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Author Topic: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Ironhand - Discussion and Suggestions  (Read 461094 times)

jecowa

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2580 on: May 01, 2021, 02:14:53 pm »

Imo, dwarfs face right. Right is the direction of progress in games like Super Mario Bros. Goblins, Undead, Humans, and Elves face left so they can face the dwarves in combat (or in trade).

War trainable animals face right so they are facing the same direction as the dwarves. Dangerous animals face left to face the dwarves to attack them. Weak and cowardly animals (like deer) face right so they can flee from the dwarves.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2021, 02:18:03 pm by jecowa »
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Mr Crabman

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2581 on: May 01, 2021, 02:42:28 pm »

Imo, dwarfs face right. Right is the direction of progress in games like Super Mario Bros. Goblins, Undead, Humans, and Elves face left so they can face the dwarves in combat (or in trade).

War trainable animals face right so they are facing the same direction as the dwarves. Dangerous animals face left to face the dwarves to attack them. Weak and cowardly animals (like deer) face right so they can flee from the dwarves.
Dwarves actually face left though as seen in all the screenshots so far, just like humans, elves, and most animals (haven't seen goblins); I at first thought it was about hostility (don't know what they're called, but those big green guys with the stretched out hand face right), but I recall seeing some hostile creatures facing left (eg, dragons and hydra), and am not sure what the deciding factor is.

bloop_bleep

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2582 on: May 01, 2021, 10:24:08 pm »

I think some sort of movement-direction information is recorded by DF so I think it could be possible to flip the direction according to how they're moving.

Imo, dwarfs face right. Right is the direction of progress in games like Super Mario Bros. Goblins, Undead, Humans, and Elves face left so they can face the dwarves in combat (or in trade).

War trainable animals face right so they are facing the same direction as the dwarves. Dangerous animals face left to face the dwarves to attack them. Weak and cowardly animals (like deer) face right so they can flee from the dwarves.

This doesn't feel that relevant if the other creatures are to the left of the dwarves...
« Last Edit: May 01, 2021, 10:26:58 pm by bloop_bleep »
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jecowa

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2583 on: May 02, 2021, 03:15:42 am »

It doesn't work out when they are on the other sides, but it's probably better than them facing a random direction. You can get clues about an animal from the direction it's facing. And you'd have the option to set up your fortress entry so that dwarves are facing outwards and visitors/invaders are facing inwards.
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Shonai_Dweller

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2584 on: May 02, 2021, 04:14:54 am »

It doesn't work out when they are on the other sides, but it's probably better than them facing a random direction. You can get clues about an animal from the direction it's facing. And you'd have the option to set up your fortress entry so that dwarves are facing outwards and visitors/invaders are facing inwards.
Would invader and visitor dwarves be reversed then? Would make my merc squads look pretty weird all facing different directions.
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jecowa

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2585 on: May 02, 2021, 05:33:47 am »

Mercs face right. Outpost liaison and his guards face left.
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Pillbo

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2586 on: May 03, 2021, 11:43:28 am »

I personally would like it if creatures faced right when oriented north through southeast, and faced left if oriented south through northwest. But I think Meph said that changing sprite direction wasn't going to be an option because of... shadows maybe?
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Mr Crabman

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2587 on: May 03, 2021, 12:24:54 pm »

I personally would like it if creatures faced right when oriented north through southeast, and faced left if oriented south through northwest. But I think Meph said that changing sprite direction wasn't going to be an option because of... shadows maybe?

I think it would be better if northwest through southwest will face left, northeast through southeast will face right, and north and south will face whichever way they were more recently; ie if they were facing right at first, if they start moving south they will stay facing right. This way you won't get them flipping back and forth when moving southeast or northwest (since dwarves don't always move in a line; they may move diagonally, and then a bit upwards, then diagonally again).

I don't think the shadows would look that bad flipped, but then again I'm no artist, and I haven't seen how it would look. My real worry would be about their asymmetrical stuff like which hand they're holding an object in swapping whenever they turn, not the shadows (and if this could be solved, I seriously hope they could add directional facing as an option).

