Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Lurker Z]

16th of Timber

I have made it to the eastern forests of my homeland, all alone. I've made my case to the druid and he seems willing to see if Cacame could help with this worldly blight. Winter is upon us soon, and there will be much work that needs to be done. Besides that, I must rest my ankle. It may be a long time before I can go out in the world again, because I'll need time to garner support for my cause. Despite all the evils of the world, I'm sure that the turn of the millenium will be a shining age of peace and prosperity.

Now... Where do I begin?

That was bitter-sweet. On the one hand, he survived. On the other, he lost all his companions, most permanently, one to cowardice and low-key betrayal. On the other, he met Lonelythrall, which is awesome. Is the fort you found a player one killed by a single blighted thrall? Damn, you were lucky he didn't infect you.

Also, surprisingly positive attitude considering the discussion going on in this thread and the 300 elves left of the original near-2000. I do wonder what happened, I don't believe it's related to the "sites not being logged anymore", I think it's the opposite, just like the adventurers wandering through Omon Obin erased the abstract population, the same is happening here.

That’s good news. Means he hasn’t died yet. He’s so fragile. I worry about him…

My theory is that his state is... let's go with "fluctuating". Have you tried unretiring him in a test save? My theory is he'll be back either to yellow on all limbs or to whatever state you left him in adventure mode.

A reality where at best three elves live in each of their sites, or worse, many remain completely empty, certainly doesn't feel like days of glory, haha. Elves're starting to look like fairy tale beings if ya'ask me.

They're keeping their sites and their tenuous control over the cradle of their civilization, the north-east part of the world. That's more that you can say for, say, Dur Badu, who's lost all its sites to megabeasts and those sites were absorbed peacefully by Omon Obin, practically killed the civilization.

Speaking of Dur Badu, another indication that it's truly dead is that you can't have a human adventurer from there. I wonder if you, though it looks like you couldn't have one at the end of the first turn, either. Hm, I might experiment, I can use DFHack to give characters different civilizations than their original, I wonder if that can respark a civ, or going to one of their sites and mounting an insurrection in favor of an old dead civ's group...

Just waiting for someone to notice he is ageless.

"We've had this king for a while, isn't that weird?"
"Like no one's killed him yet?"
"No no, like he's older than all the other kings."
"Because no one k-"
"NO, I think he might be ageless or something."
"Wait I thought all lobsters were ageless!"
"...He's a scorpion man."
"What's a scorpion if not a land lobster?"

Reminder that Bralbaard was called as King as an intelligent undead by the civilization from which the greatest necromancer in the world rose. Though that makes me wonder how many know their King was undead, Kikrost certainly did by the letter I "transcribed", but then again Kikrost was positively fascinated by immortality himself and sought it in all forms.

My point is if anyone would even care, also it's a rump state with 79 goblins and no humans, now that I look at it all congregated in what appears to be the capital Fedemesme and the goblins attract more goblins to settle there. There goes my theory that as long a civ survive, its original race will repopulate its sites, looks like the surviving race in a civilization is going to rule it forever, or at least until some takes some drastic measures. Maybe using the adventurer start points to start a rival race breeding population?

It might be a while before he moves again. Just waiting for someone to notice he is ageless.

Does anyone care about ageless after World Activation? From what I know, if you time it right in World Generation and stop it before chosen necromancers are discovered, they'll remain part of their civ until the end of time (unless something unforseen happens, like they're killed, imprisoned, their civ is destroyed etc.)

Ah i see that Beksur has finally croaked. Could be a free title there, not sure it works like that but retiring at one of their sites might make you a member and thus instantly jump the hoops to lawgiver. Additionally assuming identity might do that too.

Interesting theories. I was thinking of giving a char or more the Dur Badu civilization ID via DF Hack so they'd put on an insurrection.

[AvolitionBrit]

A civilization of gremlins seems viable.

