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Author Topic: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread  (Read 110811 times)

Fleeting Frames

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #105 on: May 24, 2020, 10:30:08 pm »

@vjek Well that's a new one

It seems the geography matches, but history differs on my lubuntu gen.

That deep pit having mud-covered treetops is pretty neat as well.

And yeah, that's not really 2nd cavern spire but aallmost there.

Theoretically, one might want to use a world with poles so they can use ice to grind away at the SMR. It seems adding one changes candy spire locations, however.

vjek

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #106 on: May 25, 2020, 04:59:45 pm »

Came across something today I haven't seen before, and wanted to check with everyone else to see if they've seen it.
Single cavern layer world.
Water in the caverns.  A lot of water.
Volcano on the embark.
Candy spire that reaches to 4Z above the top of the cavern.
As in, the candy spire starts in the SMR sea, extends up through the magma, through the first and only cavern, then keeps going another 4Z in normal stone layers.

Have you seen this before?

Fleeting Frames

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #107 on: May 26, 2020, 12:26:21 am »

No, never. In fact, I thought single-cavern worlds spires were limited to ending right above magma sea, with other ones culled due bug.

PatrikLundell

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #108 on: May 26, 2020, 12:57:27 am »

No, never. In fact, I thought single-cavern worlds spires were limited to ending right above magma sea, with other ones culled due bug.
No, spires that reach the single cavern in single cavern worlds are very rare because of the bug: they only appear if they are specified to reach the first cavern which is very rare.

Extending past the designated top cavern is rare: I'm not sure if I've seen it or not.
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vjek

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #109 on: May 26, 2020, 10:29:10 am »

Ok, if you're inclined, this should show that happening, at Z: -1 .
Spoiler: 1cav-candy-4z-above (click to show/hide)

knutor

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #110 on: May 26, 2020, 01:49:27 pm »

I never saw candy in top layer or above. Worldgen must pick that one cavern, to give the player, from the three possible caverns to use, at random, then. Got 3rd one there, congrats.

You guys are positive, layers above cavern, is z'-levels above uppermost open cavern spaces, and lowermost of next? Or is it the layers "of" cavern, above bottom-most open cavern z-level, to top of that caverns possible open space, based on cave density and corridor clutter settings. I am just curious, as sometimes, Ill get HUGE spreads between caverns without changing a parameter.

This joyous, anti-stress(all civ brainwashed ideal) embark in my perfectworld embark, has two unique underground elements. A 20x20 roughly pit between cavern 1 and cavern 2. A large rat lair below cavern 2 into a reclusive, shutoff by treetrunks, cavern 3 corner, with a large active edge gap feeding nastys into the caves. Not sure what to do with cave with rat, its now producing gremlins. Put my back door leading into fort from topside, across pit, with a 3 exit goblin grinder. Lost two miners building it, afraid I set pressure plates to civ.

The nincompoop miners down in cavern 3 keep generating cave-ins. Unlike when digging in 1.

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PatrikLundell

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #111 on: May 27, 2020, 02:08:21 am »

Yes, the "above layer" parameters indicate to DF how much space there should be in between the top of one "layer" (overloaded term, unfortunately), and then next one. For some reason leaving them at the default seems to result in a much larger spread than setting them to something else, but that's just my impression, not something that's been investigated rigorously.

It can be noted that the parameters operate on a world tile basis, so if your embark spans areas that are governed by different world tiles you can get huge differences in height, and terrain varying much in height also seems to play games with both the vertical extent of caverns and the distance between them.

Losing miners to cave-ins is usually caused by the overseer not being sufficiently careful with the orders given. In particular, a very precise dig order to avoid accidents can only be upheld if there is only a single miner doing the job (disabling mining on others, or using burrows to keep the others from that area), as the order in which orders are accepted isn't the same as the order in which they are performed, due to travel time and job abandonment due to harvesting (there is also a rare priority inversion bug that can cause a dorf standing on a prio 1 tile that's adjacent to a prio 2 tile to dig out the prio 2 tile without moving, rather than move to dig out the prio 1 tile first, then move again).

Edit: vjek's embark shows that what I thought I knew about spires wasn't (fully?) correct. This spire is specified to reach cavern 3 rather than 1, and shouldn't appear at all according to what I thought I knew.
« Last Edit: May 27, 2020, 03:32:35 am by PatrikLundell »
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vjek

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #112 on: May 27, 2020, 11:18:55 am »

It was certainly a surprise to me, as well.  I'm not sure the reason or cause, but my first thought was... if we could find a place like that and stretch the caverns (in the past I think it was figured out how to stretch caverns to 'absurdly tall') then... well.. there's some potential.  :o 8)

PatrikLundell

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #113 on: May 27, 2020, 11:52:55 am »

It was certainly a surprise to me, as well.  I'm not sure the reason or cause, but my first thought was... if we could find a place like that and stretch the caverns (in the past I think it was figured out how to stretch caverns to 'absurdly tall') then... well.. there's some potential.  :o 8)
I don't see why you can't just go with what's well known, i.e. levels above layer. If a spire reaches any cavern at all, extending the layers below that cavern extends the spire, so with a standard 3 cavern world and a spire reaching cavern 1 (can be done with hacking), extending any or all the distances in between the magma sea and the first cavern gives you a huge amount of spire to munch on. I guess you can also try to warp the world so the caverns themselves are 50 levels high, but that means it's a pain to secure those caverns by walling the edges off.

