Bay 12 Games Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  
Pages: [1] 2

Author Topic: Alternative breeding variants  (Read 5444 times)

DerMeister

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Alternative breeding variants
« on: May 09, 2019, 07:18:29 am »

In this version male caste impregnate female caste. But some creatures need alternatives.

[HERMAPHRODITE] like [AMPHIBIOUS], but construct of [MALE] and [FEMALE].

[PARTHENOGENESIS] make female impregnate buy itself.

[PALANRASIT] based on one fictional creature and add male ability to impregnate other creatures(females or males or genderless or all). Token may be [PALANRASIT:Gender], "gender" is "FEMALE", "MALE", "GENDERLESS" or "ALL".

[MITOSIS] give ability to creature become two smaller versions of itself.

[REGENERATE_TO_FULL] give ability to severed body parts regenerate into full creature.

[HERMAPHRODITE] - for snail man, [PARTHENOGENESIS] - for harpies, [PALANRASIT:FEMALE] - for satyres, [PALANRASIT:ALL] - for blendec, [MITOSIS] for blood man, [REGENERATE_TO_FULL] - for plump helmet man.
Logged

Bumber

  • Bay Watcher
  • REMOVE KOBOLD
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2019, 01:42:23 pm »

Shouldn't "mitosis" be "fission", and "regenerate_to_full" be "fragmentation"? I guess budding could be implemented under parthenogenesis, which would also be added to plump helmet men.
« Last Edit: May 09, 2019, 01:44:12 pm by Bumber »
Logged
Reading his name would trigger it. Thinking of him would trigger it. No other circumstances would trigger it- it was strictly related to the concept of Bill Clinton entering the conscious mind.

THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

A wizard has turned you into a wagon. This was inevitable (Y/y)?

Azerty

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2019, 01:49:43 pm »

We would need work on how to combine this with mechanics for genetics.
Logged
"Just tell me about the bits with the forest-defending part, the sociopath part is pretty normal dwarf behavior."

DerMeister

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2019, 02:58:31 pm »

Shouldn't "mitosis" be "fission", and "regenerate_to_full" be "fragmentation"? I guess budding could be implemented under parthenogenesis, which would also be added to plump helmet men.
Regenerate - like starfish or planaria worm. Enemy cut hand - creature regenerate hand, hand regenerate in full creature. Plump helmet man can have two ways.
We would need work on how to combine this with mechanics for genetics.
Hermaphrodites can work like females and males work in genetics mechanics. Parthenogenesis, palanrasits, fission and fragmentation simply make clones of  parent because parent is only one.
Logged

voliol

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
    • Website
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2019, 03:19:21 pm »

[MITOSIS] could be expanded into [REPRODUCTION_BUDDING:x:t], where x is the percentage of the original creature that is split off, and t is a minimum time interval in ticks. [REPRODUCTION_BUDDING:50:some time] would effectively make it split in two even halves every now and then. For this I also propose a [BUDDING_PRESERVES_AGE] where the budded-off creature doesn't start from age 0 (and any child stages) but the same age as the original creature.

KittyTac

  • Bay Watcher
  • Impending Catsplosion. [PREFSTRING:aloofness]
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2019, 09:53:01 pm »

+1 to this and voliol's sub-suggestion.
Logged
Don't trust this toaster that much, it could be a villain in disguise.
Mostly phone-posting, sorry for any typos or autocorrect hijinks.

Naturegirl1999

  • Bay Watcher
  • Thank you TamerVirus for the avatar switcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #6 on: May 10, 2019, 10:40:50 am »

I also like this, it would add variety to the creatures.
Logged

Bumber

  • Bay Watcher
  • REMOVE KOBOLD
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2019, 02:16:32 pm »

[MITOSIS] could be expanded into [REPRODUCTION_BUDDING:x:t], where x is the percentage of the original creature that is split off
You'd want to make sure they have a growth spurt before the split, because it doesn't subtract from the original body.
Logged
Reading his name would trigger it. Thinking of him would trigger it. No other circumstances would trigger it- it was strictly related to the concept of Bill Clinton entering the conscious mind.

THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

A wizard has turned you into a wagon. This was inevitable (Y/y)?

