stupid enough to actually fall into this.
 Toony's observation that the scum are mostly lurking has kinda hit home with me.

-Web is mafia: Possible, but again messy on his part. Hector's belief Web would just let the madness proceed is honestly sound logic here.

-hector is mafia: Web helping makes sense. But the passive behavior remains unaddressed, like in pretty much all scenarios.

-Both are town: I'm lost in this scenario because this shitstorm is... Absurdly confusing. Web again makes sense, and hector is just attracting attention, and I'm here feeling like I wasted my time. The worst part is I'm starting to see this as more and more likely.

And also I had a slight townlean on you from the start. You've been active and asking some good questions, HOWEVER, you are not a strong town read, as that could also come from scum but I'm more inclined to think it comes from town. As to why you are voting me, I don't know for sure, maybe you are trying to save juicebox or you got an order from scumchat. It would be better if you explained it.

[SHAD0Wdump]

Honestly, just threw it out there because you are the only person here right at this moment, so I might as well poke you a bit to see if I could get anything of substance. I'm honestly out of fuel right now until somebody does something.

Well I might as well put the vote somewhere useful for the morning.

Tricmagic: How do you feel about my voting so far?

[Caz]

It's morning and I've had too much/not enough coffee so please excuse this.


Shad0w

NQT, Caz, Toaster: What do you think of the current situation? Hector/Luckyowl's waffling on votes? Initial bandwagon on Luckyowl? What about Toony not quite being in the limelight?

Tbh I think the original voting for LuckyOwl was (un)RVS with a smidge of "STOP FLIPPING COINS TO MAKE DECISIONS DAMNIT" meta from the last several games. I don't think Lucky has said anything seriously wrong yet so I'd wonder at the votes that are still on him now. It seems a bit lazy to me.

I think it's rich that hector is voting LuckyOwl for being 'passive' when that adjective could fit half the players in the game.

I don't know what you mean about Toony 'notquitebeing' in the limelight.


Hector

You and Toaster were getting in my grille about how I was posting, webadict is aware what I was doing was not serious, he stopped me doing it, and in so doing the two of you wasting your time on something that was NAI.

If he was scum he would’ve let that carry on.

Wit.

Hey hector remember when I literally explained to SHAD0W that you weren't claiming 3rd party? Webadict points out NAI behaviour and you townread him, I do the same thing and... you are voting me? Why buddy webadict so much?

I feel... left out. Estranged almost.


Lucky

To be frank, that's just who I am. The same way Caz will get paranoid,

I get paranoid? That's... not a character trait, it's literally a prerequisite to play the game. ?_?

Like I know SD is town 100%. He's pretty capricious when it comes to his vote. Also, if he was scum his scum team would've give him some tip on how to act like town. The fact we're not seeing any sign of coaching, makes me believe that SD is town who has no scum influences. You can WIFOM and say, this is there plan after all. But, I doubt this. As this is quite unhelpful not only for SD but for his scum team. So, there's no way he's scum.

'He's town because scum would be smart enough to avoid suspicion' isn't an argument, it's WIFOM (watch me get accused of buzzwording next. THAT'S RIGHT, I READ THE WIKI). You know that buddying SD really isn't helping the people who think you are scum together right? @_@

Tbh this makes Lucky look more town to me (how is that possible -.-) 'cause I don't think he would be so obvious in cosying up to SD (who I think is scum), and EVEN IF HE WAS (because LuckyOwl) I think the other people in the scumteam would yanno, tell him not to do that. Because it's so obvious that people trying to lynch him based on it look like they are just going for an easy option to me.

...Wait, am I buddying LuckyOwl now? I feel like this is going to be a long day.


Secretdorf

Unvote
I think luckyowl is town, shad0w might also be. I'll vote someone later.

So wishy-washy. No reasoning? Please do something useful if you are town.

So I realize a problem. For his argument to be wrong, we are looking at one of the following scenarios.

-Hector and Webadict are both mafia: Possible but unlikely on the principle that I don't strongly believe two out of the mafia team are going to be spouting this much nonsense and gathering attention to themselves. I'm still partly willing to believe Hector went ham and Webadict tried to pull him back with this, but the way it was done has me feeling like he wouldn't be stupid enough to actually fall into this.
 Toony's observation that the scum are mostly lurking has kinda hit home with me.

-Web is mafia: Possible, but again messy on his part. Hector's belief Web would just let the madness proceed is honestly sound logic here.

-hector is mafia: Web helping makes sense. But the passive behavior remains unaddressed, like in pretty much all scenarios.

-Both are town: I'm lost in this scenario because this shitstorm is... Absurdly confusing. Web again makes sense, and hector is just attracting attention, and I'm here feeling like I wasted my time. The worst part is I'm starting to see this as more and more likely.

