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[Raven]

I doubt it. If you put minor artifacts on display and they get stolen, then you get to experience a new facet of the game. Otherwise, you miss out. Though there are ways to make sure that the theft is detected immediately, so that you can recover the artifact before it leaves the fort.



There was a huge official discussion of stress, in which the subject was pulped, mangled, decapitated, and in all other ways beaten to death. It's up to Toady now.

like, putting them in a barracks during training sessions?

[anewaname]

Yep.

[Raven]

Yep.

always a smart move

does training make noise and wakes up dorfs? would be an useful strategy to prevent bloodsucking

i am reading a bit about the big stress issue, seems pretty big...

[Starver]

If you're keeping dwarves awake (or rousing them) to prevent hæmovoria, you're probably introducing stress...

(Back when vampires were first introduced, I tried out building a Panopticon design of rooms/alcoves opening onto deliberately busy areas. I don't know if it caused less bloodsucking, because I've rarely had any sign of it even going back into my more traditional room layouts. I perhaps need to try to cultivate things to get a provable situation and try out these ideas again across save-copies. Levers to be pulled in various rooms, maybe.)

[Raven]

bloodsuckers are hard to find sometimes when you check every migrant before accepting them in your community, but not impossible; the first check can prevent such accidents

resorting to open space dormitories can be a source of stress because dorfs hate not having a proper room or being ogled at while sleeping, locking doors prevent them from going to their workplace but could save some precious dorfs lives

[Starver]

Mostly why I didn't keep on with the experiments.

(Also it didn't work as well, aesthetically, as it could in an FPS environment. Would have looked good in one of them, a large shaft with central 'floating' stairwell and gantries spanning out at all angles to the bedroom balconies, effectively a many-a-gon multilevel wall of bedroom doors, the bed in direct radial sight beyond. But in a Z-sliced tile-gridded layout it was a bit rough.)

[Fleeting Frames]

Nah, vamps drink when they gotta drink. Though just because they're doing it in busy tavern in front of everybody doesn't necessarily mean anybody saw it.

@Raven: What? No they don't hate it. As long as they have their own bedroom, they don't care who sees them sleeping; much like they don't care who sees them eating, only that they get to do it in a dining room (and what they eat).

There's minor value hit for having shared bedrooms, but that is easily overcome.

[Leonidas]

Legends Viewer will list all the living vampires in the world.

[Saiko Kila]

I have never seen a vampire discovered, despite drinking from a guy sleeping in a crowded main passage. Maybe it's just luck, but I made plenty on experiments on vampires, and have observed countless acts of feeding.

For the last few years I'm patching the game so the vampires are non-lethal (they suck 10% of original amount), meaning they are free to drink and - nobody ever catches them. Maybe it's the moment someone dies when there is a check for discovery of a vampire, though, haven't tried that one too much.

[Raven]

I have never seen a vampire discovered, despite drinking from a guy sleeping in a crowded main passage. Maybe it's just luck, but I made plenty on experiments on vampires, and have observed countless acts of feeding.

For the last few years I'm patching the game so the vampires are non-lethal (they suck 10% of original amount), meaning they are free to drink and - nobody ever catches them. Maybe it's the moment someone dies when there is a check for discovery of a vampire, though, haven't tried that one too much.

Yea making vamps less OP would balance their stealth tendency, mostly because arriving at year five, having a unique legendary dorf you are fond of, having him randomly oneshotted by a leech seems a bit depressing

"it was inevitable"

Nah, vamps drink when they gotta drink. Though just because they're doing it in busy tavern in front of everybody doesn't necessarily mean anybody saw it.

@Raven: What? No they don't hate it. As long as they have their own bedroom, they don't care who sees them sleeping; much like they don't care who sees them eating, only that they get to do it in a dining room (and what they eat).

There's minor value hit for having shared bedrooms, but that is easily overcome.

Oh really? maybe i remember this detail wrong, passed too much time since i last played

Legends Viewer will list all the living vampires in the world.

kinda cheaty, isn't it?

[TubaDragoness]

Dwarves get negative thoughts from using unassigned beds or dormitories, but when it comes to personal rooms, they only really care about the value. Some people make super extravagant dormitories to offset the lack of personal rooms, others designate individual rooms that overlap or lack walls. I favor setting up individual rooms that open directly onto a courtyard so they have their unshared 3x3 and plenty of walls to decorate, but there's a good chance that vampires will be spotted by dwarves coming or going from their own rooms.

Dwarves are a little more stress resistant than they were in the last version, but they're still rather fragile. The key to offsetting stress at the moment is to start eliminating factors that cause it as soon as possible. Get everything underground ASAP and disable hunting and fishing labors until you can sort through and find the dwarves that don't mind the rain. Get your corpse/burial disposal systems set up right away so as few dwarves are exposed to body parts as possible. Most importantly, examine your dwarves regularly for the personality traits that make them vulnerable to stress. Give them special treatment, and if necessary, you can exile them or send them to allied minor settlements as soon as those start showing up BEFORE they succumb to stress. It's manageable, but it can be tedious. Especially if you aren't sure what you're doing with it.