Bumber

  • Bay Watcher
  • REMOVE KOBOLD
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2019, 02:18:15 pm »

Shouldn't "mitosis" be "fission", and "regenerate_to_full" be "fragmentation"? I guess budding could be implemented under parthenogenesis, which would also be added to plump helmet men.
Regenerate - like starfish or planaria worm. Enemy cut hand - creature regenerate hand, hand regenerate in full creature.
Also known as fragmentation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fragmentation_(reproduction)
Logged
Reading his name would trigger it. Thinking of him would trigger it. No other circumstances would trigger it- it was strictly related to the concept of Bill Clinton entering the conscious mind.

THE xTROLL FUR SOCKx RUSE WAS A........... DISTACTION        the carp HAVE the wagon

A wizard has turned you into a wagon. This was inevitable (Y/y)?

DerMeister

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2019, 02:25:17 pm »

Magic may be added as creation elemental man by magus from not living material - blood man from pool of blood, gabbro man from lose stone, iron man and bronse colossus - from metal bars etc. It will work by interaction, when interaction can mutate not only severed body parts.

[CAN_GROW_INTO:creature:chance] is different way to reproduction of plump helmet man and grimmeling. This token for plants.

Logged

Pillbo

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #10 on: May 11, 2019, 12:20:52 pm »

People talking about this on Reddit recently, they asked that someone else post it to the forums if anyone had the interest:

Quote
Personally, I think it would be cool if he implemented a gender generator system (for creatures it is appropriate for, IE, titans, FBs, clowns, etc). That way, you could have a species of clowns that reproduces using a third party (infection with syndrome/sting), or that reproduces asexually, or that reproduces via a ternary operation (two members of different genders both knock up a third), or even a system where two creatures of opposing genders where both can get pregnant (via oviposition).

The possibilities are really out there.

Quote
The sting/syndrome pregnancy would be really interesting, a lot of parasitic creatures sort of reproduce that way, laying eggs in or on others as a food source for their young- mostly after normal sexual reproduction. A FB could impregnate your dorf army with stings during battle and you won't know there's a problem for months until the young burst out of them in the middle of you tavern.

These kind of changes would make sense with the things he's doing for the magic update- making way more about the game procgen. You ought to suggest it in the suggestion forums, they say he reads all of them.

The book I Contain Multitudes talks about a self-cloning parasitic wasp that has a female only population.  They create fertile cloned eggs of themselves that they stab into grubs with their ovipositor, the egg hatches and eats the grub from the inside.  That would be a cool thing for demons or FBs to do.

Another thing I think would be interesting, for some worlds at least, would be FBs breeding. If their logic allowed them to meet each other without fighting to the death they could occasionally breed.  I don't think you'd have to really over think it too much, ancient myths are full of creatures birthing unrelated creatures, it would a way to add procgen beasts to a world after generation.  Any two beasts could meet and lay an egg somewhere that could hatch using the same procgen logic the game uses to make them in world gen.  That way if you have a high beast or savagery world it wouldn't have to slowly run out of monsters.

I'd add to the list of cool breeding ideas - demons could puke out their young instead of standard birth or eggs, also not unheard of in the animal kingdom.
Logged

Azerty

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #11 on: May 11, 2019, 03:26:39 pm »

Magic may be added as creation elemental man by magus from not living material - blood man from pool of blood, gabbro man from lose stone, iron man and bronse colossus - from metal bars etc. It will work by interaction, when interaction can mutate not only severed body parts.

[CAN_GROW_INTO:creature:chance] is different way to reproduction of plump helmet man and grimmeling. This token for plants.

Or we could have special versions of blood, iron and bronze to be subjected to this; for exemple, depending from the magic, in some places, blood could give birth to blood men.

People talking about this on Reddit recently, they asked that someone else post it to the forums if anyone had the interest:

Quote
Personally, I think it would be cool if he implemented a gender generator system (for creatures it is appropriate for, IE, titans, FBs, clowns, etc). That way, you could have a species of clowns that reproduces using a third party (infection with syndrome/sting), or that reproduces asexually, or that reproduces via a ternary operation (two members of different genders both knock up a third), or even a system where two creatures of opposing genders where both can get pregnant (via oviposition).