[kesperan]

That’s good news. Means he hasn’t died yet. He’s so fragile. I worry about him…

My theory is that his state is... let's go with "fluctuating". Have you tried unretiring him in a test save? My theory is he'll be back either to yellow on all limbs or to whatever state you left him in adventure mode.

Well, it’s all a bit unpredictable and to be honest there’s 9 other players to have their turns before I’m up again, even if I did want to wheel out Moldath again. We could potentially be in the 920s by then. We will see what happens!

Hopefully he will just chill out as Broker and nobody will try to kill him in the meantime…

[Unraveller]

Truly Kasperan, the waiting is the hardest part. I'm kicking myself for not getting back on the turn list until after I actually finished Amala's write-up. Haha.

But the waiting isn't a loss, I truly do love reading everything and deep diving into this one particular world with you all. For me, it's such an incredibly compelling way to experience Dwarf Fortress, and I daresay this is the only place to get it. In this form at least.

I'm hoping the tale I wish to tell will still be viable by then, but that'll only be if Omon Obin is still plagued with the blight by then. Which I suppose isn't too unlikely, unless someone takes one of the war-god adventures and cleans up the world. Which is similarly not too unlikely, hehehe.

[tonnot98]

But the waiting isn't a loss, I truly do love reading everything and deep diving into this one particular world with you all. For me, it's such an incredibly compelling way to experience Dwarf Fortress, and I daresay this is the only place to get it. In this form at least.

Hear hear! Almost 200 years of shared history between so many people. Whether a character lived for a day or a fortress survived a decade, we've all added to the annals of history together. I can only hope that some truly amazing adventure mode succession game ideas will follow the future arcs of Dwarf Fortress. Imagine what kind of shenanigans we could get up to with a more robust magic system? Or if we could truly lead a nation?

[Unraveller]

I know the majority likely only care for Fortress mode, but I do hope that doesn't keep Toady from fleshing out more adv mode mechanics in the future. But of course, the further we go on the more and more blended these two things become.

I see WonderPsycho hasn't been on in a couple weeks, hopefully they check in soon!

[AvolitionBrit]

Last active 17th of March, doesnt look good.

[Bralbaard]

I know the majority likely only care for Fortress mode, but I do hope that doesn't keep Toady from fleshing out more adv mode mechanics in the future. But of course, the further we go on the more and more blended these two things become.

There was a discussion on the development roadmap that is cause for concern, apparently adventure mode may very well not make it into the first steam release. emphasis in the post below is mine.

Steam Community Update 23 February 2022: Release Roadmap
https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/975370/view/3099043827445055732

Hello!

Work has now progressed to the point that we feel like we can share a plan for the next several months of development, all the way up to the release. It has been a long road of course, and I'm sorry it has taken so much time to get to this point, but as it turns out there was an awful lot of stuff to do ha ha. And there's still quite a bit left to go.

We need to maintain some flexibility to react to feedback or emerging circumstances, so the following can't be set in stone. But hopefully it offers something of an idea about what's up. I know there are various levels of patience out there. All we can do is keep at it and try to plan the next steps carefully.

Here's the rough roadmap:

1. Finish the menus that haven't been upgraded yet. These include the graphics and layout for justice, health, diplomacy, and hauling. These aren't small tasks; each will take weeks. I'll also be working with Jacob during this period on the sprites we need to update throughout the project. He submitted the new weapons recently, for instance, and I also got a new batch of music from the composer. It's important to get these things incorporated in a timely fashion so everybody can keep working.

2. As the menus are finished, and the graphics updates are completed, we'll move on to some important interface and usability improvements (tooltips everywhere, Xs to close windows, hotkey support, etc). Some of these can be done fairly quickly, but a few are chunky additions, and there are lots of them to do. After this part is done, the game should be much easier to get into. At the same time, we'll also be continuing to add graphics (flows, the ocean and beach, some more shadows, etc.)

