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Author Topic: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Strategy Phase 10  (Read 42495 times)

Kashyyk

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #570 on: September 05, 2020, 12:50:20 pm »

Quote from: Fragbox
Uruk Warlords (3): MoP, Flazeo25, Kashyyk
Spike (1): Kashyyk
Frag Dens (1): MoP
Pests Blight (1): Flazo25
Hell-Rats: (1) TricMagic
Magic Arrow: (1) TricMagic

I realised I never voted. So, I figure I should make absolutely no difference to the proceedings.
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Rockeater

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #571 on: September 05, 2020, 12:53:02 pm »


Quote from: Fragbox
Uruk Warlords (3): MoP, Flazeo25, Kashyyk
Spike (1): Kashyyk
Frag Dens (2): MoP, Rockeater
Pests Blight (1): Flazo25
Hell-Rats: (2) TricMagic, Rockeater
Magic Arrow: (1) TricMagic

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Damnit people, this is why I said to keep the truce. Because now everyone's ganging up on the cats.
Also, don't forget to contact your local Eldritch Being(s), so that they can help with our mission to destroy the universe.

TricMagic

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #572 on: September 07, 2020, 10:14:53 am »

Quote from: Magbox
Uruk Warlords (3): MoP, Flazeo25, Kashyyk
Spike (1): Kashyyk
Frag Dens (2): MoP, Rockeater
Pests Blight (1): Flazo25
Hell-Rats: (2) TricMagic, Rockeater
Magic Arrow: ()
Infernal Missile: (1) TricMagic

This is the best I can do since Magic Arrow doesn't solve the problem I want solved, though elemental does..


Infernal Missile
While ordinarily Magical Missile is just unreformed magic or evil, we instead learned to shape it, refine it if you will into more elemental form. This refinement allowed us to infuse it with a fire property, when launched it was shown to leave burn marks on targets, as well as potential to catch fire at times. It can burn and ignite through objects and people given the chance, making it useful for barrage attacks and burning down buildings.

Each Missile is suitable for long range bombardments, having slightly better penetration than before and burning up bits of air where they hit, it's Uruks favorite spell to use when fighting.

Warcasters on other hand are able to shape the Missiles into bigger form, shaped into larger ball given more physical form, they use this to instead hit large area. The use of this method makes repeated use more challenging but will likely be more useful in dealing with groups of good.
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Man of Paper

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #573 on: September 07, 2020, 12:01:55 pm »

Tric, remember when the GM recently said this?

Quote from: From Discord
As for what would make it viable, elemental magic. I did point out issues with elemental magic, yes. It’s almost like there’s no easy way of making MM massively more effective with no drawbacks?? Weird.

Let's not waste a revision on something that is going to, at best, provide a sidegrade as opposed to an upgrade. Infernal Missile is just Manipular Missile with Fire, and that added Fire is going to cost us. Yes, it might make it a Warcaster-strength spell, but it's not worth spending the action on for the sake of having a Warcaster-strength spell. If we want a Fireball, we should design one with benefits, not tweak it out of something else entirely.
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TricMagic

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #574 on: September 07, 2020, 12:26:59 pm »

I don't really believe you want a fireball though. There is no magical attacks for warcasters to cast. As we have Frag, such a spell that doesn't have the same efficiency limit will be useful NOW.

The emphasis is key, as next design phase the battle would have already occurred.

Another revision is to focus on some sort of ice-type spell/item, as it is Winter this combat. But my main point is the fact that we want as much power for combat as possible to keep the advantage and not end up losing it again.



Wagon Project

Using a combination of woodworkers, influence, kidnapping, and straight-up theft in places, we have acquired horses and wagons both. The wagons are the old traverler's style, having a tarp over them to keep things from getting wet and helping with the sun. The main purpose of this project is to be able to ferry troops, supplies, and products across the land. In Battle Lanes this will result in our troops arriving faster and keep supply lines as far out from our home as we need to. In Influence Lanes, smugglers can use them to cross the land, and any thieves will find such caravans well guarded by our own. Though they are not suited to help in the front line, having them will greatly improve logistics.


