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Author Topic: Can an animal fall down the stairs?  (Read 1365 times)

Dangield

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Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« on: November 11, 2019, 03:19:40 pm »

I have encountered something truly bizarre. I was  minding my business in fortress mode, when i got a report that one of my war dogs has been found dead. I took a look at the location of death and its not in his pasture zone. He seemed to die at the bottom of my main staircase. It wouldn't be so strange if I at least knew what killed him. The battle report only states several of his body parts 'taking full force of the impact' and then dying.

Is it possible, that he fell down the stairs? I read several threads about dwarfs falling down the staircase if unconscious, but couldn't found anything about animals doing the same.

If it is, why would he fall? There was no reason for him to fall unconscious.

And even if there would be a reason, why would it happen on stairs? His pasture zone doesn't include any part of any the staircase.
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #1 on: November 11, 2019, 05:53:27 pm »

I haven't had anything fall down stairs, but I believe it can happen if a creature dodges something or is otherwise flung (e.g. by being hit by a mine cart). There's no reason to believe animals won't behave as dorfs when going unconscious.
Some reason for unconsciousness: hitting something while flying (or falling), and by being attacked. Dogs don't drink (and aren't served in the tavern if they did), but there are syndromes that can cause it.
My guess is that someone got angry at the dog and hit it so it hit a wall, and then fell.

Trainer trained animals have a tendency to follow their trainer, in particular if they have a trainer assigned (as opposed to being trained by anyone), and that can cause them to leave their pastures.
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Loci

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #2 on: November 11, 2019, 07:27:10 pm »

Is it possible, that he fell down the stairs?

Yes. Likely, even.

His pasture zone doesn't include any part of any the staircase.

Animals constrained to a pasture appear to use jump/climb pathing to attempt "escape"; failing a jump or climb on a stairway can cause lengthy fall.


My guess is that someone got angry at the dog and hit it so it hit a wall, and then fell.

Any such fighting would presumably have appeared in the combat report.
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gchristopher

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #3 on: November 11, 2019, 10:12:44 pm »

I have witnessed a sheep fall down stairs. No combat report (like animals fighting?) or anything leading up to it, though.
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Dangield

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2019, 06:22:55 am »

Trainer trained animals have a tendency to follow their trainer, in particular if they have a trainer assigned (as opposed to being trained by anyone), and that can cause them to leave their pastures.
He was not assigned to a specific trainer, so i don't think he should follow anyone. I don't even know which dwarf trained him, it is not an animal training based fortress.

Animals constrained to a pasture appear to use jump/climb pathing to attempt "escape"; failing a jump or climb on a stairway can cause lengthy fall.
I don't see how my dog would have needed to jump/climb on that staircase. In the link you shared there was this situation, where the pasture zone was around a 3x3 staircase, so it is obvious that animals could try jumping through it to get to the other side of the 'donut-shaped' zone. My staircase is 4 tiles from the zone and it is 1 square wide, so there is no reason for animal to pathfind in a way that would require jumping/climbing.
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anewaname

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2019, 07:16:28 am »

I had a bad design with a 2x2 central staircase outside the tavern doors and had multiple combat reports from the falling of dwarfs and of pets, due to the high traffic at that junction.

The war dogs... They visit their trainer, even if that was not a "specific trainer". I don't now what conditions trigger the attempt to visit the trainer, but received enough messages about re-pasturing wardogs that I put them in a room so the door can be locked.
« Last Edit: November 12, 2019, 07:34:47 am by anewaname »
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Salmeuk

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2019, 05:04:44 pm »

Trainer trained animals have a tendency to follow their trainer, in particular if they have a trainer assigned (as opposed to being trained by anyone), and that can cause them to leave their pastures.
He was not assigned to a specific trainer, so i don't think he should follow anyone. I don't even know which dwarf trained him, it is not an animal training based fortress.

Animals constrained to a pasture appear to use jump/climb pathing to attempt "escape"; failing a jump or climb on a stairway can cause lengthy fall.
I don't see how my dog would have needed to jump/climb on that staircase. In the link you shared there was this situation, where the pasture zone was around a 3x3 staircase, so it is obvious that animals could try jumping through it to get to the other side of the 'donut-shaped' zone. My staircase is 4 tiles from the zone and it is 1 square wide, so there is no reason for animal to pathfind in a way that would require jumping/climbing.

4 tiles is close enough. Animals often stray from their containing pastures, and dwarves are tasked with finding them and throwing them back inside. Falling down a single-tile staircase can easily lead to death if it is built tall enough.
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Nameless Archon

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Re: Can an animal fall down the stairs?
« Reply #7 on: November 14, 2019, 02:27:08 pm »

I have encountered something truly bizarre. I was  minding my business in fortress mode, when i got a report that one of my war dogs has been found dead. I took a look at the location of death and its not in his pasture zone. He seemed to die at the bottom of my main staircase. It wouldn't be so strange if I at least knew what killed him. The battle report only states several of his body parts 'taking full force of the impact' and then dying. Is it possible, that he fell down the stairs?
Yes.

Several examples of this are buried somewhere in my most recent set of charity stream forts. The solution is to build multiple levels of hatches on the stairwells to act as break-falls for anyone falling down the shaft. It's not a perfect solution (still had some dogs fall) but it will help. If you have hatches on every floor, then the most probable fall distance is no more than a floor or two, which hurts, but isn't normally outright lethal. (Falls on heads and other vital bits may still kill. This happens in the real world too.)

Additionally, avoid crowding above stairwells, and be cautious about placing a barracks atop a staircase shaft, as dwarven dodging and sparring can result in falls, which are 100% lethal if they occur above a deep enough staircase shaft.
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