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[VABritto]

If this suggestion was already made, please tell me and I will delete this thread.

I was searching through the DF Wiki and I noticed there were no physical flags in DF. So I thought about suggesting it (and other things that I thought because of it).

The first thing would be the flag/banner + flagpole themselves. I think it would be interesting if we could have banners actually being held by dwarves into combat to increase morale and decrease the chance of fleeing. You could choose to put whatever image on the banner (or let it be random), or choose that it be the fortress or civ symbol. You could hang it on walls and on entrances to your fortress (similar to how you can carve walls, but these banners could be removed and the wall restored). I think it could be nice in a roleplay perspective and would give something else to do with textile which is nice [I like to raise sheep in my fortresses lol].

Tapestries would also be interesting, since with them we could adorn the walls of our fortresses with randomly generated things like when you carve it on a wall, but you could also remove it and relocate it to make more "themed" rooms and even sell these tapestries as part of the textile industry.

Finally, I'd like to suggest a simplified form of Blazonry for the description of symbols in game. I don't mean a revamp on the descriptions or anything. More like I think it would be nice if some key words or formats can be introduced in addition to what we already have so that a person could technically make something akin to Blazonry (aka Heraldic description) in their fort symbol. An example of that would be to add the word "field" and an interaction of something being "on" a field. Also letting everything in the description be colorable so one could for example say "a golden lion on a red field". That would basically be a golden lion with a red background, in Heraldry, but it can also be pretty easily understood simply as a literal lion on a literal field, making it flexible and understandable for whoever reads it. With that, one could also add a bit more descriptive positions and stances.

The DF Team definitely have a lot more important things to do now, but I thought it would be nice to throw this suggestion out here in case they ever see it and maybe, if they find it a good idea, to put it on their to do list for any time in the future lol

[Shonai_Dweller]

Devotes (old version, but content still applies):

Bloat165, WALL HANGINGS AND RUGS, (Future): Rugs, tapestries, paintings, etc. This leads to things like paint and pigments. The player's skin could hang in the goblin fortress in the same way. It could even be improved like dwarf items. Requires Core43

(The game has been around for 15 years or so, anything reasonable you can think of has already been suggested. So, yes, there are other suggestions threads (search function brings up several on tapestries, not so much on blazonry at first glance). No need to delete this one though. New ideas for old suggestions just adds ideas to the pool in the hope of a fully fleshed-out implementation someday - best to necro a thread and add ideas there if it's possible though).

[GoblinCookie]

Presently the game selects a random creature, plant or shape to create symbology for civs and site governments.  Flags are a problem because they aren't very practical underground and they do not presently have any mechanical use.  They sound like something elves and humans would use though, the probable reason for their absence is that the game does not focus on these.

[VABritto]

Presently the game selects a random creature, plant or shape to create symbology for civs and site governments.  Flags are a problem because they aren't very practical underground and they do not presently have any mechanical use.  They sound like something elves and humans would use though, the probable reason for their absence is that the game does not focus on these.

Engravings also can't really be seen underground, to be fair, so that is kind of a moot point. We either don't need either or we could use both. I prefer to be able to use both because I find them both interesting and fun. I also understand why some might see it as culturally specific, but I personally can't see it as such because flags and banners are pretty useful and present in most developed cultures. Also, they are cool lol

[GoblinCookie]

Engravings also can't really be seen underground, to be fair, so that is kind of a moot point. We either don't need either or we could use both. I prefer to be able to use both because I find them both interesting and fun. I also understand why some might see it as culturally specific, but I personally can't see it as such because flags and banners are pretty useful and present in most developed cultures. Also, they are cool lol

They can be felt underground. 

[VABritto]

Engravings also can't really be seen underground, to be fair, so that is kind of a moot point. We either don't need either or we could use both. I prefer to be able to use both because I find them both interesting and fun. I also understand why some might see it as culturally specific, but I personally can't see it as such because flags and banners are pretty useful and present in most developed cultures. Also, they are cool lol

They can be felt underground.

Definitely. But you presuppose then that the dwarves in DF are walking blindly underground, making works of art through sheer talent in the middle of the dark and then admiring a fine work of art through touching it? That's... Not really how I envision a fortress (a bunch of blind dwarves rummaging around dark corridors while at the same time living perfectly productive lives while doing so). Sounds something taken out of José Saramago's "Ensaio Sobre a Cegueira" (in it everyone in the world suddenly goes blind). So either all dwarves are running blind, in which case we are playing a very different game than I thought we were, or they can see perfectly well in their tunnels, in which case both tapestries and stonework are equally valid.

[GoblinCookie]

Definitely. But you presuppose then that the dwarves in DF are walking blindly underground, making works of art through sheer talent in the middle of the dark and then admiring a fine work of art through touching it? That's... Not really how I envision a fortress (a bunch of blind dwarves rummaging around dark corridors while at the same time living perfectly productive lives while doing so). Sounds something taken out of José Saramago's "Ensaio Sobre a Cegueira" (in it everyone in the world suddenly goes blind). So either all dwarves are running blind, in which case we are playing a very different game than I thought we were, or they can see perfectly well in their tunnels, in which case both tapestries and stonework are equally valid.

