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Author Topic: SHADOW EMPIRE: Procedural Sci-fi 4x wargame - Kaiju Warning  (Read 82961 times)

Karlito

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #90 on: June 11, 2020, 08:38:02 am »

Anyone else is swimming in political points? The game makes it out like its supposed to be a scarce resource, but there doesn't seem to be much to spend it on.

Political Points production is something you have a high degree of control over, but yeah, I often find myself with a healthy surplus. Throttle down the Supreme Command council budget and spend more on research.
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Yoink

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #91 on: June 11, 2020, 09:03:09 am »

Fuggit, I just bought it. Downloading now.   
Not sure exactly when I'll try it out, it would obviously be best to set aside enough time to go on an all-night, Monster-fuelled gaming binge sink my teeth into it and see what all the fuss is about.   
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E. Albright

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #92 on: June 11, 2020, 10:31:37 am »

Fooled around with Cerebus planets last night. If you can get an otherwise-goldilocks one of those with an age of 3-4bi (which appears to be the upper limit on them), they're a good source of water-peroxide and sulferic acid lifeforms as opposed to water-based ones. Don't expect much colonization, though - the best I saw was 69mi, and that was on a large Cerebus.

(The above suggests that anyone looking for desert planets with life should probably similarly aim for almost-goldilocks.)
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Trolldefender99

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #93 on: June 11, 2020, 02:41:09 pm »

Fooled around with Cerebus planets last night. If you can get an otherwise-goldilocks one of those with an age of 3-4bi (which appears to be the upper limit on them), they're a good source of water-peroxide and sulferic acid lifeforms as opposed to water-based ones. Don't expect much colonization, though - the best I saw was 69mi, and that was on a large Cerebus.

(The above suggests that anyone looking for desert planets with life should probably similarly aim for almost-goldilocks.)

Cerebus is actually really easy to get life. Its one reason was getting frustrated with Seth yesterday, but I think its actually a balance issue in the generation. I don't see how Cerebus can have life easier than Seth. My last cerebus game had seas of magma and rivers of magma everywhere, but supported as much life as giant lizard-like things with "complex lifeforms with skeleton body structure" and the planet looked like a jungle lol.

Cerebus is actually the best non-earthlike planet (medusa/siwa) to generate alien life and has the most dynamic planet generation. It has by far the most variety besides the two earth-like ones. One time it even had meadows of flowers that generated on the world.
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Xardalas

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #94 on: June 11, 2020, 04:06:50 pm »

Oh man, I am getting my ass utterly handed to me by this minor regime. I have no idea how they did it, but they have somehow managed to get their hands on like 90 walkers by turn ten. I realllllllly regret declaring war now.
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Dostoevsky

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #95 on: June 11, 2020, 04:14:21 pm »

There is one type of minor regime that's actually a surviving AI enclave. To quote the manual, "this can be a very tough foe to face early in the game (if many Sentinels survive). However, due to their programming they usually only become aggressive once you reach Tech Level 4." So, uh, yeah.

Also be aware that if they take cities/settlements, they purge all humans. And no diplomacy, so no chance of trying for peace.
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Trolldefender99

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #96 on: June 11, 2020, 04:43:45 pm »

Got a rather good Siwa world. Before apocalypse it generated 3 billion people, and the world put me super close to the edge of the map in an actual rather defensive area. Lake on one side, mountains on the other. Though there is a city at the very edge of the map belonging to a minor regime. Been quite a long war to take the city, since they have quite a lot of troops.
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Il Palazzo

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #97 on: June 11, 2020, 04:59:42 pm »

What's the range of OHQs, anyone knows?
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EuchreJack

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #98 on: June 11, 2020, 05:21:11 pm »

I actually can't see it mentioned anywhere, either in the manual or in-game.

My rule of thumb is 2 hexes.  Maybe I read that somewhere in the tutorial bits, but it seems to work.

Urist McScoopbeard

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #99 on: June 11, 2020, 05:44:00 pm »

yknow I never thought I'd say this but the early game pacing is actually too fast lol, if in an even remotely open area you get SWARMED, the AI just pulls armies outta its butt.
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EuchreJack

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #100 on: June 11, 2020, 07:03:23 pm »

Well, the player can certainly do the same.  As I understand, the player can recruit about 5% of their people per turn, and in most playthroughs the player is just shy of the 100,000 necessary to upgrade to City Level 4.  90,000 people times 5% means about 4,500 new recruits, or an whole Brigade every turn or so (until you drain your pops).

So just start recruiting armies outta your butt if you're getting swarmed.  The MG brigade is perfect for this task: They're highly effective on defense, so even the greens will slaughter droves of enemies.

Also, most minors have a live-and-let live philosophy.  I originally though Raiders were evil and I needed to go to war with them.  I was wrong: In fact I've never had problems with Raiders.  They always try their best to become my best-est buddies.  Makes sense when you think about it: Raiders survive by extracting resources from those weaker than themselves, and are usually weaker than the player by the time that diplomacy starts.  So by their own cultural norms, they should be subservient to the player.  They basically assume that the only reason you don't just take everything they have, which would be perfectly proper by their code of conduct, is that you have more important things to do and thus allow them to rule in your name.