Quote from: Magbox
Uruk Warlords (3): MoP, Flazeo25, Kashyyk
Spike (1): Kashyyk
Frag Dens (2): MoP, Rockeater
Pests Blight (1): Flazo25
Hell-Rats: (2) TricMagic, Rockeater
Magic Arrow: ()
Infernal Missile: (0)
Wagon Project: (1) TricMagic


« Last Edit: September 07, 2020, 12:51:04 pm by TricMagic »
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #575 on: September 07, 2020, 12:59:50 pm »

Tric, remember when the GM recently said this?

Quote from: From Discord
As for what would make it viable, elemental magic. I did point out issues with elemental magic, yes. It’s almost like there’s no easy way of making MM massively more effective with no drawbacks?? Weird.

Let's not waste a revision on something that is going to, at best, provide a sidegrade as opposed to an upgrade. Infernal Missile is just Manipular Missile with Fire, and that added Fire is going to cost us. Yes, it might make it a Warcaster-strength spell, but it's not worth spending the action on for the sake of having a Warcaster-strength spell. If we want a Fireball, we should design one with benefits, not tweak it out of something else entirely.
To be clear, the issues I mentioned were the following:
Quote
Lobbing around elemental magic could drastically increase the efficiency cap. The problems with this would be that A) for a baseline acolyte, MM is efficient enough, and B) MM is very easy to cast, whereas an elemental variant may be less so.
I did not intend to suggest that an elemental revision to MM is infeasible or pointless, rather that there are upsides and downsides. Also, when I said "baseline acolyte", I meant the ones you started with- your current acolytes are notably stronger, to the point where an elemental revision to MM would result in greater damage output- not massively so, not as much as Warcasters would get, but not an insignificant amount. Just mentioning this in case there's any confusion.
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TricMagic

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #576 on: September 07, 2020, 01:30:06 pm »

At start, Acolytes are 1 Power and Warcasters 2 Power.

Right now, Acolytes have 4 power. Warcasters have 5 Power.

After the elemental boost, Acolytes have 5 Power, Warcasters 8 Power.


As a basic idea. Since the elemental spells offer more to the Warcasters, as they can use the boosts they do currently have to get more out of it than acolytes. Right now, acolytes get more out of magic missile than Warcasters do in comparison. Note this is approximation of current affairs, not truth. An elemental missile for our best casters would greatly improve their power in combat. Not as much for Acolytes, but the spell is for Warcasters on up anyway.
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Man of Paper

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #577 on: September 07, 2020, 01:34:19 pm »

Tric, where are those numbers coming from?
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TricMagic

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #578 on: September 07, 2020, 01:52:43 pm »

Tric, where are those numbers coming from?

Approximation.

Start is base. Add Frag and the improvements to the base Acolyte. MM can be said to be better for Acolytes, they get more from Frag than Warcasters do. Beyond that, Manipular Missile can also be added. So 1+1+1+1=4. Warcasters can be noted to be better, but Frag doesn't help them as much when using MM. So I put them at 5, even if they could be 6.

An elemental version would allow Warcasters to utilize more of their power and ability. Frag would also be more effective for them in this case. Acolytes get less from it if they can cast it, but it's still a minor boost. As warcasters are noted to get more from an elemental spell version, their new Power would theoretically be 7 or 8.

The numbers are a comparision from the base, and may not be accurate in scale. The basis is true though, an elemental version would give Warcasters a major power boost with Frag also available to them. It's a good way to immediately boost their combat potential, which would let us push the angels back again.
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #579 on: September 07, 2020, 02:00:40 pm »

Um. No? I said your current acolytes are stronger than at the start, but not four times stronger. Nor did Warcasters start at merely twice as strong as acolytes.

