Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Haspen]

Chancellor hector13 implements Fascist Policy: Reinforcement of Executive Power!

All Presidential Actions now cost 5 Political Power less.

Spoiler: Policies: 2/1 (click to show/hide)

Presidential Power: 40

Liberal:
Emancipation of Women
Social Security

Fascist:
Reinforcement of Executive Power (Presidential Actions -5 PP cost)

Free Talk Phase (~24 hours) begins now!

[Dustan Hache]

You are misreading my statement in a drastically detached fashion icytea. I will highlight and underline to more clearly communicate my message.

The only purpose questions serve for me is to provide insight into the tactics I am using and the perceived tactics of others,Which does not provide an alignment tell.

Let me break this statement down more clearly: Questions and discussion in this game Do not provide an alignment tell And may give false reads due to spinning of the discussion by other players.
Questioning can be used to attempt to decipher the strategy of the player they are directed at, which is helpful for determining playstyle but not a tell by itself.

[hector13]

So... Dustan apparently doesn’t care that two of his scum picks have chosen a fascist policy.

Fascist/Mandatory Language Education
Fascist/Reinforcement of Executive Power

Two fascist cards Cnidaros? What gives?

I chose the executive power one because it reduces the cost of all actions, but that just makes it easier for us to investigate people now.

[Dustan Hache]

I Do care about it, but only because it further reinforces my suspicion of Cnidaros, given that one of those cards is a fascist with no side benefit.

[hector13]

Even though I was the one that chose the fascist policy and could quite easily be lying about him giving me two fascist policies?

Why does my action solidify your read on him and not me, especially since we don’t know what card he discarded?

I mean it’s 11:4 against liberal policies, someone said earlier I think but I’m on my phone and can’t be bothered checking, so it is feasible that he got three fascist cards, and that’s the only reason I’m not smashing my phone to pieces typing out an accusation of him of being fascist.

Well, at least before he says something, anyway...

[Luckyowl]

I Do care about it, but only because it further reinforces my suspicion of Cnidaros, given that one of those cards is a fascist with no side benefit.

Well, to be honest, if the other card has no benefit and the card Hector chose can help us investigate quicker. Wouldn't that make Cnidaros leaning more liberal than fascist?

Cnidaros: What was the card that you discarded?

[Cnidaros]

The three cards I got:

14 Fascist/Expansion of Capital Punishment Laws
 7 Fascist/Mandatory Language Education
17 Fascist/Reinforcement of Executive Power

All fascist. I discarded the Capital Punishment card, since it is not in our interest to reduce the cost of executions when we only have a one-person majority. Of the two cards I passed to hector, he did pick the more useful card between them.

[flazeo25]

Hmm then im leaning towards hector being possibly being facists given that they enacted one that gives facist more power over useless one. If the execution card comes up though Cnideros then I will think both of you are one.

[Dustan Hache]

Keeping in mind that we can only take their word for it, it may have been a bad hand. Still, the fascist cards are roughly split 50/50 between cards with upsides and cards purely advancing the fascist goal With no benefits, with exactly one extra card that has a benefit. We know at least one beneficial card (chancellor authority) was discarded and two fascist cards as well, before this turn.
That left 8 fascist cards and 2 liberal cards assuming someone wasn't lying, and of those fascist cards at least 5 of them were beneficial. Thats a higher than average chance for 2 beneficial cards. His claim is discarding capital punishment, which matches up but is extremely suspicious since even that is better than a pure fascist card.

Edit: Flazeo, are you okay? You do realize the card hector passed is beneficial to liberals too, instead of just advancing the fascist's goals?

[Cnidaros]

Hmm then im leaning towards hector being possibly being facists given that they enacted one that gives facist more power over useless one. If the execution card comes up though Cnideros then I will think both of you are one.

It's the other way around: lowering the cost of presidential actions is also beneficial to liberals as it reduces investigation costs. And I'm willing to stake my reputation as a liberal that the capital punishment card will not appear again (until the deck is reshuffled).

[Cnidaros]

Keeping in mind that we can only take their word for it, it may have been a bad hand. Still, the fascist cards are roughly split 50/50 between cards with upsides and cards purely advancing the fascist goal With no benefits, with exactly one extra card that has a benefit. We know at least one beneficial card (chancellor authority) was discarded and two fascist cards as well, before this turn.
That left 8 fascist cards and 2 liberal cards assuming someone wasn't lying, and of those fascist cards at least 5 of them were beneficial. Thats a higher than average chance for 2 beneficial cards. His claim is discarding capital punishment, which matches up but is extremely suspicious since even that is better than a pure fascist card.

Edit: Flazeo, are you okay? You do realize the card hector passed is beneficial to liberals too, instead of just advancing the fascist's goals?

How is the capital punishment card better than a pure fascist card? Execution is a very high-risk, high-reward strategy. There are 4 liberals and 3 fascists, a majority of only one person. If the president doing the execution is wrong (or a fascist), you've just doomed the liberal team to lose. The fascist team can just keep voting no on every liberal pick, creating endless ties and racking up the discord, and since there are more fascist than liberal policies in the deck, chance greatly favours the fascists to win by random implementation of the top policy.

[Dustan Hache]

While it is true that they can stalemate the elections, the discord mechanic will Force an election with a 50/50 chance of a liberal president unless a second liberal is executed, in which case fascists will have the majority.
This means that while the outcome is still rather negative in that worse case scenario, it is entirely possible to bounce back due to the automatic policy implementation, combined with the card pick by the randomised office generating 30 power at a minimum, and 50 if a continued stalemate ensues.
 This means that a second execution is likely and would reestablish Liberal majority as long as that coin flip is won.
The above argument has been disproven and is no longer valid in my eyes.

Granted this is a optimistic view of a worst case scenario, But the alternative is we take a chance that we gain No benefits at all. I wholeheartedly agree that card passed was the best of all three options, but capital punishment was the second best and should not have been discarded so readily.

[hector13]

It’s also a wrong view. If Nays get half the votes, then it wins. If a liberal is eliminated, the fascists can put us in eternal stalemate and we’d be enacting policies effectively at random every third election, and nobody would ever be the president to make use of the points, for good or for ill. That’s what I get from reading the rules, anyway.

If we got to that point, Haspen would be just as well enacting policies in the deck until one side won.

Consequently, that card being enacted is super-duper bad because it removes all choice from the game if a fascist uses it or a liberal effs that ess up.

It is especially bizarre you’ve been pushing for investigation being the optimal strategy for liberals to win, but then come up with this as an apparently solid second option, even though it comes down to a coin flip in your view? That doesn’t make sense to me.

[Dustan Hache]

Upon re-reading the rules, I concede that the option is not as viable as i thought, as it only randomised the candidate, and does not put them in power. With that in mind, i retract my statement of Cnidaros's action there being suspicious. I expected discord to act as a tiebreaker, and it does not.

I am not saying it is the next best strategy, but at the time I expected it to be a rapid escalation rather than a eternal stalemate. It is the last resort rather than a second option.

[Dustan Hache]

Bumping for the next cycle