Protip: Fuck slavers.  You can't afford to keep them happy by constantly buying slaves, and every time you do, they get stronger by using your credits to build up their army.  So if you get a slaver demand, say "NO", then prepare to fight their swarms.  It'll only be worse later...

Shooer

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #101 on: June 11, 2020, 07:32:37 pm »

yknow I never thought I'd say this but the early game pacing is actually too fast lol, if in an even remotely open area you get SWARMED, the AI just pulls armies outta its butt.
Last 3 games I've been on middle sized maps that generated low population during colonization and post apoc.  Talking less than 3 mil across the planet.  Very large zones, very large non-aligned zones.  Lots of empty space to expand and explore.

I usually have 2-3 neighbors right away, and any non-friendly farmer can be handled one at a time after waiting to get the first machine-gun armed battalion army out.  Back up the troops with a few independent recon buggy battalions to scout/flank (fuel permitting) and 1-2 independent motorized arty (metal/ammunition permitting) to reduce enemy readiness. 

Current game I went with a Regiment sized independent arty unit and it was to much.  180 guns RUINED the religious fanatic's city.  Really wanted to take all of it intact, but most buildings survived with over 97% damage after the troops were sent in.  Felt bad watching that light industry melt in the initial barrage, but our total population went up 50% with the capture of that zone.  Time to betray the next farmer.

Once I secure my immediate threats and get the economy going I then focus on expanding the army.  Currently wished I had more pop and I could have the manpower to run a bio-fuel-refinery III, so my tank and APC army will have to be smaller than planned.

Oh well, archives gave me advanced gauss small arms and 50MT nuclear missiles.  The gauss is great for now, will be awhile before I can deploy the nukes.  Just ignore the thousands we are making selling food and then buying to stockpile radioactives.
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Vivalas

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #102 on: June 11, 2020, 08:49:52 pm »

Huh, reading this thread I've had a far different experience than everyone else here, and that's why I'm starting to love this game, it's just so diverse it seems in what can happen and what a playthrough is like.

Slow and steady expansion from a huge lake on a water-restricted world, so I made hella cash just selling water to traders. The units, organizations, and logistics are really immersive, and all the little feats too you can add to the units adds character and flavor to them that I start to remember them by.

PP was very abundant early on but once I started needing more leaders for expansion (governors) and generals and diplomacy strategems for convincing the majors not to gank me, it started draining really fast.

Like that you can make bad things purposely happen to your empire for fate points. Kinda sad to hear that the more advanced archive strategms are being removed. Right now I'm sitting on a mobile chemical launcher unit that I really want to buy, and don't think I would have gotten it in the newer versions.

And raiders are indeed pretty chill. I've had more trouble with nomads actually who seem to be everywhere that has good resources. Nothing my motorized and mechanized rifle brigades can't handle :)

I actually befriended a raider early on without realizing it, and balanced the sovreignty of my country with keeping good relations of them, and I actually really like the diplomatic game in SE. Got a client state eventually out of that raider minor. Have two majors on my border now, one is apparently theological dudes who I can't convince to not be hostile to me no matter how much relation I give them, which I assume only delays their attack, and someone to my north with the BLACKMAIL mood who tried to blackmail me and failed... and those two are at war with each other so right now I'm just stockpiling and getting armies built on both borders so that I can swoop in once they're both exhausted from their war and run down their forces...

As for minors, they seem pretty weak once you get past initial early game, as long as you avoid the AI sentinel ones. Generally I would avoid invading nomads though unless they have good resources in their lands, since they don't seem to have large cities, or any cities at all really. I had a protracted war with a nomad faction early on that didn't get me much other than a vast expanse of land and a new border with a major, and my second war with a farming minor ended almost instantly once I capped their capital in the first turn because it was the first part of their nation I explored, and got a whole city that was almost the size of my capital.

I do like the way fog of war works, in that you can't really see the definite borders of nations you encounter, since the game just assumes they extend out infinitely from you until you explore them. Placing spies in nations you fight really helps clear up their fog of war and find their cities.
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Karlito

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #103 on: June 11, 2020, 10:15:51 pm »

yknow I never thought I'd say this but the early game pacing is actually too fast lol, if in an even remotely open area you get SWARMED, the AI just pulls armies outta its butt.

I've been playing on slow speed, and the pacing feels real good.
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Il Palazzo

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Re: SHADOW EMPIRE: Sci-fi 4x wargame on a procedurally generated world
« Reply #104 on: June 12, 2020, 12:25:36 pm »

Jesus, is this obscure. Kinda reminds me of Iron Seed, what with all that trying to figure out what means what and what works how.

Speaking of which, anyone managed to piece together what makes what kind of farming possible? I want to eat alien food, but there's always a something...

If only there was an indicator that yes/no you will/won't be able to do open farming on this planet. Or at least if the manual and the game used consistent labelling for various conditions, and kept those all in one place with unambiguous descriptors. (e.g. is 'reduced' value nutrition level 1 or 2? do you need at least shrubs to farm local life? when is a hex too arid?)
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