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[PatrikLundell]

The purpose of this thread is to host discussions about the UI elements being developed leading up to the Premium Release in order to allow for these elements to be improved upon. It's intended to be based on what's been revealed at the time of the discussion.
- Discussions about the pixel art has its own thread, so anything that's about that topic is better discussed there http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=173474.0.
- Questions to Toady go into the FotF thread http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=169696.0.
- Suggestions about things not (yet) revealed go into the Suggestions forum http://www.bay12forums.com/smf/index.php?board=5.0.

The reason this thread is started is that the tile set thread currently is hosting this kind of discussions, and they are not really within the artists' domain, and so don't really fit in there, and thus ought to find a new home. It's expected that the discussions will change over the course of development as new contents is revealed. As a possible example, at the time of this posting it's not suitable to discuss key binding or how to interact with "things", but when/if Toady presents the development in that department it comes into scope.

Edit: The thread is intended to cover the Premium Release, which means both the Premium and Classic Versions. If something discussed is vendor specific, it ought to be stated explicitly. It can also be noted that The UI in the Premium Version using the character tile set (CP437 based, possibly extended with additional characters) is expected to be identical to the UI for the Classic Version.

Apparently Toady wants these discussions in the FotF thread, so I'm locking this one.

[Shonai_Dweller]

Excellent. What a good idea for a thread. 

I would be very interested to know what the basic UI will look like in Classic Dwarf Fortress. Presumably everything in the premium release UI is able to be created by modders and nothing is hard-coded to Steam specifically.

[Pancakes]

Wow, I've got to say I'm a really big fan of the new UI shown on the latest devlog. It's crisp, clean, and much better for navigating. I'm also really excited to see the new changes to the main game screen, as being able to see the date in game without going to the 'z' menu has been something I've always wanted.

Hype!

[Cruxador]

Then, to help get discussion kicked off, here's the suggestion request Mike posted:

Well then! Now that the UI has been shown on Steam, I'm interested in your feedback:
https://cdn.cloudflare.steamstatic.com/steamcommunity/public/images/clans/34693670/13f662e9694091cf4b49053b2bc2b52b39d88f2a.png

Two things shared already that I agree with is:
-the scrollbars look too "windows 95"
-the colours are not quite right (or they're "mad ugly" as one commenter put it).

Not sure what to change on both accounts.

It's already been addressed to some extent (but definitely not to the extent of a consensus solution or to the exclusion of additional ideas) and some people also made up some quite nice mockups, hopefully they will also post the versions they're most satisfied with in this thread.

[Starver]

I wanted something useful to start my thread involvement, rather than just PTW. But, before we get too far in, let me add in a note about "Scrollbars looking too much like Win95"...

Spoiler: An example which explains why I disagree with this... (click to show/hide)

(Noting that an XP machine I've just booted up, default install unchanged but perhaps for anything creeping in through Service Packs, still with Bliss background and original Fisher-Price-rounded taskbar/Start Button, a shell window seems to resemble the '98 example shown above, while an Explorer window deliberately resized to require one does look as per XP. There's is no problem with either.

And what would be wrong with it? It has to look like a scrollbar, to sufficient degree. You can perhaps demand something a bit more Dorfy (look to steampunk for inspiration? - though this is more a discussion to return to the MephDay thread[1]) rather than just change flat colour/flood-texture on the 'bar and bed' elements to match the eventually decided-upon theme pallette


So that's the last I want to say about that (and the precise hues and tones in use) in this thread. Especially if it'll be Steam release and parallel-Vanilla release lacking the specifically MephDay elements.  I look forward to contributing to the ideas w.r.t. layout/composition/visible-<data|controls>, though.  Unless it really needs to be further discussed here, for reasons I have yet to hear.


[1] And perhaps could mirror the final graphics given to powered rollers (if going with the chain(/rope) element).

[Salmeuk]

Truthfully (and this is a very self-centered perspective), I'm a bit worried big changes to the UI flow will disrupt my 13 years of muscle memory and make it difficult to play. I remember the shift to 3-d was similarly dramatic, as well as the addition of realistic trees and tree growth, and at the time I was sort of saddened by those big changes. You come to know DF like an alternate reality with a separate set of rules, and lets just say Toady is not afraid to upset the status quo!

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

I sometimes think back to the single-tile trees, and how nice it was for creating tree farms, and there being a scarcity of wood on most maps. I also think back to the simplicity of 2-d, and the things that were lost in the transition: rivers with seasonal flooding, gamey but ultimately compelling raids from the chasm and the magma, the general sense of left-to-right progression that can guide a player's narrative. I'm not sure I could enjoy those old versions now, having been spoiled by things like constructions and water flow and, well, almost everything added since those days, but I feel they are important in understanding how this game gained it's reputation in those early days. DF was less of a simulation back then, and that might have been good for it's early growth.

A concern that might be shared with a broader audience is the speed of actions within the game. With only a few keypresses I can build any construction, workshop, or piece of furniture. Shift + arrow keys is awkward at first, but allows for a complete traversal of the game map in a very short about of time. Not to mention the utility of a 10-tile selection jump when blueprinting constructions. Rather than counting 40 tiles, I can just shift-up 4 times.

If I was forced to introduce mouse control into some of these interactions, I would suffer for it! There hasn't been any evidence of this yet as far as I can tell. Thankfully. 

[Uthimienure]

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

Truthfully (and this is a very self-centered perspective), I'm a bit worried big changes to the UI flow will disrupt my 13 years of muscle memory and make it difficult to play. I remember the shift to 3-d was similarly dramatic, as well as the addition of realistic trees and tree growth, and at the time I was sort of saddened by those big changes. You come to know DF like an alternate reality with a separate set of rules, and lets just say Toady is not afraid to upset the status quo!

A concern that might be shared with a broader audience is the speed of actions within the game. With only a few keypresses I can build any construction, workshop, or piece of furniture. Shift + arrow keys is awkward at first, but allows for a complete traversal of the game map in a very short about of time. Not to mention the utility of a 10-tile selection jump when blueprinting constructions. Rather than counting 40 tiles, I can just shift-up 4 times.

If I was forced to introduce mouse control into some of these interactions, I would suffer for it! There hasn't been any evidence of this yet as far as I can tell. Thankfully.

+1
Very well said 

[therahedwig]

So, the only real feedback I have on the item selection menus right now is that I am wondering if people wouldn't enjoy having the ability to add/subtract multiples of certain items. So, if I have... pig tail ropes, and I want to get 10 extra, that I can just type that in, or use a separate button for that. I don't remember if that was already sort of included in the original UI?

Most jrpgs use up/down for selecting 1 at a time, and left/right for 10 at a time, and I think most PC games just have extra buttons for this. I wouldn't know what is best for DF here.