It's more like:
-Baseline Acolyte: 1.
-Warcaster's Keep Acolyte: 1.2
-Warcaster: 5
-WK Acolyte on Frag: 1.4
-Warcaster on Frag: 6

The strength of Magic Missile is like:
-1
-1.15
-2.3
-1.25
-2.45

Roughly. Don't take these numbers too seriously, please.

E: Oh, right.
-Uruk: 0.5, 0.5 MM strength.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2020, 02:15:16 pm by NUKE9.13 »
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Kashyyk

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #580 on: September 09, 2020, 02:42:28 am »

Quote
Uruk Warlords (3): MoP, Flazeo25, Kashyyk
Spike ():
Frag Dens (3): MoP, Rockeater, Kashyyk
Pests Blight (1): Flazo25
Hell-Rats: (2) TricMagic, Rockeater
Magic Arrow: ()
Infernal Missile: (0)
Wagon Project: (1) TricMagic
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NUKE9.13

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Revision Phase 8
« Reply #581 on: September 18, 2020, 12:08:37 pm »

Demon Team: Revision Phase T8
TURNTURNTURN
((Minor change in terminology from here on: the name for the energy used in mortal magic (and used in combination with Evil by your acolytes) is now Mana, not Magic. The potential for confusion has been bothering me for a while, and I finally decided to change it. This has no mechanical effects or anything, but hopefully it makes things a little easier to read.))



Quote from: Uruk Warlords
Currently the military hierarchy is pretty flat, (Magoc > Commanders/Warcasters > Everyone else), so when mutiple Commanders are in one place a substantial amount of ego measuring takes place, with a fluid hierarchy depending on experience, personal combat prowess, physical size, relative unit strength and arrogance in varying degrees.

Instead, we shall formalise it a little. Each front will have a designated Warlord, responsible for the direct management of the army and being the one who must go to Magoc/other-military-champion for orders. They will have final say on seniority order for the rest of the Commanders. If a Commander feels they have been incorrectly judged, they may make a formal challenge for restitution, and if successful, they will have earned the position they challenged for. The Warlord position is naturally available for challenge. A challenge consists of a small mock battle (where a casualty rate higher than 20% is frowned upon) between equal numbers led by the challengers. Their solders may come from their own unit, and/or from the unit of another Commander with permission, ensuring that a modicum of social skill is required of our senior military officers.
Uruk Warlords: Trivial: (4+4)+2=10!?: Unexpected Boon
Expanding the military hierarchy proved quite simple. With advice from senior officers from the Wartorn Wastes and veteran Commanders, the newly appointed Warlords were able to formulate a comprehensive military structure that would be the envy of the human kingdoms. The challenge system is successful in creating a meritocratic organisation, with the need to negotiate and lead troops ensuring senior Commanders are not defined merely by brute strength, but also tactical skill and strategic cunning. You are also pleased to see that the Warlords are possessed of even higher levels of arrogance, treachery, and cruelty than their subordinates.

In fact, so arrogant are the Warlords that they dared to go against your directives, suggesting their own strategies for the conquest of the human kingdoms. Inspired by the methods of the Victory Faction, they have drawn up plans for lightning strikes at angelic positions, overwhelming them before they can react. This will require force-marching the troops, inevitably resulting in them being tired when battle is joined- but the Warlords believe that the benefits outweigh the costs.
Of course, you don't have to put up with this. Rip the head off of one or two, and the rest will fall in line, and make plans employing a less risky approach. A choice will have to be made.

Uruk Warlords (and the senior Commanders beneath them) are highly effective warriors, tacticians, and strategists. With them leading your armies, you will have the upper hand over Heliel's followers in leadership, an important factor in any fight.