Did you forget about third parties? They could just be acting weird because they're trying to play the fence.

Caz: Dunno why but whenever I think of him, I get a mafia ally read. However, that is just guts no solid reasons here.

You're never going to let that question go, are you? Unfortunately this comment actually makes me more likely to think that you're town, since as scum you should WANT a mafia ally and to shut up about it... unless the mafia ally is voting for the scum team. So by voting you, I should prove that I'm *not* a mafia-ally, RIGHT?

Please follow the logic.

Spoiler: reads for now (click to show/hide)

Tric - slight town on the early miller claim, I don't think scum would claim miller in this game so early when we could have possibly insane cops etc. It's just painting a target on you for no reason.

SHAD0Wdump - townish, they actually seem to be pushing town forward.

Vector - slight town. not so many posts, but the ones that exist are dense with content.

Web - neutral. Inscrutable as always. It's hard to tell if he's actually pissed off at how people are playing because he thinks it's bad for town or that being noisy about things will make him look townie. The badgering didn't *seem* that helpful. Don't know why he is waiting for Vector to actually do anything, unless they're whispering at each other through the vents.

LuckyOwl - it's luckyowl. ^{you must lynch luckyowl to win the game}. eh, neutral so far.

Toony - neutral. posts seem fine enough, but he is a bit quiet so far, maybe he doesn't want attention.

Toaster, NQT - null. gotta go back and read what they posted as i realise i can't think of a single thing.

hector13 - slight scum. he was weird early game, and some inconsistent logic noted.

juicebox - light scum. lurk lurk lurk lurk.

Secretdorf - scum. Has said some dodgy things, arguments that make little sense, jumping between lynches. Bad gut feeling.



...Is there still a lurkertracker bot? MAMOBO?

Spoiler: and, offtopic (click to show/hide)

Also I found a mafia lifehack in using notepad++ to draft posts. I have lost exactly 0 posts so far. Usually there's just bits and pieces of tabs floating everywhere. NOTEPAD IS THE WAY. (why do I bother mentioning this? you guys probably all have a 50-page spreadsheet with pie charts on role probability. bah.)

[Secretdorf]

Oh wow, Caz, many of our reads are same. I think I can town read you now as you have provided some content which I think comes from town. Vote on LO was self preservation vote as I didn't have a town read on Luckyowl at that point.(and people were joining the wagon on me rapidly... For some unknown reason)

Can I do anything to alleviate your suspicions?

[Caz]

Vote on LO was self preservation vote as I didn't have a town read on Luckyowl at that point.

...Self preservation vote? What does this mean?

Can I do anything to alleviate your suspicions?

Go make a convincing case on someone.

[Secretdorf]

You say that you voting me will prove you aren't mafia ally. But what if you are mafia ally and think I'm scummy-town? You'd vote me. Just pointing out fault in your logic. Also I don't think there's anything wrong with jumping between wagons as scumreads change all(most?) of the time. Aside from the Luckyowl wagon as I didn't scumread him at that point. That was just 'self- preservation' vote as there was only one other wagon at that point.

Also if you think I'm scum, who do you think are my scum buddies?

Vote on LO was self preservation vote as I didn't have a town read on Luckyowl at that point.

...Self preservation vote? What does this mean?

PPE:

Can I do anything to alleviate your suspicions?

Go make a convincing case on someone.

It means voting someone not because you think they're scum but because you'd rather lynch them than you being lynched.

I'd make a case D2 if I live to that point. D1 cases are messy as D1 itself is a mess '_'

[Secretdorf]

Oops the PPE label was meant to be outside the quote.

[Secretdorf]

My vote rests on Juicebox until I think they aren't scum. I don't have anything to build a convincing case on them but I'm 75% sure they're scum.

[Caz]

Go make a convincing case on someone.

It means voting someone not because you think they're scum but because you'd rather lynch them than you being lynched.

I'd make a case D2 if I live to that point. D1 cases are messy as D1 itself is a mess '_'
[/quote]

If you're not gonna scumhunt how are you useful to town

And yeah I suppose if I was mafia-ally and thought you were scummy-town then I'd vote you. The way to avoid that would be to appear town instead of insisting on defending yourself.

See, the LuckyOwl vote reasoning still troubles me. You're saying you couldn't find a single person you thought was actually scum? Everyone obviously wants to survive to the next day but you put it so blatantly that you don't care whether another townie dies as long as you live. Which suggests to me either mafia, survivor or PR. It also suggests laziness. There's 10 other people you could suspect, and you vote someone who you admit you don't believe is scum. It's WEIRD.

My vote rests on Juicebox until I think they aren't scum. I don't have anything to build a convincing case on them but I'm 75% sure they're scum.

How did you come to this percentage? You're just making it look like you don't care who you lynch at all.