The possibilities are really out there.

Quote
The sting/syndrome pregnancy would be really interesting, a lot of parasitic creatures sort of reproduce that way, laying eggs in or on others as a food source for their young- mostly after normal sexual reproduction. A FB could impregnate your dorf army with stings during battle and you won't know there's a problem for months until the young burst out of them in the middle of you tavern.

These kind of changes would make sense with the things he's doing for the magic update- making way more about the game procgen. You ought to suggest it in the suggestion forums, they say he reads all of them.

The book I Contain Multitudes talks about a self-cloning parasitic wasp that has a female only population.  They create fertile cloned eggs of themselves that they stab into grubs with their ovipositor, the egg hatches and eats the grub from the inside.  That would be a cool thing for demons or FBs to do.

It could be a very powerful tool.

Another thing I think would be interesting, for some worlds at least, would be FBs breeding. If their logic allowed them to meet each other without fighting to the death they could occasionally breed.  I don't think you'd have to really over think it too much, ancient myths are full of creatures birthing unrelated creatures, it would a way to add procgen beasts to a world after generation.  Any two beasts could meet and lay an egg somewhere that could hatch using the same procgen logic the game uses to make them in world gen.  That way if you have a high beast or savagery world it wouldn't have to slowly run out of monsters.

I'd add to the list of cool breeding ideas - demons could puke out their young instead of standard birth or eggs, also not unheard of in the animal kingdom.

To manage the mixing of different FB, we could use some of the ideas on Taxonomic trees and biological families.
Logged
"Just tell me about the bits with the forest-defending part, the sociopath part is pretty normal dwarf behavior."

DerMeister

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #12 on: May 14, 2019, 08:14:32 am »

Magic may be added as creation elemental man by magus from not living material - blood man from pool of blood, gabbro man from lose stone, iron man and bronse colossus - from metal bars etc. It will work by interaction, when interaction can mutate not only severed body parts.

[CAN_GROW_INTO:creature:chance] is different way to reproduction of plump helmet man and grimmeling. This token for plants.

Or we could have special versions of blood, iron and bronze to be subjected to this; for exemple, depending from the magic, in some places, blood could give birth to blood men.

People talking about this on Reddit recently, they asked that someone else post it to the forums if anyone had the interest:

Quote
Personally, I think it would be cool if he implemented a gender generator system (for creatures it is appropriate for, IE, titans, FBs, clowns, etc). That way, you could have a species of clowns that reproduces using a third party (infection with syndrome/sting), or that reproduces asexually, or that reproduces via a ternary operation (two members of different genders both knock up a third), or even a system where two creatures of opposing genders where both can get pregnant (via oviposition).

The possibilities are really out there.

Quote
The sting/syndrome pregnancy would be really interesting, a lot of parasitic creatures sort of reproduce that way, laying eggs in or on others as a food source for their young- mostly after normal sexual reproduction. A FB could impregnate your dorf army with stings during battle and you won't know there's a problem for months until the young burst out of them in the middle of you tavern.

These kind of changes would make sense with the things he's doing for the magic update- making way more about the game procgen. You ought to suggest it in the suggestion forums, they say he reads all of them.

The book I Contain Multitudes talks about a self-cloning parasitic wasp that has a female only population.  They create fertile cloned eggs of themselves that they stab into grubs with their ovipositor, the egg hatches and eats the grub from the inside.  That would be a cool thing for demons or FBs to do.

It could be a very powerful tool.

Another thing I think would be interesting, for some worlds at least, would be FBs breeding. If their logic allowed them to meet each other without fighting to the death they could occasionally breed.  I don't think you'd have to really over think it too much, ancient myths are full of creatures birthing unrelated creatures, it would a way to add procgen beasts to a world after generation.  Any two beasts could meet and lay an egg somewhere that could hatch using the same procgen logic the game uses to make them in world gen.  That way if you have a high beast or savagery world it wouldn't have to slowly run out of monsters.

I'd add to the list of cool breeding ideas - demons could puke out their young instead of standard birth or eggs, also not unheard of in the animal kingdom.

