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Author Topic: Steam/Itch.io tileset - Mayday/Ironhand - Discussion and Suggestions  (Read 459879 times)

funkydwarf

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #480 on: April 19, 2019, 12:34:20 am »

I like the simplistic one.
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Real_bang

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #481 on: April 19, 2019, 01:53:09 am »

What about the large scale map being simplistic and small scale (adventure mode) map looking realistic
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Starver

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #482 on: April 19, 2019, 02:10:21 am »

(I can see this Public Review being about as useful as a national referendum.  ;))
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gchristopher

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #483 on: April 19, 2019, 02:15:34 am »

For practical purposes of finding a desirable embark, you really need to be able to see where that terrifying savannah is next to the untamed wilds forest and diagonal from the mirthful swamp. That means retaining some fairly clear indication of the grid boundaries, and argues for the simpler graphics being more useful. Finding embarks is enough of a full evening chore without obfuscating it, even if that means it is less beautiful.

How do you think the display of sites vs. underlying biomes will work? Do you know if you can paint the sites in a way that shows their actual positions? (which aren't aligned with world map tiles) Any possibility of fancy zoom mechanics that show more detail when zoomed in?

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PatrikLundell

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #484 on: April 19, 2019, 02:40:52 am »

What are the constraints on the data used to generate/select the graphics for the map?

It seems the current logic selects the character/tile to use based on a precedence list, with the biome at the bottom and (probably) inhabited sites at the top, with volcanoes, summits, and rivers in between. If the current logic remains that constrains what can be done (you can't e.g. show elevation beyond the implicit one of mountains being high elevation by definition, and you can't show a river cutting through a dry broadleaf forest). I don't even know if the current logic allows for a better biome discrimination than the broad biome type ("jungle", mountain, hills, etc.) displayed currently, although the tropicality (i.e. tropical/temperate version) is actually shown today, as is the evilness level.

I assume you won't be able to dig down to the mid level tile level (those on the leftmost map) for the top level tile, as digging up that information takes far too much time (we're talking minutes for a maximum size world), but it ought to be possible to e.g. overlay a biome tile with a river overlay.

My preference would be to show as much information as possible, so each biome would have its own image, with an overlay for river (preferrably differing between brook/stream and the river sizes, and obviously variants for the various ways it can cross the tile, including merges) and other overlays for summits and volcanoes. Caves (when shown) ought to be possible to show as an overlay as well, while habitations would probably have to take over the tile completely (although necro towers might join caves as being possible to show on top of the biome). Showing elevation would be a nice addition as well.

Once it's known what can be shown (or probably can be shown, as I'd expect the display selection code to have to change to show more than what's shown now, and so wouldn't be nailed down completely before it's actually done), the next step would be to decide what you'd try to display and what would have to be sacrificed, which would be both a technical one (what can be done with the pixels available), and an art style one.

I wouldn't go for a "real" map style unless the mid level tile info was available, as you'd really need that level of biome boundary information to produce a good looking map, and at that point it wouldn't really be tile based (the character version would still have to be, though, but it also wouldn't look like a parchment map regardless). As indicated above, that isn't really feasible now, but might be something to strive for after the map rewrite (and, if so, would provide an input requirement/request for the rewrite).

gchristopher's point about the ability to actually locate desired sites is a good one, so a grid toggle would probably be helpful with a post map rewrite parchment style map.
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Hommit

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #485 on: April 19, 2019, 03:25:05 am »

What about the large scale map being simplistic and small scale (adventure mode) map looking realistic
Probably something like this.
While simplistic map is too simplistic and bleak, it can indeed show biomes without cluttering. But middle/small scales map absolutely must be graphic.
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Criperum

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #486 on: April 19, 2019, 03:54:53 am »

All options look awesome.
I personally lean to simplistic version due to it's what i'm most used to in current game version. Also I allows understanding edges of different map objects like forests and mountains. Full graphic version has overlappings (especially mountains) that can confuse people. The parchment version looks awesome too and you are right it lacks of colour but it can be added actually and it will still could be looking as parchment. May be using some faded colours will make if more realistic?
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Meph

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #487 on: April 19, 2019, 01:27:36 pm »

A little test for snakes and worms.

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Rose

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #488 on: April 19, 2019, 02:14:46 pm »

That text is hard to read, but the snakes are great.
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Inarius

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #489 on: April 19, 2019, 03:01:37 pm »

The sea serpent is really nice !
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Cruxador

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #490 on: April 19, 2019, 03:39:55 pm »

Even the shorter giant leech looks too long and slender to be a leech. I know a giant leech is already pretty different from a normal leech, and being more slender isn't beyond the realm of realism, but I think it needs to be more recognizable as a leech. Making the colors more leech-like would help with that too.

That earthworm "mouth" doesn't look like an earthworm mouth. It's also missing its reproductive ring.

Aside from that, I'm not super sold on the shape of the heads of the big snakes (especially the python, since their actual head shape is so distinctive) and the squiggly body shape of the normal sized ones doesn't really reflect how they actually move. But it'll be pretty hard to make that look right with perspective so I dunno.
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PatrikLundell

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #491 on: April 19, 2019, 04:31:28 pm »

I've got a bit of a problem with the snake men and two of the snakes: they conjure up the image of toy ducks in my mind, with the coils underneath being the flotation part and the tongue taking the role of a (toy/cartoon) duck bill...
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Bumber

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #492 on: April 20, 2019, 08:38:40 am »

What about this level of detail?
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Meph

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #493 on: April 20, 2019, 09:00:46 am »

What about this level of detail?

Those hills and mountains are 64x64. We want to work with 16x16.

This size:
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::: ☼Meph Tileset☼☼Map Tileset☼- 32x graphic sets with TWBT :::
::: ☼MASTERWORK DF☼ - A comprehensive mod pack now on Patreon - 250.000+ downloads and counting :::
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voliol

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Re: Steam DF tileset - Mayday/Meph - Discussion and Suggestions
« Reply #494 on: April 20, 2019, 12:20:03 pm »

What are the longer/shorter snakes? Adults and children of the same species?

Also, what exactly are fire snakes? They are another weird DF creature, but according to their in-game description and raws they are made of pure fire; maybe they should look something akin to the Fire Man?
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