[notquitethere]

This is a long D1 so I'm not worried right this second, but if the vote spread looks like it currently does at day end, then a town player will be lynched. Broad spread = town dead.

Spoiler: Current Votes (click to show/hide)

Caz - 0 -
hector13 - 0 -
juicebox - 2 - Vector*, Secretdorf*, 
LuckyOwl - 2 - webadict*, ToonyMan*,
notquitethere - 0 -
Secretdorf - 2 - Toaster*, Caz*,
SHAD0Wdump - 0 -
Toaster - 1 - TricMagic*,
ToonyMan - 0 -
TricMagic - 1 -  SHAD0Wdump*,
Vector - 1 - notquitethere*,
webadict - 0 -
No Lynch - 0 -
Not Voting - 3 - LuckyOwl, juicebox, hector13*

LuckyOwl, juicebox, hector13, shooting from the hip, who'd you lynch if the day ended right now?

Also LuckyOwl

well, I can't flip every day, unless someone can day investigate me. . In all seriousness, I always vote from reasons. The coin is just a joke, because I'm a compulsive liar in IRL...wait, I don't think that help my case at all...anyways! yes, I'll be voting on the bases of my reasoning.(But please keep believing I flip coins. It's pretty funny.)

All this time we thought you were:



When really you're:



I'm not sure that's any better. If you were a 3rd party would you tell us?


Vector

No, previous experience would suggest "obviously not." I find it interesting that you're here to draw attention away from the Secretdorf wagon that suddenly started forming, NQT.

I'm trying to unpack the accusation here. Do you think I was trying to prevent more people from voting Secretdorf (i.e. draw attention onto an alternative wagon), or do you think I was trying to get people not to think about the wagon so that it could continue on? And how exactly was I doing one of these (mutually exclusive) goals?


Shadow

NQT, Caz, Toaster: What do you think of the current situation? Hector/Luckyowl's waffling on votes? Initial bandwagon on Luckyowl? What about Toony not quite being in the limelight?

Vote waffling is weak unfocused play but almost a null tell. Drawing back and lacking commitment in votes can be a scumtell.
Lucky was bound to get flak. Early game pressure on them isn't extraordinary-- what we want to watch for is people taking weak early cases right up to the end of day. It's a bit early to tell about Toony. Town!Toony I expect to play to the hilt when things get real: I'll have a better idea D2 after we've seen him at day's end. What do you think about the vote wafflers and Toony?


Secretdorf

My vote rests on Juicebox until I think they aren't scum. I don't have anything to build a convincing case on them but I'm 75% sure they're scum.

This just gut or you following Vector here?


Toaster
So far Secretdorf, Luckyowl and webadict have soaked up most of the votes and airtime. What % of them are scum?

[Secretdorf]

Spoiler: To Caz (click to show/hide)

Go make a convincing case on someone.

It means voting someone not because you think they're scum but because you'd rather lynch them than you being lynched.

I'd make a case D2 if I live to that point. D1 cases are messy as D1 itself is a mess '_'

If you're not gonna scumhunt how are you useful to town

And yeah I suppose if I was mafia-ally and thought you were scummy-town then I'd vote you. The way to avoid that would be to appear town instead of insisting on defending yourself.

See, the LuckyOwl vote reasoning still troubles me. You're saying you couldn't find a single person you thought was actually scum? Everyone obviously wants to survive to the next day but you put it so blatantly that you don't care whether another townie dies as long as you live. Which suggests to me either mafia, survivor or PR. It also suggests laziness. There's 10 other people you could suspect, and you vote someone who you admit you don't believe is scum. It's WEIRD.

My vote rests on Juicebox until I think they aren't scum. I don't have anything to build a convincing case on them but I'm 75% sure they're scum.

How did you come to this percentage? You're just making it look like you don't care who you lynch at all.
[/quote]

I am scumhunting by voting the player I think is scum. The Luckyowl vote was because people were jumping on my wagon and... It was sleep time.

Why would town lurk? I am basing my percentage off the chance.

[Mamobo]

Mamobo likes to go bananas!
Vote Count
------------------------
Caz - 0 -
hector13 - 0 -
juicebox - 2 - Secretdorf*, Vector*,
LuckyOwl - 2 - webadict*, ToonyMan*,
notquitethere - 0 -
Secretdorf - 2 - Toaster*, Caz*,
SHAD0Wdump - 0 -
Toaster - 1 - TricMagic*,
ToonyMan - 0 -
TricMagic - 1 - SHAD0Wdump*,
Vector - 1 - notquitethere*,
webadict - 0 -
No Lynch - 0 -

Not Voting - 3 - LuckyOwl, juicebox, hector13*,

7 to Hammer. Day ends on January 26, 2021 at 02:00 CST (~42 hours remaining).