The extension above the top cavern is curious from a mechanics perspective, but not particularly significant from a game play one, I think.
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knutor

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #114 on: May 28, 2020, 01:20:01 am »

Whelp, there is that. My elongated 129x65 world, shows me no Points of Interest, out beyond 65. in c worldview. The caves are there to explore, even the civs icons, but no tile outline, to consult on the legend. So no places to raid, cept friendlies, nearby. Cannot send messenger out to fleshout their race and alignment. Oddly, way over there is where the evil region and goblins setup. I maybe playing a really boring perfectworld, if goblins cannot reach my fort. I got a tower, elves, humans, and slinkers. Is this how 257 large worldgens are? My system cannot do those out to mature dragon years, 1000+.
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UselessMcMiner

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #115 on: May 31, 2020, 10:01:38 am »

Is it possible to generate a world where the chances of the circus coming to town is at its maximum possible chance? Do you need to set the history to a long time and add a bunch of mountains (so dwarves generate more)? Is it possible to make sure only dwarves generate on the map?
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vjek

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #116 on: May 31, 2020, 10:31:42 am »

Is it possible to generate a world where the chances of the circus coming to town is at its maximum possible chance? Do you need to set the history to a long time and add a bunch of mountains (so dwarves generate more)? Is it possible to make sure only dwarves generate on the map?
You can certainly make a dwarf-only map.  Just ensure there is only 0-9 rain, and use 299-301 elevation, and set demon count to one.
If you have demon count at 2+, you'll get goblins, but at 1, you won't.  Elves and/or Humans need rain to be 10+.
Then you can set your number of civs to however many dwarven civs you want.
Note that the consequence of a demon count of 1 is that the material the first demons are made out of is hardcoded to not be butcherable.  They'll be made of salt, snow, fire, brine, sleet, or some other similarly annoying material. :)  As far as I've seen, there is no way around this and no conditions will alter it.
There are also ways to have worlds that use savagery and evil to prevent human/elf civ placement, so if you want to go that route, let me know.

knutor

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #117 on: May 31, 2020, 11:18:59 am »

In an ideal worldgen with all 5 types, # of civ, the # the player sets should be divisible by 5. The civs will always spread out 1 hu, 1 go, 1dw, 1 ko, 1 ef, and then 10, for 2,2,2,2,2. When less conditions like vjek mentioned are met, I suppose divisible by 4, 3, 2 etc. should be picked.

Kobolds req Mtn or Nonmtn caves. You'll wanna null caves to get rid of Kobolds. Not sure how this effects outlaw dwarfs and crime/justice, as they setup shop in those places, too.

The problem with dorf only worlds is then you lose the foreign food, armor & wpn features. No daggers, no blowguns,  no masks, no tree drama and exotic pet trade, no human seafood and longshank monster slayers, etc. Foreign items, like, facemasks, thongs/loincloths(legs and feet are optional), and high molar mass whips are, or were very powerful and game breaking. Dunno, now. This may no longer be true, as of musical instrument patch, which seemed to shuffle foreign and normal recipes about some.

Very long histories cease to be relavent after 1000yrs of titans, for me. After titans are gone, world historic figures blossom from those 5 types. Also you'll get lots more multi 'named' mega, semimegabeasts, and savage(giant variants). Dont overlook that giant fly, he is a giant's Giant. Ever pull up his raws? Holy cow.

Which, lotsa semi's is something the hardcore(no cheaters)seem to enjoy, in their worlgens, as semimegabeasts, unlike their big cuz fullmegas and titans, can be trapped and bread in captivity for truly awful things. Like a Rancor pen, in Star Wars, but with Rancor breeding. Imagine your own maze/moat, with a family of high strength and disease retardent Minotaurs to unleash on the an uninvited guest, pathing in from embark edge. When they turn back on you, there is your field of metal traps to protect you.
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"I don't often drink Mead, but when I do... I prefer Dee Eef's.  -The most interesting Dwarf in the World.  Stay thirsty, my friend.
Shark Dentistry, looking in the Raws.

UselessMcMiner

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #118 on: May 31, 2020, 01:38:50 pm »

So I tried to make a world following Vjek's instructions, but instead of anything happening, a horde of goblins randomly appeared and killed everyone? They weren't lead by a demon so I'm confused. Is it because theres only one species of demon alive and it isnt intelligent?
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The scouts have been fighting a giant capuchin for the past month now. They still haven't killed it.

Obsidian 1053

The Sentries are still fighting the capuchin. For two monthes they have done nothing but punch this monkey.

vjek

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Re: DF v0.47.01+ Worldgen Cookbook Thread
« Reply #119 on: May 31, 2020, 01:50:11 pm »

Post your worldgen, UselessMcMiner, and we'll see where things are.  :D

EDIT: Here's an example world with 1 type of demon, and 100 dwarven civs.
If you change the demon types to 2, you'll see some Goblin civs appear.
Spoiler: no-gobbos (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: May 31, 2020, 04:11:30 pm by vjek »
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