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[Naturegirl1999]

Sorry for the double post.

I just got my first shot of SinoPharm, it was pretty quick actually, and 迄今 I have not any adverse symptoms...

I'll keep you posted guys.

is SinoPharm a new one? I only here of J&J, Moderna, and Physer/Phyzer(not sure how it’s spelt) also what do the symbols mean? I’ll bold the ones I’m confused about since I can’t ty[e them

[Ziusudra]

SinoPharm is China's vaccine and 迄今 means "so far".

(Well, technically SinoPharm is the company that makes the vaccine.)

[Starver]

Good health to you both, and don't fight over Mongolia!


(

@NG: The joke was that LB's wife has been indoctrinated injected by a Russian product, then LB was brainwashed by received the Chinese one.  The symbols are Hanzi (Chinese language glyphs, rather than the Pinyin 'romanised' alphabetic version) perhaps carefully researched. Or from something trivially plugged into Google Translate...

Sinopharm (one or other of two similar extant vaccines named for its developing company) is basically China's gift to 'the global South' (pretty much literally, check the maps on where it is authorised for use!), as well as for use in its home country, just as Sputnik is Russia's. It is also a deactivated-virus shot (Russia is an Adenovirus 'spike-holder') which in theory make it very good at granting resistance, but hopefully is being done right.

The US has Pfizer (that's how you spell it), J&J and Moderna (and others?) but either hasn't been too keen on or was never offered the 2nd-World Vaccines, which are instead going to countries like LB's (the 1st-World ones seem to be being hogged by their home nations and friends in the Global North ('the West', in other words, only slightly more inaccurately).

And, with that, I also hope that LB has no trouble getting the Sinopharm/Sputnik doses taken into proper account in his intended future Canadian adventure, as described in another thread... In fact, all the best for that in general, as I really didn't want to post such a trivial message there just for the sake of PTWing.

)

[Starver]

(For authorisation maps, which I meant to link, see here, or the lower-coverage (but still Venezualan-involving) Sinopharm-WIBP alternative later on in that page, and every other authorised product if you care to stare at map-porn or text search for your own country(/any other territory of interest) in the lists. In both cases Venezuala only gives "Emergency Authorisations" for their use  but then the places that Fully Authorised probably fast-tracked, beyond even the Emergency fast-tracking, at uncommon speed (for every vaccine given!) and the safety window is probably more or less opened by exactly the same amount in each case. The rest is just amounts of burocratic supporting paperwork bothered to be done so far.)

[Naturegirl1999]

What exact;y happens with a deactivated virus? Is it the capsid without the nucleic acids? Hollowed out?

[LordBaal]

My rudimentary knowledge point to yes, they are the protein spikes? (that's the term?) the virus uses to get a hold to the cells without the actual device behind, so the immune system take their picture and put it on the "not allowed here" section besides the cashier.

[ChairmanPoo]

What exact;y happens with a deactivated virus? Is it the capsid without the nucleic acids? Hollowed out?

It depends on how you deactivate it.

[Starver]

I mistyped, it's inactivated (barely a smidgen of meaning difference between the two words), and it's cultivated virus (or other pathogen, for non-viral diseases) that is somehow 'killed' to be harmless. (In contrast with 'Live' which is weakened/attenuated.)

They can be 'whole virus' (though killed[1], perhaps by heat treatment or chemicals - I haven't checked what for the Sinopharm(s)) or 'split virus' where detergents actually fragment it to present as much (dismembered) virus-'body' to the immune system as possible. Either way, you'll get 'spike' resistance (natively) but probably loads of other responses that are useful.

Purify/concentrate the more useful components of a Split Virus soup and you get a 'subunit vaccine' (there are some of these in the fight against Covid, but not widely accepted). Spikes are sure to be in the mix, I imagine. I suppose you could even painstakingly construct such fragments outwith any original virus, but not sure this has been used for any of these "potentially millions of doses" treatments, as there's a lot of scaling issues.

Because anything not totally 'Live' is harder to discover as a Pathogen(-fragment) Of Interest, they tend to add further stuff to 'irritate' the immune system/wave and shout "Hey, look at us! We're invaders! Learn to fear us! *Ouch*"... This has been (minute amounts of) mercury, but it's probably certainly something else these days. Not a heavy metal, even..?


The Sputnik, as with my own Oxford/AZ, uses a modified Adenovirus (chimp for AZ, not sure about Sputnik) which is non-replicating but contains "make bits of Covid" instructions that it can push into cells, let the cells make the bits and then present them to the immune system as per a concentrated split-soup (or nearly so) but more controllable once they have the AdV down pat. One disadvantage is that many people have adenovirus-exposure already so might be jumped on a little too quickly. (That my fever kicked in after several hours might indicate it was response to the message, as finally read out, not the initial messenger. Based only on guesses, though.) What they (hope to) produce for immune-training will vary, but probably include spikes as priority. I'm not sure what stops the instructions being followed (once started) but must be related to standard DNA/(m|t)RNA shuffling. (It never gets into the genome, just mingles with the transferred instructions that came from there... I don't know as much about this as I should, but there must be a time-out/half-life to moderate any internally-slurved instruction not regularly given a repeated expression.)


Then DNA/RNA capsid vaccines do the same sort of thing as above but with a lipid-monolayer 'nanoparticle' container tailored to deliver just the blueprints into target cells, for them to distribute, without any virus in any traditional sense. Pfizer codes I think just for the spikes, which the body happily makes so long as (I think) they are still intact in the cell's endosomic organelles they get sucked into to start the work (again, never gets near your genes).


I'm sure there's more to know about each, but that's a less-than-summarised summary mostly from memory/extrapolation. Someone will doubtless be along to correct my schoolboy errors.




[1] A tricky word to use for a virus, that is not ever fully 'alive', but it seems to be the best to use.

[Naturegirl1999]

Hanks. So, inactive viruses are somehow made unable to replicate, does the heat denature the nucleic acids rendering it unable to reproduce? Does it damage the capsule somehow?

[Starver]

I suspect that might be the ideal. But it'll be potentially different in each developed method. Amongst the handful of Covid vaccines that do that and all the Flu vaccines that have been tried-and-tested in the past, etc, etc.

(That or laser-sharp severing/smothering of just the undesirable replicative genetic code. Which is something they might do to get the likes of ChAdOx1 used in the AZ.)

But I'm not as read up on who-does-what enough to be an authority on this. Read the above as a half-educated guess. It takes a lot more to be an immunologist than remembering scraps of info and tying them together with 'logic' that has never been applied practically. (It's getting on to 40 years since I formally was taught any biology, even, and I always prefered physics/chemistry at the time. Mostly I hated the incessant drawing, I suppose.)

[Naturegirl1999]

Oh yes, I remember one of my assignments for Biology was to draw a diagram of photosynthesis

[None]

ChAdOx1

this sounds like some eleven year old edgelord's runescape account name

[Starver]

ChAdOx1

this sounds like some eleven year old edgelord's runescape account name

[xxx~=ChAdOx1=~xxx………] This username is already taken!

[dragdeler]

a

[martinuzz]

Speaking of long Covid, a recent (as of yet not peer reviewed) UK studies shows that 1 out of 4 teenagers who have had corona, still had health issues 3 months afterwards. These include but are not limited to shortness of breath, fatigue and concentration loss.

So kiddos, don't think "meh, I'm young and strong, covid will not hurt me". You're wrong. Get vaccinated.