3. All this time, of course, we've been fixing old bugs and making new bugs and fixing them, and here we'll need to focus and spend some quality time with them, so that we have as smooth a launch as possible.

4. We're not sure what level of Steam Workshop will be needed for modding support, and it needs investigation.

5. The old ASCII version has other game modes - Adventure mode, Legends mode, and Arena mode. We've made significant progress on Legends mode, but we haven't done anything with Adventure mode and Arena mode yet. We also have the Classic ASCII mode to support, and we are also working on Mac and Linux builds.

6. There's the matter of Steam achievements and the other various Steam features. We'd like to support whatever people are into here, eventually.

When we finish the first three points, we'll have the playable fort game on Windows. The path ahead is now shorter than the path behind, and looking at the amount of graphics left to produce and the amount of menus to update, it looks like our earliest possible launch date would be in the fall. Many of the things from #5 or #6 will delay the launch significantly, and this leads to some very hard questions indeed! I know most of you want us to launch the game as soon as it is feasible, so we've been thinking about what it might look like to do some of #5 or #6 post-launch.

We'd been hoping to have more of these later items done faster, of course, but a few things happened. Well, 2020 and 2021 happened, ha ha. Also, my original plan for how Classic mode might be implemented has only partially panned out. I made an ASCII friendly interface layer, which'll be a great help, but I underestimated how long it would take to retool all of the smaller clickable buttons into an ASCII-friendly state. A few menus will need to be redone from scratch, and my current thinking is that doing ASCII versions of the menus alone would take a few months. I'd mostly been accounting for keeping and adapting the ASCII glyphs we already had in place, with some alterations to support for example the ability to see multiple Z levels, but the menus have changed so much it's now a much larger project. The hard question then is do we want to delay the initial release to do this? Or launch, and then do the free update after.

Adventure mode is straightforward in its way. I don't expect it'll have many real development gotchas, but it does have dozens of menus, some of them quite complex. So similarly, that'll be months of work to complete. It's an important part of the game and has figured into some of the most well-known DF community stories, but it's also separate enough from Fortress mode that we can conceive of letting people get their hands on fort mode first. Again, delay or launch?

We'll be pondering this and considering feedback. We'll eventually get to everything; it's just a matter of the best order to do things, with a different right answer for different players, frustratingly enough! I'm grateful for how patient people have been in general, especially with everything going on, and thankful for the support we've gotten from the community and Kitfox as we try to get this initial release together.

We'll continue to keep you posted with regular news updates.

-Tarn

That would mean we may very well be stuck with this world for several years before we can move to a DF version with new adventure mode mechanics and content. I like how Toady does acknowledge the existence of adventure mode succession games and their importance though  .
Also I'm still enjoying myself here in Orid Xem, imagine what it could be in say, two years time..

[AvolitionBrit]

Yeah, thats a shame as it is a big part of the game but im sure it will get there. Plus like you said we still have Orid Xem, honestly would be cool to see if this world can make it another two years. So much story telling potential. Also if wonder is still a no show, looks like your up Bralbaard. Interested to see what character or characters you create.

[Bralbaard]

I won't be able to pick it up before monday, so let's give Wonderpsycho a few more days to respond.

[kesperan]

I like how Toady does acknowledge the existence of adventure mode succession games and their importance though 

I am pretty sure we are the only adventure mode succession game in the Hall of Legends? Well, us and Epic Adventure at the Start of Time, which is pretty cool. It does make me grin to think of Toady reading the exploits of our adventurers!

[Paaaad]

Huh. I was looking at some of the various leaders the world has seen, and I found one Sutar Taxedpuzzle. Dude was Law Giver of Oman Obin from the 5th of Moonstone 779, as well as Sacred Zeal of The Persuasive Faith from the 25th of Malachite 756, to the 17th of Opal 802, when he was killed by a human necro named Erab Boltedgill (His page indicates him being infected by Kosoth, struck down by Galka, and some relationship with Lurker Lockingkingdom (visual). Oddly, no indication of his actually being a necromancer.). Odd thing is the first entry on his page is him getting bitten by Raki the 23rd of Slate 746. The dude became a noble AFTER becoming a weremammoth! Excuse me, but what? I thought people were supposed to run into the wilds after getting turned into a werebeast.