To manage the mixing of different FB, we could use some of the ideas on Taxonomic trees and biological families.
Blood, iron and other materials will transform in creature by interaction, from region or from magus. But in current version interaction only can gesture bodies.

FB can breed all with all, they are mixed creatures. In greece mithology very different creatures can breed.
People talking about this on Reddit recently, they asked that someone else post it to the forums if anyone had the interest:

Quote
Personally, I think it would be cool if he implemented a gender generator system (for creatures it is appropriate for, IE, titans, FBs, clowns, etc). That way, you could have a species of clowns that reproduces using a third party (infection with syndrome/sting), or that reproduces asexually, or that reproduces via a ternary operation (two members of different genders both knock up a third), or even a system where two creatures of opposing genders where both can get pregnant (via oviposition).

The possibilities are really out there.

Quote
The sting/syndrome pregnancy would be really interesting, a lot of parasitic creatures sort of reproduce that way, laying eggs in or on others as a food source for their young- mostly after normal sexual reproduction. A FB could impregnate your dorf army with stings during battle and you won't know there's a problem for months until the young burst out of them in the middle of you tavern.

These kind of changes would make sense with the things he's doing for the magic update- making way more about the game procgen. You ought to suggest it in the suggestion forums, they say he reads all of them.

The book I Contain Multitudes talks about a self-cloning parasitic wasp that has a female only population.  They create fertile cloned eggs of themselves that they stab into grubs with their ovipositor, the egg hatches and eats the grub from the inside.  That would be a cool thing for demons or FBs to do.

Another thing I think would be interesting, for some worlds at least, would be FBs breeding. If their logic allowed them to meet each other without fighting to the death they could occasionally breed.  I don't think you'd have to really over think it too much, ancient myths are full of creatures birthing unrelated creatures, it would a way to add procgen beasts to a world after generation.  Any two beasts could meet and lay an egg somewhere that could hatch using the same procgen logic the game uses to make them in world gen.  That way if you have a high beast or savagery world it wouldn't have to slowly run out of monsters.

I'd add to the list of cool breeding ideas - demons could puke out their young instead of standard birth or eggs, also not unheard of in the animal kingdom.
Palanrasit is different. Palanrasits is male-only creatures from some sci-fi, they have virus-like spermatosoid. But DF can have [PALANRASIT_RESULT:result], when BIRTH is normal, LAY_EGG is egg laying, SPAWN is like birth but with parent kill like alien from film. And [PALANRASIT_CREATURE:creature] for impregnate only this cratures, example satyr can impregnate elf, human and goat (female). Or [PALANRASIT_SIZE:min:max] for disable when big palanrasit impregnate small cat.
Logged

DerMeister

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #13 on: September 05, 2019, 09:59:41 am »

Or palanrasit can have [LITTER_FROM_SIZE], when litter of babies will be larger in larger creatures.
Logged

Blastbeard

  • Bay Watcher
    • View Profile
Re: Alternative breeding variants
« Reply #14 on: September 07, 2019, 07:01:06 pm »

+1 for alternative reproductive strategies.

I can see flesh balls and similar such creatures using [MITOSIS] to good effect. Perhaps the tag could have an argument or condition for activating when the creature is harmed, i.e. I slash the flesh ball with a sword and instead of killing it now there are two flesh balls. That could be a way to implement 'splitter' type creatures that multiply when killed, such as certain spins on slimes and other such things.

You could also probably combine [MITOSIS] and [REGENERATE_TO_FULL]'s functions as a basis for simulating the old 'detach a body part I don't need to distract a predator' trick used all over nature.

As for FB's interbreeding, there's already a means to do that. If a creature has more than two castes, the parents' respective castes have no bearing on their child's castes.
I tried combining the five civilized races into a single creature once, with a male and female caste of each species. They interbred freely, but I observed such shenanigans as a human father and elf mother having a kobold baby, among other heresies. Into the trash it went and I never looked back.
If every kind of generated creature was just a single creature with generated castes instead of separate species (so instead of FORGOTTEN_BEAST_1 and FORGOTTEN_BEAST_2 we just have FORGOTTEN_BEAST) they would interbreed and produce new monstrosities.
Logged
I don't know how it all works, I just throw molten science at the wall and see what ignites.
Pages: [1] 2