Starver

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2588 on: May 03, 2021, 08:07:00 pm »

Makes me think of: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flight_level#Semicircular/hemispheric_rule

But if it were only so simple. ;)
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Mr Crabman

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2589 on: May 04, 2021, 05:15:30 am »

I saw this in a recent video for how selections work (I assume this isn't just zones, but selections in general):

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

This is great, but it would be useful if there were somewhere displaying how large this dragged out area is (that goes for any designation in general), either as a tooltip on the side of the box, or in a fixed position somewhere, and possibly beside this, the absolute number of how many squares there are (for the mathematically lazy).

For example, in the above image, it would be 11x18 (or the other way around; I can't remember whether vertical or horizontal comes first), and also 198 squares. Obviously this information would also be shown for placing/building of objects or constructions, and maybe when selecting already existing zones as well (so you can see at a glance for example, how big a zone or a farm is)

Maybe this is already planned though.

There could be also be a toggle option to show the numbers of each tile (distance from the corner being dragged from) instead of the green diamond shapes, showing the distance from the initial point being dragged out (starting with 1, not 0).

Another QOL feature to consider (as an option) is highlighting the line of squares down the middle on each side (assuming that side has a middle/isn't an even number), for example, something roughly like this, but better looking/clearer than my quick edit:

Spoiler (click to show/hide)

The vertical side is 18 tiles so it doesn't have a middle to highlight (or maybe there could be a line in between the 2 middlemost tiles?), but if it was, it would also have a highlighted line of dots, and so you would also see the middle of the rectangle by where the lines meet.

Meph

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2590 on: May 04, 2021, 05:19:42 am »

I already suggested to Tarn to make every 10th line thicker and to add a x,y number on the side, so that people can see how many tiles are selected. He said it's a good suggestion, but hasn't gotten around to it yet. So much UI is work in progress.
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Putnam

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2591 on: May 05, 2021, 05:53:59 am »

I think some sort of movement-direction information is recorded by DF so I think it could be possible to flip the direction according to how they're moving.

"Move" actions stores x/y/z coordinates of tile they're moving to, so one could pretty reasonably have direction flipping based on comparing move's x coord to dwarf's

Rose

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2592 on: May 05, 2021, 10:49:01 am »

I think some sort of movement-direction information is recorded by DF so I think it could be possible to flip the direction according to how they're moving.

"Move" actions stores x/y/z coordinates of tile they're moving to, so one could pretty reasonably have direction flipping based on comparing move's x coord to dwarf's

Armok Vision does that, and also uses the move timer to move them smoothly. It works well, other than the fact that the destination can change at the last minute if somebody is standing there.
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[HYBRID BEING]

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2593 on: June 03, 2021, 09:09:45 am »

make every 10th line thicker and to add a x,y number on the side
A little late to the party, but, IMHO, visually splitting selection in tens seems a bit redundant if there is a total x,y counter. A visual pointer for center alignment though, as Mr_Crabman suggested, would be useful. As for even sides, two rows/columns in the center could be made thicker.
Ultimately, giving user an option via settings or maybe modifier key (think how Alt, Ctrl and Shift change selection in graphic editors) would be a perfect way to go.
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Mr Crabman

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Re: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #2594 on: June 05, 2021, 09:33:14 am »

When should a suggestion be posted in this thread as opposed to elsewhere in this forum? And what about the Suggestions forum, is that just for gameplay (and in principle audio) stuff, while this forum is for the tileset and UI/UX?

A little late to the party, but, IMHO, visually splitting selection in tens seems a bit redundant if there is a total x,y counter. A visual pointer for center alignment though, as Mr_Crabman suggested, would be useful. As for even sides, two rows/columns in the center could be made thicker.
Ultimately, giving user an option via settings or maybe modifier key (think how Alt, Ctrl and Shift change selection in graphic editors) would be a perfect way to go.

I'm definitely in agreement here; splitting in tens isn't very useful compared to center alignment if there is a counter. Maybe an option for also splitting in tens could also be useful (so you know where the tens are), but center alignment seems important as well.
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