Sutar is also the only leader to have been so cursed, either before or after elevation.

[Unraveller]

Legends Viewer doesn't differentiate the spawns of necromancers like our blighted thralls or intelligent undead. The 'necromancer' that killed Sutar after Galka arrived in Entrancegrapes was a blighted thrall who attained a position of power after being infected.

Despite the infection, they remain citizens of their nations, the whole  'opposed to life' thing only appears to be relevant when loaded in the current game, while they're in the background they seem to act as anyone else. So entering the castle led to the thrall to immediately attack and kill Sutar when it came down some stairs.

Speaking of Sutar, if I had to guess, some of the same logic applies to werebeasts, but rather,  that the only werebeasts that live in the wilds are ones that were created during worldgen. Hence why they remained a member of society. Though that's conjecture.

[Lurker Z]

Sutar has an article on the wiki, by the way. I've wanted to stay on top of Monarchs of official civilizations at least from the beginning of the 8th century forward, so a lot, if not most of them have articles.

Unraveller, that's basically accurate. World Activation, for all its improvement over the 0.34 versions (which didn't have it) still lacks events that exist in World Generation. Werebeasts, even those of worldgen, never rampage anymore after World Activation. Take for example Urwa Nihdesana, exiled prince of the Abowba dynasty. He got infected in worldgen and declared an enemy of Omon Obin, but never rampaged after world activation and died peacefully of old age. Uja too, despite being turned into a vampire and surviving for a few decades like that, has 0 kills and if she had any, they would have been as a directly confrontation with an adventurer of the Museum.

In that same vein, megabeasts stop rampaging, except in Fortress Mode. The things that happen in World Activation are marriages, births, wars and ascensions to noble positions, as well as moving from one place to another to fulfill those noble obligations or of scholars to visit even outside Fortress Mode. I think even entertainment troupes stop their activities, though I may be wrong. Necromancers are not "suspected of not aging" or at least, they're not driven out because of it. One thing that happens, as proven with Uja, is that once a ruler of a group - bar religion - is confronted with being a night creature, they immediately lose their title. Not their religious title, of course. Religions don't care about trifle things like being a necromancer, vampire, werebeast, generic undead etc. In fact, I'm pretty sure in these worlds if a creature would be revealed to a be a world-destroying eldritch abomination like Cthulhu and they'd be part of a religion, the religion would just shrug and say all are welcome anyway. I'm leaning to this being a bug, but whether intended or not, it makes the world a lot more grimdark (and thralls a lot more troublesome as they keep being moved through settlements at their ascension to a noble/religious position).

Yes, sadly, Legends Viewer sees blighted thralls simply as "necromancers". However, it does distinguish necromancer experiments as their own race (example, Hands of Planegifts) and undead as "SECRET_UNDEAD" or something of the sort rather than lumping them with necromancers.


Speaking of royals, finally got around to making an article for Ago, current

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

blighted thrall

Law-Giver of Omon Obin.


The last living dwarf of Datanduthnur, The Iron-Guard, the first player fortress of Orid Xem, Tobul Mistêmâtastdied died in 847 (born 696) of old age. However, there is a blighted one who came back from the dead and even now stalks the capital.

[Maloy]

That sounds like those interesting things we learn from playing a world so very long

I think most worlds you generally stop playing before you can start seeing the "cracks" or all those things that aren't happening now post-generation

This one is fascinating to watch for that reason

I wonder if at some point in the long future this will get even more oriented of player characters fighting each other and such?

If I become a werebeast I'll be sure to rampage for all!