Dwarves have perfect night vision, which pretty much means they see in the infra-red spectrum, since that is the only way to see in a completely dark place.  This means they can see the other dwarves, the other creatures and anything hotter or colder than the surrounding area. 

That gives a new meaning to 'touching'.  If a dwarf touches an object for long enough, they will transfer their own body temperature onto that object, allowing them to see the object in the infrared spectrum.  So after touching our engraving for long enough, it actually becomes visible.

[VABritto]

So you are saying that they do not actually see anything around them until they touch it and transfer heat to it? This is  creative idea, don't get me wrong, but I never actually heard of it before and sounds like something you made up to explain the current lack of lighting in the game. Or did you hear it from the devs?

[GoblinCookie]

So you are saying that they do not actually see anything around them until they touch it and transfer heat to it? This is  creative idea, don't get me wrong, but I never actually heard of it before and sounds like something you made up to explain the current lack of lighting in the game. Or did you hear it from the devs?

Yes I am just extrapolating from the devs concept of perfect night-vision, how is it possible to see in complete darkness?  The answer to seeing things in complete darkness is to see in the infrared spectrum.

[VABritto]

So you are saying that they do not actually see anything around them until they touch it and transfer heat to it? This is  creative idea, don't get me wrong, but I never actually heard of it before and sounds like something you made up to explain the current lack of lighting in the game. Or did you hear it from the devs?

Yes I am just extrapolating from the devs concept of perfect night-vision, how is it possible to see in complete darkness?  The answer to seeing things in complete darkness is to see in the infrared spectrum.

I see. It caused me a bit of confusion because you said it like it was fact instead of extrapolation. You might be right. But then again, it might just be that they haven't implemented any mechanics for lighting yet. I prefer to assume the latter instead of the former because the former sounds strange and not at all how I envision these dwarves operating (I do not imagine them touching things all over the place to make them warm so they can properly see stuff). Could it be so? Sure. But unless the DF duo actually says it is so I will assume lighting just hasn't been implemented yet (you, of course, are free to assume they actually have non-magical infra-red night vision). Beyond this point we can't really discuss the issue because we have stumbled upon an axiomatic disagreement, unfortunately.

[GoblinCookie]

I see. It caused me a bit of confusion because you said it like it was fact instead of extrapolation. You might be right. But then again, it might just be that they haven't implemented any mechanics for lighting yet. I prefer to assume the latter instead of the former because the former sounds strange and not at all how I envision these dwarves operating (I do not imagine them touching things all over the place to make them warm so they can properly see stuff). Could it be so? Sure. But unless the DF duo actually says it is so I will assume lighting just hasn't been implemented yet (you, of course, are free to assume they actually have non-magical infra-red night vision). Beyond this point we can't really discuss the issue because we have stumbled upon an axiomatic disagreement, unfortunately.

They have not implemented the mechanics for lighting yet, but they have given dwarves perfect night vision. 

[VABritto]

I see. It caused me a bit of confusion because you said it like it was fact instead of extrapolation. You might be right. But then again, it might just be that they haven't implemented any mechanics for lighting yet. I prefer to assume the latter instead of the former because the former sounds strange and not at all how I envision these dwarves operating (I do not imagine them touching things all over the place to make them warm so they can properly see stuff). Could it be so? Sure. But unless the DF duo actually says it is so I will assume lighting just hasn't been implemented yet (you, of course, are free to assume they actually have non-magical infra-red night vision). Beyond this point we can't really discuss the issue because we have stumbled upon an axiomatic disagreement, unfortunately.

They have not implemented the mechanics for lighting yet, but they have given dwarves perfect night vision.

True. Either because they are ignoring night time darkness (which a game can do) and it does not have anything to do with infra red vision or because they have infra red vision lol thus, an axiomatic unverifiable problem

[Nordlicht]

Finally, I'd like to suggest a simplified form of Blazonry for the description of symbols in game.

Given how detail the art forms are, I think going to full heraldic descriptions wouldn't be a bad idea. These descriptors were basically made to describe crests and would be the easiest form to make sure to transport the idea how it really looks like. Making a simplified form will either lead to less possibilities or room for interpretation.

[VABritto]

Finally, I'd like to suggest a simplified form of Blazonry for the description of symbols in game.

Given how detail the art forms are, I think going to full heraldic descriptions wouldn't be a bad idea. These descriptors were basically made to describe crests and would be the easiest form to make sure to transport the idea how it really looks like. Making a simplified form will either lead to less possibilities or room for interpretation.

If they wouldn't mind making it complex and rich I'm all for that lol I just suggested it be simplified because I didn't want to cause too much of a hassle for the developers lol