Frag Dens
Built into the backrooms of established cult fronts, Frag Dens are underground (occasionally both figuratively and literally) locations where trained cultists administer "proper" amounts of Frag and provide the basic comforts and care for those who utilize the substance. While Frag Dens are meant primarily as a means of bringing in and observing potential recruits as we corrupt them both body and mind, they also act as a business. While Frag can be sold everywhere, Frag Dens sell the product (at the highest quality available) and charge a small fee for use of rooms, food and water service, and medical attention should it be necessary. Consorts also occasionally make rounds at the Dens, especially once a good (which in this case means evil) recruit is found.
Frag Dens: Easy: (3+3)+1=7: Superior Craftsmanship
Life can be stressful. Eldritch forces conspiring to overthrow the government, armies of mutants marching through neighbouring kingdoms- it's quite understandable that folks would want to get away from it all for a while. And why shouldn't they be allowed to do so in a secure, comfortable location, all while being charged an exorbitant sum and having their mind corrupted?

The main concern you had for this project was security. Smoking Frag doesn't really need all that much infrastructure, but being raided by Angelic lackeys could make for bad reviews. It's a good thing that your criminal contacts know a thing or two about keeping things on the down-low, and were willing to hand over some of their most secure hideouts in exchange for a small cut. From magically hidden rooms in the Scholarly Towers to opulent clubs guarded by bribed watchmen in the Trade City, you are always able to find somewhere where folks can trip balls in peace. Your other operatives will still have to venture the outside world where a Shadow Walker could be around every corner, but they will have somewhere safe to fall back to, and the distribution of Frag is as secure as secure can be.

Frag Dens will boost the revenue generated by Frag and greatly reduce risk of disruption. All other operations will be somewhat safer, and recruitment will be easier. As such secure locations are not commonplace, and furnishing them is not free, Frag Dens are Uncommon.



It is now the Strategy Phase. Choose where to send Magoc and the Obsessive Scholar. Also decide whether to use the Uruk Warlords' blitz strategy (you can choose to use them in one lane and not the other, and may reverse your decision at any time (though you are not required to vote on this every Strategy Phase- only if you want to change your mind)).



Spoiler: Equipment (click to show/hide)



Spoiler: Map (click to show/hide)
« Last Edit: September 18, 2020, 12:36:48 pm by NUKE9.13 »
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flazeo25

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Strategy Phase 8
« Reply #582 on: September 18, 2020, 03:07:31 pm »

Quote from: Blitz
Don't Blitz (0):
Xa-Nam Only (0):
Darrin Only (1): Flazeo25
Both (0):

Quote from: Obsessive Scholar
Scholarly Towers (1): Flazeo25

Quote from: Magoc
Wartorn Wastes (1): Flazeo25
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TricMagic

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Strategy Phase 8
« Reply #583 on: September 18, 2020, 04:41:10 pm »

Quote from: Votebox
Quote from: Blitz
Don't Blitz (0):
Xa-Nam Only (1): TricMagic
Darrin Only (1): Flazeo25
Both (0):

Quote from: Obsessive Scholar
Scholarly Towers (1): Flazeo25, TricMagic

Quote from: Magoc
Wartorn Wastes (1): Flazeo25
Darrin (1): TricMagic

My reasoning, winter may mean the freeing of the river, and the wide open area means we can siege them, destroy them.
Magoc should go to a combat lane given the likely presense of a champion/Helial in one of them
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Man of Paper

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Re: Demon Team - Chiaroscuro Arms Race: Strategy Phase 8
« Reply #584 on: September 18, 2020, 09:23:39 pm »

Okay jesus christ let's save the abominations for our mutants, not our voteboxes. Quotes in quotes is ugly.

Quote from: VoteBox
BLITZ
Don't Blitz:
Xa-Nam Only (1): TricMagic
Darrin Only (1): Flazeo25
Both (1): MoP

OBSESSIVE SCHOLAR
Scholarly Tower (3): Flazeo25, TricMagic, MoP

MAGOC
Wartorn Wastes (1): Flazeo25
Darrin (2): TricMagic, MoP

We should blitz in both areas for one reason: a blitz is a move meant to take a defender by surprise, and this is the only turn we can really fully do that. Let's also remember that they got another Champion this turn, meaning we should use everything we can until we know exactly how much pressure we need to apply.
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