I know there are a couple mods out there that make dwarves harder to stress out as an unofficial patch until Toady can revisit the stress system. You can also use the DF-hack utility that removes all stress from units. Yes, it's technically cheating, but I personally don't mind that so much when it's a temporary fix for a mechanic that is known to be broken.

As for the villain stuff... yeah, Toady couldn't implement everything he had planned because he had to switch gears for the Steam release prep, since that has actual deadlines with businesses. So we have lots of the shenanigans but very few of the ways to counter them. Displaying artifacts in guildhalls helps you notice their thefts because it places them in populated areas. At the moment, I would recommend not allowing visitors in or just locking up every artifact as it's created so they can't be stolen. Or resigning yourself to losing them in a trickle, because the buggers are persistent and subverted dwarves don't stop trying to assist them until the villain is dead.

(Using legends to confirm the identity of a vampire is cheaty, but since they use an assumed identity rather than their real name, you could in theory use legends to confirm you have a vampire, and not look at who they're pretending to be?)

[Starver]

(I've yet to 'properly' display artefact items, I must admit. For a long, long time I've tended to dig (and entirely smooth.. because) a spiral-corridor into a standard 'block' between corridors and one-tile-stockpile my first artefact in the far inner point then locked-door/built-wall seal that off, the new deepest point gets the next artefact, door/wall, rinse, repeat. Which of course doesn't make for useful room values, but works very well to prevent such thefts being easy to accomplish.)

[Raven]

Dwarves get negative thoughts from using unassigned beds or dormitories, but when it comes to personal rooms, they only really care about the value. Some people make super extravagant dormitories to offset the lack of personal rooms, others designate individual rooms that overlap or lack walls. I favor setting up individual rooms that open directly onto a courtyard so they have their unshared 3x3 and plenty of walls to decorate, but there's a good chance that vampires will be spotted by dwarves coming or going from their own rooms.

Dwarves are a little more stress resistant than they were in the last version, but they're still rather fragile. The key to offsetting stress at the moment is to start eliminating factors that cause it as soon as possible. Get everything underground ASAP and disable hunting and fishing labors until you can sort through and find the dwarves that don't mind the rain. Get your corpse/burial disposal systems set up right away so as few dwarves are exposed to body parts as possible. Most importantly, examine your dwarves regularly for the personality traits that make them vulnerable to stress. Give them special treatment, and if necessary, you can exile them or send them to allied minor settlements as soon as those start showing up BEFORE they succumb to stress. It's manageable, but it can be tedious. Especially if you aren't sure what you're doing with it.

I know there are a couple mods out there that make dwarves harder to stress out as an unofficial patch until Toady can revisit the stress system. You can also use the DF-hack utility that removes all stress from units. Yes, it's technically cheating, but I personally don't mind that so much when it's a temporary fix for a mechanic that is known to be broken.

As for the villain stuff... yeah, Toady couldn't implement everything he had planned because he had to switch gears for the Steam release prep, since that has actual deadlines with businesses. So we have lots of the shenanigans but very few of the ways to counter them. Displaying artifacts in guildhalls helps you notice their thefts because it places them in populated areas. At the moment, I would recommend not allowing visitors in or just locking up every artifact as it's created so they can't be stolen. Or resigning yourself to losing them in a trickle, because the buggers are persistent and subverted dwarves don't stop trying to assist them until the villain is dead.

(Using legends to confirm the identity of a vampire is cheaty, but since they use an assumed identity rather than their real name, you could in theory use legends to confirm you have a vampire, and not look at who they're pretending to be?)

i must admit, i have confused feelings about the steam release... but it was inevitable

the open rooms design seems interesting

the micromanagement of each dorf instead seems a bit tedious but that's why we have dorf the rapist

[Raven]

one last question: for life reasons right now i'm playing with a small laptop which has the following specs:

intel celeron N3350 1,10 GHz dual core and 4 GB of ram

I found creating a world with 250 year history and medium size a huge pain so i had to create a smaller size world, same history

starting the game took various minutes

do I have to upgrade my processor?

or is there something i can do to speed up the starting process?

[Starver]

Do you have to? No.

Mind you, when I started playing I'd set worldgen going last thing at night to know I'd (usually) have a new map to scroll round[1] by the morning, and I've got so much old hardware around that I want to use for something...

Plus, you'd probably not be upgrading the laptop CPU, regardless of circumstances, better just to wait until you can get a good/not-awful desktop system (by my preference) if this is the only reason to consider it. IMO.

(But then I'm an "If it works, it works" kind of person. Can't speak for anyone else's motivations and desires.)


[1] I just did this, at first. No Fort, no Adventurer, and it was long after I played those two before I got into the Legends bit.